David Kim interview @ DH Montreal: What's the end game for…

On August 21 2016 06:00 Waxangel wrote:
a vocal minority want an utterly different game; that's not realistic at all

On August 21 2016 06:09 The_Red_Viper wrote:

"utterly different" doesn't mean anything though. It's not realistic because blizzard didn't use the two addons to try anything radical, i never played wc3 but people always tell me how different the game was after the expansion.

You can say that it's a vocal minority, but that's probably ALWAYS true for any kind of game, that doesn't mean that these other people who don't have an opinion on it wouldn't like the game better if it changed though, most "casuals" simply don't give a damn about different game design concepts, etc.

Add a real high ground advantage to sc2 right now and most people won't even notice it, that doesn't mean that the game wouldn't be better for them and people who actually care.
Same with a lot of other things. This "vocal minority" concept is nice to deny any form of discussion about issues though, i don't think it's a good way to think about the scene though.

On August 21 2016 06:35 Grumbels wrote:

Virtually every change ever happens because a vocal minority wants something. Lobbies by definition are vocal minorities and drive much progress. Most people don't care enough to investigate certain issues, so that their voice carries little power to shape outcomes.

Of course it comes in various forms and shapes, so that the situation where you have a small group of cranks perpetually whining about their unrealistic goals falls in the same category as, to pick an extreme example, civil rights activism.

Studies show that for many domains the majority opinion will typically be correct, but there are many exceptions to this. In the case of this talk about fundamental design changes it is compounded by the fact that there is partly a discussion of values taking place: what type of game do you want Starcraft 2 to be? And whose voices should carry more weight? Yet there is also an element of what empirically might be most enjoyable for most people of some group, so that expert opinion does creep in. Many that call for fundamental changes believe that everyone will benefit from them.

etc. I think it's a fairly interesting topic: when should you listen to a vocal minority?

Studies show that for many domains the majority opinion will typically be correct

On August 21 2016 06:48 Waxangel wrote:


I guess that on the other end, Blizzard's track record where they're willing to make drastic changes to "broken" games will always give fans hope that the game can change in the direction they want

On August 22 2016 05:40 Grumbels wrote:

I think it's a bit tricky, because obviously most players still left are the ones that enjoy the game. I guess this shows that when one considers majority opinions first one has to decide what group of people to listen to. And there are many such groups. And what should be the ranking? Progamers > current players > viewers > former players > casual fans > potential fans? Any discussion like that is a minefield. I sometimes think that if you don't play the game your opinion automatically should carry less weight, but at the same time I have opinions about what sort of changes would entice me to consider picking up the game again, since I haven't played LotV myself because I strongly suspected I wouldn't like it. I could understand if someone presently enjoying the gameplay would take a somewhat dismissive view of my perspective. Should Blizzard really risk potentially destructive overhauls of fundamentals only to chase after some elusive ex-player coming from a dysfunctional relationship with Starcraft 2?

On August 21 2016 12:12 RKC wrote:
So Korean pros are now the 'vocal minority'?

Plus most of the existing Korean pros come from a BW background. Arguably, it is the newer generation (i.e. ESL players) who have mostly dropped off the game, whilst KeSPA players being more resilient and staying in stronger. It's worrying that that former top players (e.g. Flash and Effort) are going back to BW, and even those who did well in SC2 (e.g. Rain and Soulkey) have given up. And worst of all, there is lack of new blood.

Meanwhile, BW is gaining back hype amongst Korean viewers.

It's quite clear that the Korean scene wants a return to a more BW-esque game play. Whether it's due to nostalgia or entertainment, it doesn't matter. They have spoken up, and the question is whether Blizzard wants to heed this 'vocal minority'.

Of course, if Blizzard wants to build the SC2 scene around WCS and international tourneys, that's purely within its prerogative (and may actually work in widening its player base and popularity). But that would bring the end to the Korean SC2 scene.