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Tchado
Jordan1831 Posts
On March 14 2015 07:26 Fecalfeast wrote: YO DREAMHON? I am also going to be watching HoN this is huge! Hell yeah man , that made my day ! I miss dreamhon , all we need now is for StayGreen to come back together which we know wont happen , Hontour teams are fun to watch these days, | ||
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BaneRiders
Sweden3630 Posts
On March 15 2015 19:59 Chaggi wrote: Yet all foreigner only tournaments get less views than ones with Korean's in it. There hasn't been a WCS or an IEM or a DH with only foreigners with the current set-up, so there is no way we can compare. WCS EU has consistently had the highest viewers of all regions the for the last 2 years, no? | ||
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Gwavajuice
France1810 Posts
On March 16 2015 01:51 BaneRiders wrote: There hasn't been a WCS or an IEM or a DH with only foreigners with the current set-up, so there is no way we can compare. WCS EU has consistently had the highest viewers of all regions the for the last 2 years, no? Alas it's true most people see Koreans as just asian people, they don't make difference between Zest and Rain, they think INnoVation is a souless robot and Soulkey a patch zerg. They need europeans or americans to cheer for, they miss Stephano, Naniwa and Idra, some may even long for Huk's come back and most of them are crying because Scarlett has retired. What they don't see is all these "foreigners" only could have success during the first 2 years of SC2 cause no foreigner can dedicate 3, 4, 5 or even 10 years to esport. And sc2 is a game that no one can master in just 2 years of progaming, they'll always be violently outclassed by Koreans who can train 12 hours a day for 4 years just to try to become a regular proleague bench guy. The amount of skill and knowledge needed for sc2 is way out of "casual pros" reach. Yes Dayshi could have been a top terran, yes Snute could win big tournaments, yes Mana, Bunny and so many others could be top tier players, but none of them will be, none of them will do, cause none of them will be able to risk their whole life on 4-6 years 100% dedicated to sc2, sacrificing studies, career, money, for what? the very unlikely possibility of winning one 25 000 $ tournament that is barely 1 year of decent living in europe? Is that a reason to hate sc2, is that a reason to hate Koreans? I love 3000m steeple chase race. Yet, only kenyans, and sometimes ethopians, can win in this sport. Does it make it a bad sport? Should I give up any interest in this sport until a blond white european start to have a chance at winning the olympics? What should I respect more, the nationnality of a sportman or his skill? | ||
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Kaewins
Bulgaria138 Posts
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virpi
Germany3599 Posts
On the other hand, SC2 is a game that needs some explaining even though most of the times it's pretty easy to see who's got an advantage. (bigger army, more bases, etc.) But often it's very hard to distinguish all the little things the pros do, especially if the casters aren't talking about those things. Casting has become a lot better in the recent 2 years, especially after the inclusion of pro players like Tod. Starcraft offers much more variety when it comes to the games itself, but this also comes with the possibility of one-sided stomps and swarm host vs. mech slugfests. But is it really a problem that other games are bigger than SC2? Of course not. We've had this discussion hundreds of times, and it's always the same circlejerk along the lines of "dead gaem" and "the koreans are evil". Why can't we just accept that SC2 is not made for the biggest audiences? All popular sports are team games. Football (both versions), basketball, volleyball, hockey...the list is long. Just take a look at the most popular individual sports: Tennis, golf, track and field all are able to attract decent numbers of people, while not being able to compete with the big team games. And it's completely fine. As long as sport is SUSTAINABLE, everything is fine. If the tournament circuit for SC2 collapses entirely and there won't be any pro gamers left, then it's really time to doom and gloom. But the whole esports industry still is in its infant stages. We might see SC2 fade away, we might also see it becoming a small, but healthy individual sport alongside the huge team games. edit: I also will never get the whole foreigners vs. koreans debate. The best players win. End of story. If they are boring robots, so be it. And lots of Koreans actually are far from being emotionless robots. Yes, it is easier to cheer for foreigners as their personality is easier to grasp. But in the end of the day, the only thing that matters to me is the quality of the games. I love watching WCS EU, but I also enjoyed IEM this weekend. Dark's ZvT was awesome, Trap's PvT also was really creative and edgy. And Zest may not be the most emotional guy under the sun, but his skill speaks for itself. He's a champion. A champion doesn't have to be a clown. Champions win tournaments. | ||
Fecalfeast
Canada11355 Posts
On March 16 2015 01:34 Tchado wrote: Hell yeah man , that made my day ! I miss dreamhon , all we need now is for StayGreen to come back together which we know wont happen , Hontour teams are fun to watch these days, is honcast still a thing? IS BREAKYCPK STILL A THING? | ||
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Eliezar
United States481 Posts
On March 16 2015 05:24 virpi wrote: Threads like these make me sad. It's not about which game is the most popular. SC2 is almost 5 years old, for a game of that age it's still doing pretty well. And LotV will definitely bring back some viewers and players. But please stop comparing team games like LoL and CS:GO to a 1v1 game like SC2. It's a completely different thing. You can go back and RTS historically hasn't had the same prestige or following as other computer game genres. Quake was giving big money pay outs in the late 90s...StarCraft came out in 98 but didn't have a big money payout until it was commercialized in Korea about 3 years after BW came out. This trend kept on going and in both starcraft and war3 it seemed there was a large segment of players that actually played the arcade style games "dota, random rpgs, madness, tower defense"...starcraft had a wide net but 1v1 starcraft was never a massive thing. When starcraft was at its peak it didn't lose players and interest to quake or counterstrike or anything like that it was Everquest...seriously whole guilds went over and many of those players never really came back. RTS hasn't ever been a huge hit on consoles...FPSrs are... As far as the wanting to watch an all Korean competition, you can see the same thing in sports...outside of the NFL most sports fans don't just watch the sport...they watch a team or players. You might watch UT in any sport...you might watch Man U...but if you are a Liverpool fan you probably don't watch Man U play...if you are an A&M fan you probably don't watch Texas. I might like watching Messi play...does that mean I'll be interested in a Champions League game between Galatasaray and Porto? People follow people for many reasons and geography tends to be one of the biggest reasons. Sure I liked watching Boxer, Idra, and Jinro in early starcraft 2, but I never was as interested in Leenock, MMA, and Jjakji. I find games with Parting, Innovation, Life, or Flash great...but half the people at IEM I couldn't care to watch..and I watched every match (I just didn't do something else while watching the series I cared about). I'm not sure why people think everybody needs to be an elitist or a front runner. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17029 Posts
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neozxa
Indonesia545 Posts
But is it really a problem that other games are bigger than SC2? Of course not. We've had this discussion hundreds of times, and it's always the same circlejerk along the lines of "dead gaem" and "the koreans are evil". Why can't we just accept that SC2 is not made for the biggest audiences? All popular sports are team games. Football (both versions), basketball, volleyball, hockey...the list is long. Just take a look at the most popular individual sports: Tennis, golf, track and field all are able to attract decent numbers of people, while not being able to compete with the big team games. And it's completely fine. As long as sport is SUSTAINABLE, everything is fine. You have to admit that Starcraft 2 WAS, once, in fact the number 1 most viewed game in twitch for quite a while, that is during the WoL days back before Queens weren't patched for no reason other than Zergs "having trouble dealing with Hellion runbys", and then things all went downhill from there. Then HoTS was released and fixed a couple of issues, and we saw the scene's resurgence for a while, then somehow the matchups became static and the metagame stopped developing for some reason, basically because people lost interest in the game despite the game had a time when it was the most viewed game in Twitch. Yes bigger competitions did appear in the esports scene. Yes MOBAs are easier to get into compared to complex, hardcore RTS games. Yes FPS games are the norm in today's gaming department. Yes RTS games are now virtually nonexistent. And yes F2P with micro transactions > P2P. Still that doesn't explain how SC2's viewer count keeps on dropping by the day and that doesn't excuse blizzard from not making this game as big as it was before back in 2011. CS:GO used to be one of the underdog games in the esports scene, but Valve showed that they cared for their game and now its one of the most viewed games on twitch. Almost in par with LoL even. http://www.pcgamesn.com/counter-strike-global-offensive/how-counter-strike-global-offensive-is-turning-into-the-worlds-most-exciting-esport But instead of taking matters into their own hands, they decide to let things the way they are as if there was no problems in the game at all. I don't see maphackers and cheaters get banned. I'm not seeing them fixing the esports scene and WCS. Even though they are working on the next expansion that doesn't mean that they should neglect this game enitrely. Yes they are testing flying locusts and tempests on their test maps. I bet that they're going to release them a day before LoTV is launched lol. They're probably going to just wash their hands clean on the next expansion and focus on other, more "community appealing" games such as Heroes of the Storm and Hearthstone, and they need to, if they want their company to survive. Cause I don't see much value in milkin out from SC2 anymore. /rant | ||
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Tchado
Jordan1831 Posts
On March 16 2015 06:56 Fecalfeast wrote: is honcast still a thing? IS BREAKYCPK STILL A THING? yeah Breaky still casts  | ||
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