Everything was looking good for Flash. He was 65-17 from July to the end of August. 79.27% in win rate against some of the best in the world. The current map pool has some of the best maps Terrans have had since the release of HotS. He then won Proleague Finals. He won IEM Toronto. He got into the easiest group in the ro16 after bribing Innovation with a meal. He even had a few days of rest from getting back from Toronto before he had to play his ro16 against all Zerg players: TRUE, soO, and DRG. On top of that Flash had only lost one series to Zerg in the past two months (to Action). All told everything was going right for Flash. Just the sheer momentum alone should have easily carried Flash to the quarterfinals. Should have.
The fans, the spectators, the players, the casters all expected Flash to just crush this group. In his first series of the day he built on those expectations by smashing TRUE, crushing him into the ground with a 11/11 and an early hellbat marine banshee timing. He had all of the hype in the world following him into that winner’s match, and the Winners' Match seemed like a formality.
The man in the other booth was the complete opposite. soO had no hype. He wasn’t one of the greats of SC2, he wasn’t called God and he hadn’t won an IEM just five days earlier. He had no legacy (E/N: beyond his uncanny ability to lose to Protoss Royal Roaders), no greatness attached to his name except the one he made for himself by cutting his way to the finals three times in the hardest tournament on earth. Yet even after 3 consecutive GSL Finals, soO still can’t drum up a fraction of the hype Flash got for winning IEM. But this was all old hat for soO. Not being the fan favorite, not expected to win, always expected to lose in the finals. None of that matters because this was the fourth season in a row it has happened to soO. So when it came down to soO vs Flash in the winners match, soO forced Flash and the rest of the world to recognize one fact: you don’t get to 3 consecutive GSL Finals by just collecting bottle caps.
Down to 29 drones after an extremely strong opening from Flash, soO should have been done. And if he had been any other Zerg he probably would have been. But soO fought back and Flash stayed on the creep for exactly one second before being bum rushed and forced out by soO. From there soO abused Flash’s weakness to counter attack style muta ling/bling play and was able to crush Flash’s economy. With no choice left, Flash went for the all-in, but even up 40 supply he was unable to crack soO’s impenetrable defense.
Game 2 was arguably went even worse for soO. While he didn’t lose 29 drones, he lost his fourth base easily on Merry Go Round and was forced to stay on lair tech on 3 bases against the 4 of Flash. Yet time after time after time, soO kept holding and holding and holding until he was actually up on bases. Despite that insane defense, soO overcommitted too deeply off creep and was caught out and crushed.
Game 3 was the real test. Flash was unable to do any real damage to soO early on and both went to the late macro game. But Flash stepped onto the creep for a small period of time and was instantly crushed as soO won the engagement in a landslide and rode it all the way back to Flash’s production instantly killing Flash.
soO proved that Flash wasn’t infallible in the late game. He proved that he wasn’t untouchable in the macro game, an idea that has seems to have taken root in a lot of players of late. He proved that in a battle of pure mechanics, soO was easily a match. soO let Flash play his best game in his best style, and he beat him. But if if soO beat Flash mechanically, then DRG - traditionally the poster boy of mechanics - beat Flash strategically.
In the last match of the day DRG and Flash took it to a macro game on Overgrowth where DRG used a very foreign style of ZvT as he went muta ling/bling into Swarmhosts. Because of that Flash was able to get around him and do massive damage to DRG’s natural and eventually put DRG in economic checkmate. Game two was theoretically interesting*, but it ultimately came down to DRG abusing Flash for having bad simcity.
If games one and two were worrying for Flash fans, game three was where DRG completely outdid Flash for playing like a robot. DRG opened with fast speed on one base because he knew that Flash would not scout with his reaper, and was able to punish Flash for playing blindly. Unfortunately for DRG, he overmade lings allowing the game to be mostly even. DRG then closed out the game with a strong counter attack to Flash’s third and Flash in typical Flash fashion responded to the aggression by attacking himself but was easily held off by DRG’s superior defense.
Born on a Monday. Won Proleague on a Tuesday. Won GSL ro32 on a Wednesday. Flew to Toronto on a Thursday. Won IEM Toronto on a Friday Killed by soO on a Saturday Buried by DRG on a Sunday
Other notes:
DRG used two very different strategies in game 1 and game 3. Game 2 was even stranger when you consider that Zergs favor Deadwing in ZvT, yet DRG chose Catellina. DRG may have had a pre-prepared build, but upon seeing the terrible wall at Flash’s natural may have decided to change his plans altogether. DRG scouted the problem in Flash’s wall at 8:01 when the cc first starts building. By 8:40 he had speedlings just outside the vision range of the wall just waiting. He does not move in until the vikings scouts the overlord over the natural at 10:00. At the same time Flash’s units are at the furthest point possible away from the natural harassing DRG’s third. At this point he move commands his lings past the wall ( confirming he knew about the weakness in the wall since the beginning). Given Flash’s tendencies to attack when being attacked, DRG then spawns and rallies his lings to behind his natural, moves his drones out the third and moves his mass queen force and spine crawler to the third creating the perfect form of offense and defense.
ZvZ went exactly as the match history indicates. soO > DRG (now 6-0) and DRG > TRUE (now 4-0).
Despite the fans hyping Flash as possibly the best player in SC2 throughout multiple points in HotS, he has yet to make it out of the ro16. This is eerily reminiscent of when Artosis hyped Clide as the very best in early WoL and yet Clide was never able to break past the ro16. To make this even stranger, Clide was hired by KT to be their coach from 2012-2013.
That game 2 was awesome, DRG played Flash like a fiddle. I love how he identified the poor simcity, waited for the perfect opportunity and then knew exactly how Flash would react. It's fun to have such a chain of events unfold where one player has planned so many moves ahead of the other.
On September 07 2014 07:09 Grumbels wrote: I'm so sad about these results, now we can't have soO play a protoss in the finals. Why did he have to beat Flash and ruin the pattern?
On September 07 2014 07:09 Grumbels wrote: I'm so sad about these results, now we can't have soO play a protoss in the finals. Why did he have to beat Flash and ruin the pattern?
But he's not going to play Zergs first time in 4 bracket stage runs, only P up to finals and then DRG again. Funnily enough, only Protoss soO had faced in GSL playoffs is PartinG until next-next week.
If soO is going to lose to DRG in the finals, i will truly believe in Mvp curse or other shit. Rain-soO might be sickest PvZ every played in HotS if it happens though.
Also, worth noting that finals are now Telecom vs non-Telecom confirmed, if INnoVation not going to join T1 or DRG not going to join KT before finals.
On September 07 2014 07:09 NotSorry wrote: All it took was one less than perfect split from Flash vs banelings and soo steamrolled him from a game that should have been impossible to win.
Despite the flash hype I was heavily expecting SoO to beat him considering all those finals vs what flash's gsl results have tended towards, but I was not expecting DRG to beat him. Flash really should have walled off better.
On September 07 2014 07:24 Silvana wrote: Aw cmon guys, with the streak Flash put since Proleague finals it was impossible to not hype him.
I might be missing data/stats but do you anti-hype Cure too who is considered by many a contender for the Championship because his recent hot streak?
Edit: by "guys" I don't mean OP, I mean whoever considers him/herself in the anti-Flash-hype-train
I wasn't really that much hyped about his IEM performance. He almost lost to Snute in the ro8 who isn't as good as any of the zerg players in that group. I mean, I still predicted him to go through after soO , but he didn't look unstoppable at all with his TvZ. Also he dropped a series to MC, whom most people say that he would be stuck in code A if he played GSL.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
You must not be familiar with DRG's ZvT. He didn't even bring his A-game and he still won xD
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
This is probably just a sad attempt to troll, but just in case, you are actually serious. DRG has a winning record vs Innovation (who is in the ro8). DRG eliminated Solar from RBBG Global. Solar is also in the GSL ro8. DRG just knocked out last seasons semi-finlaist TRUE and IEM champion Flash.
If you seriously think, DRG is a Dishwasher, you are incredibly uneducated about the game.
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
but it wasn't, and if you read the write up, you would've known that DRG scouted that fuck up way before his attack. aka he would've played the game vastly different if flash hadn't made such a grievious mistake.
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
The salt is unreal. If Flash just beats soO he goes to Ro8 but he didn't cause he isn't good enough for Ro8. And that is all there is to it.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
If you lose to anyone you're not going to be a champion period. DRG is better than your false God.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
Geez. DRG did not go "Foreign Style ZvT" (apparently meant for his production of Swarm Hosts) Flash had one point majority of his army consisting of Thors and Hellbats, which made DRG believe Flash was switching to mech. That is why he produced Swarm Hosts. That was a misread by DRG, not him trying out a different style. (Nothing wrong with trying out different strats or Swarm Hosts, I just think that observation is wrong.)
If you watch the game you can see that he produced 12 Swarm Hosts in the mid game and never reproduced them again. He simply kept them alive for a long time.
FlaSh got outplayed today, but it's not that big a deal. He has still been looking fantastic for the last couple of months and I don't think he'll suddenly just drop back to being a 'good' Terran.
If he carries this form into next year he'll do faaaaar better. Even the best players can't win every match. soO is just a monster and DRG simply read FlaSh too well.
The price for Toronto has been payed. Couldn't belief that Flash played like he did in Toronto. But he did almost make it after so many games to study were out there. Of course the patch acclimatisation is still running, but pretty impressive by him nevertheless. Still a long way to go to become the most figured out person in Sc2 and still win achievement. (Well you kinda have to go to more tournaments for that anyway)
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
I don't think flash lost in a way that was like "wow this guy is actually medicore, he didn't really stand a chance and his overall play isn't up to the ro8". But a loss is a loss, there were a number of chances or things that could have gone differently, but if Flash really is as good as everyone says it wouldn't have mattered. I do think that not making widow mines was wrong considering the number of banelings.
soO deserves ro8 though, no doubt. And I'm happy that DRG is getting this shot, it might have "saved" his career. I don't think either one is going much further though. soO's ZvP isn't up to the 3 Protoss on his side of the bracket, and I think DRG will struggle more against Innovation's style compared to Flash.
On September 07 2014 09:19 usethis2 wrote: Geez. DRG did not go "Foreign Style ZvT" (apparently meant for his production of Swarm Hosts) Flash had one point majority of his army consisting of Thors and Hellbats, which made DRG believe Flash was switching to mech. That is why he produced Swarm Hosts. That was a misread by DRG, not him trying out a different style. (Nothing wrong with trying out different strats or Swarm Hosts, I just think that observation is wrong.)
If you watch the game you can see that he produced 12 Swarm Hosts in the mid game and never reproduced them again. He simply kept them alive for a long time.
Edit: I am talking about the game 1.
I'm not certain. We look at the way Flash has played TvZ in the last 2 weeks and we see mass bio with thor hellbat. Would DRG really think it was mech at that point despite having done enough scouting to know flash opens reaper first without scouting into cc on Merry Go Round? And doing multiple run-bys into Flash's natural and see bio units?
I don't think so. On top of that DRG is in contact with Catz as far as I know and does have a lot of respect for foreign players so he could have easily decided to pick this up and try it in g1.
On September 07 2014 09:36 Phredxor wrote: FlaSh got outplayed today, but it's not that big a deal. He has still been looking fantastic for the last couple of months and I don't think he'll suddenly just drop back to being a 'good' Terran.
I am not sure if outplayed is the right expression. He won 2-0 Had a tough time vs soO who came back after that awesome opening from flash, who maybe was overeager, or I don't know how you come back after almost 30 drone loss in the earlygame. Took a lot of good engagements but fell to sometimes even desperate counter-attacks.
Seeing this over and over again (not defending well sometimes, even at IEM vs Taeja he almost lost vs the constant runbys from Tajea), I feel this is his greatest weakness. The series vs soO and DRG were close, I don't think he got outplayed. I still don't like the effectiveness of just spamming lots of banelings vs him trying to to position himself perfectly with marine, marauder, hellbats, thors and medivacs but well, he should have known to not take some fights I guess. It's not like he did have to prepare for 3 races to play against, maybe his TvZ got figured out, cause he was doing well lately but playing pretty "standard".
On September 07 2014 07:24 Silvana wrote: Aw cmon guys, with the streak Flash put since Proleague finals it was impossible to not hype him.
I might be missing data/stats but do you anti-hype Cure too who is considered by many a contender for the Championship because his recent hot streak?
Edit: by "guys" I don't mean OP, I mean whoever considers him/herself in the anti-Flash-hype-train
I wasn't really that much hyped about his IEM performance. He almost lost to Snute in the ro8 who isn't as good as any of the zerg players in that group. I mean, I still predicted him to go through after soO , but he didn't look unstoppable at all with his TvZ. Also he dropped a series to MC, whom most people say that he would be stuck in code A if he played GSL.
U must be trolling right? I quote from the text for you
He was 65-17 from July to the end of August. 79.27% in win rate against some of the best in the world.
Did you see who he beat at IEM? Your whole "I am not impressed" is based around the game against tha best foreigner Zerg at the moment? Snute just beat Jaedong 2-0 in http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/466325-wec-2014 Jaedong may not be the best Zerg atm, but his ZvZ was always pretty good, he had winrates above 80% in that matchup a couple of months ago. And while I was not particularly impressed by the Series vs Snute, he showed that he was clearly better. While the 2-0 lead of snute was kinda all-inish, you also have to think of the EU players most of the time being a little bit ahead of the current meta sometimes and that Snute played a completely new style vs Flash, he may not know how to break it (yet). Even QXC admitted, that it has yet to be seen how you can break snutes lategame TvZ. The Snute that killed CJ Entuses Hero over and over again. And many others. So it's more impressive if you think flash managed to adapt to snutes maybe completely different to what he was used playstyle within 2 games. Also Snute played pretty aggressive, and to allins even the best players fall from time to time Just look up who Flash beat the last couple of weeks or just at IEM, if you say you are not impressed, you are just trolling and provoking those who cheered for flash.
Which is something I don't get: being happy for "your" favorite to advance - fine. Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
On September 07 2014 09:19 usethis2 wrote: Geez. DRG did not go "Foreign Style ZvT" (apparently meant for his production of Swarm Hosts) Flash had one point majority of his army consisting of Thors and Hellbats, which made DRG believe Flash was switching to mech. That is why he produced Swarm Hosts. That was a misread by DRG, not him trying out a different style. (Nothing wrong with trying out different strats or Swarm Hosts, I just think that observation is wrong.)
If you watch the game you can see that he produced 12 Swarm Hosts in the mid game and never reproduced them again. He simply kept them alive for a long time.
Edit: I am talking about the game 1.
I'm not certain. We look at the way Flash has played TvZ in the last 2 weeks and we see mass bio with thor hellbat. Would DRG really think it was mech at that point despite having done enough scouting to know flash opens reaper first without scouting into cc on Merry Go Round? And doing multiple run-bys into Flash's natural and see bio units?
I don't think so. On top of that DRG is in contact with Catz as far as I know and does have a lot of respect for foreign players so he could have easily decided to pick this up and try it in g1.
Yeah I agree. That was just a standard game from FlaSh and i'm sure DRG knew it, he was just attempting the Snute style SH transition for whatever reason.
Mech seems to have pretty much died off again. Unless you're Bbyong trying it vs P.
On September 07 2014 11:06 Iodem wrote: if Flash wins kespa cup is he guaranteed a spot at blizzcon or is it still uncertain?
Flash is currently at 1475 WCS points. Kespa Cup offers 1500 points for 1st place.
He'd then be at 2975 which is very good considering the cutoff is around 2300 atm. No guarantee but I'd project him to be very competitive in that scenario.
WCS, DH: Moscow, Redbull Finals are out of reach for him but DH Stockholm could further change a few things provided he attends.
So if he gets 2nd he would only need ~200. Couldn't he go to DH?
You're not taking into account that Flash already has 250 WCS Points from KeSPA Cup, so if he gets 2nd then he doesn't gain 800 points he only gains 550. So if he gets 2nd in KeSPA Cup and then goes to and wins DreamHack Stockholm then he's at 2,775 WCS Points
~ 26.36 % of the time 2,775 points is enough to qualify for Blizzcon
So yes he still has a chance if he gets 2nd at KeSPA Cup, that's why WCS Predictor gives him ~ 0.68 % chances if he gets 2nd place, because if he then goes on to win DH Stockholm he then has about 26% chances. But he isn't even confirmed to be going to DH Stockholm yet, if he confirms that he is attending then it will boost his chances on WCS Predictor.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
This is probably just a sad attempt to troll, but just in case, you are actually serious. DRG has a winning record vs Innovation (who is in the ro8). DRG eliminated Solar from RBBG Global. Solar is also in the GSL ro8. DRG just knocked out last seasons semi-finlaist TRUE and IEM champion Flash.
If you seriously think, DRG is a Dishwasher, you are incredibly uneducated about the game.
DRG one of the absolute best at Starcraft in history, up there with old 3 of wings Polt Taeja MMA Life Stephano
On September 07 2014 09:19 usethis2 wrote: Geez. DRG did not go "Foreign Style ZvT" (apparently meant for his production of Swarm Hosts) Flash had one point majority of his army consisting of Thors and Hellbats, which made DRG believe Flash was switching to mech. That is why he produced Swarm Hosts. That was a misread by DRG, not him trying out a different style. (Nothing wrong with trying out different strats or Swarm Hosts, I just think that observation is wrong.)
If you watch the game you can see that he produced 12 Swarm Hosts in the mid game and never reproduced them again. He simply kept them alive for a long time.
Edit: I am talking about the game 1.
I'm not certain. We look at the way Flash has played TvZ in the last 2 weeks and we see mass bio with thor hellbat. Would DRG really think it was mech at that point despite having done enough scouting to know flash opens reaper first without scouting into cc on Merry Go Round? And doing multiple run-bys into Flash's natural and see bio units?
I don't think so. On top of that DRG is in contact with Catz as far as I know and does have a lot of respect for foreign players so he could have easily decided to pick this up and try it in g1.
He does, probably the korean who has the most admitted respect for foreigners in general, but mainly HuK and Scarlett if I remember correctly(cause he said HuK was best foreigner and he is now 2 and 2 with scarlett the 1st 2 times at IPL 4 the 3 at an ATC Finals, Scarlett tied it up at Anaheim)
On September 07 2014 11:06 Iodem wrote: if Flash wins kespa cup is he guaranteed a spot at blizzcon or is it still uncertain?
Flash is currently at 1475 WCS points. Kespa Cup offers 1500 points for 1st place.
He'd then be at 2975 which is very good considering the cutoff is around 2300 atm. No guarantee but I'd project him to be very competitive in that scenario.
WCS, DH: Moscow, Redbull Finals are out of reach for him but DH Stockholm could further change a few things provided he attends.
He can only get 1250 from kespa cup, which lands him behind jjakji and ahead of soo Then he has to pray for a lot of players to fail hard
Winning one round in kespa cup earns you 400 points, which is enough for classic, soo, sos to overcome him Cj hero needs 2 wins there Then you have rain and soo still alive in the gsl Pigbaby and violet alive in wcs am Mma, forgg going far in wcs europe is bad to him too
Random people out of the top16 (like scarllet, innovation, liquid hero) winning season 3 also surpass him
If he really wants to secure blizzcon, he has to go to dreamhack stockholm
On September 07 2014 09:19 usethis2 wrote: Geez. DRG did not go "Foreign Style ZvT" (apparently meant for his production of Swarm Hosts) Flash had one point majority of his army consisting of Thors and Hellbats, which made DRG believe Flash was switching to mech. That is why he produced Swarm Hosts. That was a misread by DRG, not him trying out a different style. (Nothing wrong with trying out different strats or Swarm Hosts, I just think that observation is wrong.)
If you watch the game you can see that he produced 12 Swarm Hosts in the mid game and never reproduced them again. He simply kept them alive for a long time.
Edit: I am talking about the game 1.
I'm not certain. We look at the way Flash has played TvZ in the last 2 weeks and we see mass bio with thor hellbat. Would DRG really think it was mech at that point despite having done enough scouting to know flash opens reaper first without scouting into cc on Merry Go Round? And doing multiple run-bys into Flash's natural and see bio units?
I don't think so. On top of that DRG is in contact with Catz as far as I know and does have a lot of respect for foreign players so he could have easily decided to pick this up and try it in g1.
Yeah I agree. That was just a standard game from FlaSh and i'm sure DRG knew it, he was just attempting the Snute style SH transition for whatever reason.
Mech seems to have pretty much died off again. Unless you're Bbyong trying it vs P.
I am fairly certain this was what had triggered SHs from DRG. Flash also had a foward factory producing Thors. There have been several games that Terran tech-switching Bio to Mech and vice versa in Proleague.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
I am happy for soOjwa (srsly so fucking good) and DongRaeGu finally starting to get back to the top! (Makes me sad he doesnt want to play in PL anymore ) but dammit Flash this was THE group to do it and you still fell short
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
Every time Flash makes it into the round of 16 I'm like yes, this will be the season, and subscribe. Then he gets knocked out and I feel like I've wasted $20. And all because there was one small gap in his buildings...
On September 07 2014 07:09 Kasaraki wrote: That game 2 was awesome, DRG played Flash like a fiddle. I love how he identified the poor simcity, waited for the perfect opportunity and then knew exactly how Flash would react. It's fun to have such a chain of events unfold where one player has planned so many moves ahead of the other.
You've gotta be kidding me. DRG is a terrible fiddler. He was the one getting played. Lost 4 overlords early, had his creep spread completely shut down and just got lucky that Flash misplaced his CC by a hex and won off that advantage (despite shit play vs mines).
On September 07 2014 07:09 Kasaraki wrote: Flash with that Clide curse. May it last forever.
That game 2 was awesome, DRG played Flash like a fiddle. I love how he identified the poor simcity, waited for the perfect opportunity and then knew exactly how Flash would react. It's fun to have such a chain of events unfold where one player has planned so many moves ahead of the other.
If by "played Flash like a fiddle" you mean "was getting completely wrecked and was extremely lucky that Flash made such a huge mistake," then sure.
On September 07 2014 15:27 GolemMadness wrote: Every time Flash makes it into the round of 16 I'm like yes, this will be the season, and subscribe. Then he gets knocked out and I feel like I've wasted $20. And all because there was one small gap in his buildings...
Same there :/ Hopefully Cure or Bogus ends up in finals, or even semis.
On September 07 2014 07:39 Trustworthy-Tony wrote: If you're losing to DRG, you're not a worthy champion anyway. Let's hope Flash gets his shit together and stops losing to dishwashers.
This is probably just a sad attempt to troll, but just in case, you are actually serious. DRG has a winning record vs Innovation (who is in the ro8). DRG eliminated Solar from RBBG Global. Solar is also in the GSL ro8. DRG just knocked out last seasons semi-finlaist TRUE and IEM champion Flash.
If you seriously think, DRG is a Dishwasher, you are incredibly uneducated about the game.
DRG one of the absolute best at Starcraft in history, up there with old 3 of wings Polt Taeja MMA Life Stephano
Don't tell me, I am a supporter of the one true dong. I was just preventing dumb "everything more than 4 months old doesn't count" arguemnts by using recent results.
On September 07 2014 16:50 bo1b wrote: I want drg to beat innovation, but I think innovation vs soo is the best possible finals we can have. Such a conundrum.
I think an OSL finals rematch would be pretty nice as well. Not only would it give DRG a chance of revenge, but it also severely improves Rains chances to go to Blizzcon.
On September 07 2014 07:09 Kasaraki wrote: Flash with that Clide curse. May it last forever.
That game 2 was awesome, DRG played Flash like a fiddle. I love how he identified the poor simcity, waited for the perfect opportunity and then knew exactly how Flash would react. It's fun to have such a chain of events unfold where one player has planned so many moves ahead of the other.
If by "played Flash like a fiddle" you mean "was getting completely wrecked and was extremely lucky that Flash made such a huge mistake," then sure.
Both of these are exaggerations. I think DRG either noticed the bad sim at the last minute, or was just waiting to do a standard run-by.
On the flip side, I wouldn't say DRG was getting wrecked at all. Flash reduced the creep and got some overlords off the back of a more aggressive opening, but he really wasn't putting a dent in DRG. His 3rd orbital was just morphing while DRG had a saturated 3rd, was way ahead on 1/1, had a spire and bane nest morphing, and retained 4 additional queens for defense and creep. I'd say DRG was ahead even. In addition, he lost all the hellions and even the medivac full of marines while DRG was doing a counter attack with all of his lings for a mere 11 drones or so.
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
On September 07 2014 18:52 Pucca wrote: Flash continues to suck
Since when is Code S ro16 sucking? Do Maru, Soulkey, sOs and Parting also suck in your opinion? He's not the "god", his hype train claims him to be, but he is certainly not sucking either.
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
agree
well but he did fail to wall-in in Code S ro16 lol
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
agree
well but he did fail to wall-in in Code S ro16 lol
The funny thing is that sOs was also knocked out because he can't make a wall. Lesson number one from the zerg handbook: know the enemy wall better than the enemy
On September 07 2014 07:16 Lunareste wrote: So bullshit Flash vs DRG game 2, if that entrance was blocked AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN then DRG would have lost
agree
well but he did fail to wall-in in Code S ro16 lol
I mean, walling in is really important. it's something he should practice if he is missing it every now and then
On September 07 2014 15:27 GolemMadness wrote: Every time Flash makes it into the round of 16 I'm like yes, this will be the season, and subscribe. Then he gets knocked out and I feel like I've wasted $20. And all because there was one small gap in his buildings...
Same there :/ Hopefully Cure or Bogus ends up in finals, or even semis.
On September 07 2014 07:09 Kasaraki wrote: Flash with that Clide curse. May it last forever.
That game 2 was awesome, DRG played Flash like a fiddle. I love how he identified the poor simcity, waited for the perfect opportunity and then knew exactly how Flash would react. It's fun to have such a chain of events unfold where one player has planned so many moves ahead of the other.
If by "played Flash like a fiddle" you mean "was getting completely wrecked and was extremely lucky that Flash made such a huge mistake," then sure.
Both of these are exaggerations. I think DRG either noticed the bad sim at the last minute, or was just waiting to do a standard run-by.
On the flip side, I wouldn't say DRG was getting wrecked at all. Flash reduced the creep and got some overlords off the back of a more aggressive opening, but he really wasn't putting a dent in DRG. His 3rd orbital was just morphing while DRG had a saturated 3rd, was way ahead on 1/1, had a spire and bane nest morphing, and retained 4 additional queens for defense and creep. I'd say DRG was ahead even. In addition, he lost all the hellions and even the medivac full of marines while DRG was doing a counter attack with all of his lings for a mere 11 drones or so.
Nah you're wrong, delaying a 3rd so you can go 1/1/1 and kill 3 overlords with it, then make a viking to kill another overlord is clearly good enough to make up for delaying a 3rd vs 3hatch drg.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Highly doubtable, the situation is totally different. If you teach these kids, you know them personally and you are able to contact their parents if they are to annoying. Also not only are you a person of respect for them, but also you probably grade them, so it is their best intrest to be viewed in a positive light by you.
Unfortunately, that isn't the case here. Here we are anonymus, here you can't call swag_bros mother to express your worries about his behaviour and here you are not able to rate TheAnarchy's poor posting standarts. Who knows, maybe one of them is sitting in the parliament or the board of a big company. Maybe even in one of your classes. The behaviour of known and unknown people can not be compared.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Considering the amount of daily users TeamLiquid has, isn't there the possibility that it is the same ratio? Just saying.
On September 07 2014 10:54 Miscellany wrote: I don't think flash lost in a way that was like "wow this guy is actually medicore, he didn't really stand a chance and his overall play isn't up to the ro8". But a loss is a loss, there were a number of chances or things that could have gone differently, but if Flash really is as good as everyone says it wouldn't have mattered. I do think that not making widow mines was wrong considering the number of banelings.
soO deserves ro8 though, no doubt. And I'm happy that DRG is getting this shot, it might have "saved" his career. I don't think either one is going much further though. soO's ZvP isn't up to the 3 Protoss on his side of the bracket, and I think DRG will struggle more against Innovation's style compared to Flash.
Lel, please. Both can easily end up in the finals, it's just sick misbelief that soO's ZvP ain't one of the best on planet because, well, he lost 3 finals to Protosses with combined score as 7-12. Even with Stats's current form in PvZ, soO can take it easily, if no greedy spires, against Zest it might be tricky but Zest is very predictable in PvZ, so if soO prepares well, he should take it and Rain, well, he knows Rain from inside after all those years in same team, lol.
And DRG ZvT is nothing to be shame of either + Solar's ZvZ ain't something to be scared of as well, especially when he beat him just few weeks ago multiple times throughout the weekend.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Highly doubtable, the situation is totally different. If you teach these kids, you know them personally and you are able to contact their parents if they are to annoying. Also not only are you a person of respect for them, but also you probably grade them, so it is their best intrest to be viewed in a positive light by you.
I find it highly intriguing that you think you know how I teach. Because you are plain wrong about that, I let the kids be how they are. My approach is that I prevent doing all the things that I hated about school, make it fun and interesting. The kids sometimes shout at each other and pretty much behave as If I am not there. Their behavior also has no influx on their grades, only their actual work output does. So, the can do all kinds of stuff they like to do, as long as when the deadline is here, they have to send me their work (which they can make at home, if they are to busy being stupid with each other). I only interfere if there is too much of aggression or stupidness going on, meaning, before it gets out of control. I pretty often make a fool of myself and let them make a fool of myself. They know the limit of course, but I don't actually stop them from being an asshole. But if they are, I try to engage some self-reflexion, to make sure it doesn't happen again. No punishment either by me or by the resulting grade. And yeah, they are mean to each other a lot, that is how kids are. But none of them is stupid, and antisocial enough to have fun over the other one being sad. NONE of them. You can doupt that, but you just draw conclusions from you on others. Maybe your assumptions are based on the style or "method" teached on your school, which doesn't necessary make it a good school or good example here, as "traditional" teaching as you may know it, is way outdated and are a combination of methods written back in the 17th century, while I teach the kids after a "person centered approach", where I am not the teacher, but more a coach or a mentor. I do that part wrong I guess, the kids see me more as a friend, instead of coming late they always come early, rush in and tell my their latest stories or ask me some love/relationship advice and so on, or if there are conflicts I try to resolve them... THEN I try to jump into teaching them a little bit here and there Basically I try to teach them so they have fun with it and so it lasts several years, not just until the next written exam. Laughing is a big part, the days are rare I don't have a stomachache from laughing when I come home. Fun side beside the fun, is that it keeps me fit somehow
On September 07 2014 22:54 Xoronius wrote: Unfortunately, that isn't the case here. Here we are anonymus, here you can't call swag_bros mother to express your worries about his behaviour and here you are not able to rate TheAnarchy's poor posting standarts. Who knows, maybe one of them is sitting in the parliament or the board of a big company. Maybe even in one of your classes. The behaviour of known and unknown people can not be compared.
I do a lot of anonymus things with them (feedback and so on), they know how to be smart, not stupid and antisocial, believe me. Just because it didn't happen at your school doesn't mean it happens everywhere, there are many very self reflected young people out there, if the parents or teachers make it happen and trigger this behavior. Actually 90% of the kids don't do things to others they wouldn't want to witness themself (at least not over a long period of time, some of them jokingly do it, but that's ok). The other 10% that are antisocial are basically most of the times the ones that don't advance in our school anyways, because... well being social also has to do with intelligence and motivation at working on your personal skills.
So enough offtopic, if you wanna continue, feel free to PM
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Put your gifted rich kids on the internet and see if 'such a behavior' happens. If you're naive enough to think how a teenager behaves in a classroom remotely compares to how they behave anonymously on public forums... you should probably stick to teaching the "less than average" kids.
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Put your gifted rich kids on the internet and see if 'such a behavior' happens. If you're naive enough to think how a teenager behaves in a classroom remotely compares to how they behave anonymously on public forums... you should probably stick to teaching the "less than average" kids.
No. God is a lame nickname regardless of skill. Bergkamp was called god. One of the most skillful footballers of all time but of all his nicknames (he had many) this was by far the lamest. It's unimaginative and unoriginal (many people in many sports were called it). It has no connection to the person besides being believed the best at the time. It has the silly super hero comic book over the topness in it. It's bleh. Unfortunately the damage has been done; Nicknames can't be controlled, Artosis can call his pylon "Incontrol" a milion times, it's still going to be the Artosis Pylon. So I just have to cope with it. :/
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Put your gifted rich kids on the internet and see if 'such a behavior' happens. If you're naive enough to think how a teenager behaves in a classroom remotely compares to how they behave anonymously on public forums... you should probably stick to teaching the "less than average" kids.
Put your jelly behavior beside. Neither of them is rich, most of them actually are very poor, some are asylants, one of my "best" for instance is a kid kid that was forced to watch when his parents got shot, another one is from iran, learning the "so hard language" german in 5 years completely fluent, if you speak to him you won't notice an accent. It's the opposite: they are NOT rich and gifted, so they value education, frendship and stable social environment more then the "rich kids on the internet" front. Also I know every of their facebook/whatsapp/twitter accounts, as part of teaching them about privacy on the internet, they showed me everything they put on the internet.
So you better stop telling me what to do when you don't even know what I am doing. And to teach the "less intelligent then average kids" we have special personnel/teachers for that, I wouldn't be suited for that. Also I teach in a big city, where the schools for the "more than average" kids, teach them less, then "normal" schools on the countryside (because the kids to teacher population is higher) But on teaching the "more then average city-dids" That being said, I work with legasthenic, autistic and other forms of "handicapped" kids. So what now? Should I cure ebola? Or what is the next thing you want to tell me to help society? Better start with yourself I guess, then you can teach me what to do. As a start, you should not tell me how I do my job, when you don't know how I actually do it.
And I repeat: this is OT, you better write me an Email, i can send you thousands of pages of teaching theory and practical articles about it, so you try it yourself and be a better teacher then the others. But I liked your first input to the topic: "No that can't be, everyone is retarded" instead of "glad that your approach works, maybe not everything is wrong with the youth nowadays"
1 - Flash is surely one of the best terrans atm, but he's not dominating the game, even if he was on a good streak. Plenty of players had this kind of 2 months streak in the past. Doesn't mean much really.
2 - It is vastely disrepecting soO to not ackowledge that he's the most consitent Zerg in the world and that Flash was not expected to crush him at all.
On September 08 2014 02:31 Gwavajuice wrote: Nice article but a bit too exagerated IMHO.
1 - Flash is surely one of the best terrans atm, but he's not dominating the game, even if he was on a good streak. Plenty of players had this kind of 2 months streak in the past. Doesn't mean much really.
2 - It is vastely disrepecting soO to not ackowledge that he's the most consitent Zerg in the world and that Flash was not expected to crush him at all.
Actually the PvZ flood or PVZcraft didn't help the reputation of the players, no matter how good they were. Even though I follow SC2 since the beginning, soOs I wasn't aware of how good soOs performance actually was the last GSLs. I am well aware of how good he actually plays, but it wasn't until the game vs flash started that I realized that he was in 3 GSL finals in a row or so. Basically this is of course my fault for not paying attention to his games, but because basically Terran was patched out of the game prior to the recent patch, I got tired of watching Starcraft 2 which really was 90% PVZ or mirrors (even more boring to me), and actually stopped following it a bit. Maybe it is ALSO because of that, that Flash has so much hype around him: he seemed to be the savoir of terran. And that even without widow mines. But tunred out the he should have used the "random luck unit" WM in his matches, not just the complex to handle Marine, Marauder, Hellbat, thor, Medivac composition...
On September 07 2014 07:02 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Im getting tired of this fake God called Flash.
He was a "god" in BW. I wonder why people still call him god in sc2 though. He is very good but not comparable to his skill in bw.
Same reason people called Bisu the Revolutionist or Boxer the Emperor. Nicknames stick, especially when they're good or catchy.
You think "god" is a good nickname? Bleh..
You'd agree if you'd watched him in his prime.
On September 07 2014 22:33 Rollora wrote:
On September 07 2014 13:42 Phredxor wrote:
On September 07 2014 12:50 Rollora wrote:
On September 07 2014 11:51 Shellshock wrote:
On September 07 2014 11:27 Darkhorse wrote:
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Put your gifted rich kids on the internet and see if 'such a behavior' happens. If you're naive enough to think how a teenager behaves in a classroom remotely compares to how they behave anonymously on public forums... you should probably stick to teaching the "less than average" kids.
No. God is a lame nickname regardless of skill. Bergkamp was called god. One of the most skillful footballers of all time but of all his nicknames (he had many) this was by far the lamest. It's unimaginative and unoriginal (many people in many sports were called it). It has no connection to the person besides being believed the best at the time. It has the silly super hero comic book over the topness in it. It's bleh. Unfortunately the damage has been done; Nicknames can't be controlled, Artosis can call his pylon "Incontrol" a milion times, it's still going to be the Artosis Pylon. So I just have to cope with it. :/
While I agree, that god is a lame nickname by itself, Flash still has "The ultimate Weapon", which is pretty cool. If I would be a Flash fan, I would use that.
On September 08 2014 02:31 Gwavajuice wrote: Nice article but a bit too exagerated IMHO.
1 - Flash is surely one of the best terrans atm, but he's not dominating the game, even if he was on a good streak. Plenty of players had this kind of 2 months streak in the past. Doesn't mean much really.
2 - It is vastely disrepecting soO to not ackowledge that he's the most consitent Zerg in the world and that Flash was not expected to crush him at all.
[...]
But tunred out the he should have used the "random luck unit" WM in his matches, not just the complex to handle Marine, Marauder, Hellbat, thor, Medivac composition...
I m not sure it's more complex to handle, esp. since thor patch, just watch DRG vs Innovation last year to see that DRG is not afraid of the 4M strategy. Main thing was that Flash showed a lot of his TvZ strat in Toronto, and didn't change much in his group, and that what cost him the last game against DRG. (catallena was not very well played from his side either anyway)
On September 08 2014 02:31 Gwavajuice wrote: Nice article but a bit too exagerated IMHO.
1 - Flash is surely one of the best terrans atm, but he's not dominating the game, even if he was on a good streak. Plenty of players had this kind of 2 months streak in the past. Doesn't mean much really.
2 - It is vastely disrepecting soO to not ackowledge that he's the most consitent Zerg in the world and that Flash was not expected to crush him at all.
[...]
But tunred out the he should have used the "random luck unit" WM in his matches, not just the complex to handle Marine, Marauder, Hellbat, thor, Medivac composition...
I m not sure it's more complex to handle, esp. since thor patch, just watch DRG vs Innovation last year to see that DRG is not afraid of the 4M strategy. Main thing was that Flash showed a lot of his TvZ strat in Toronto, and didn't change much in his group, and that what cost him the last game against DRG. (catallena was not very well played from his side either anyway)
Ok... I must have said this the wrong way - sorry, foreign language. What I meant was: WM is not a game changer per se, because if the zerg is aware of it, he sends ahead a unit or snipes them out and all it does is slow him down, not kill him. I called it a "luck unit" because sometimes you have this lucky connections where u kill ~10 banelings or 8 workers, depending on where u use it. But you actually cannot control it very well and it only shoots 1x every 40 secs, so its more on luck if you really have the connections you need or not (in a hectic battle). Hope this is more understandable now. I don't use the mines besides in defense, I think they are too much of a coinflip sometimes
Edit: just saw you meant Medivac, Marine, Marauder, Hellbat and Mine. Which is the current meta. Well it is complex 4 sure. For starters you are refering to 4M, here we got 6 Unit types, not 4. Having different tech trees that need to be combined (Mech upgrades, vs Bio, 2 Factories at least although you should produce mass marines and some marauders as well, presplit and micro (snipe blings, run away, split again, push back medivacs, see that the marauder and hellbat soaks up the damage and thet the lings don't tuch the thor before the mutas do, micro thor back (pickup micro maybe?) and that mostly on creep, having the opponent with the faster unit coming to you, you need to always look, because if you look away 1 sec you are dead or ran over) a lot and always be aware of the counter, Besides the ~10 Rax you need 2-3 Factories (Hellbats, Thor and maybe Mines) and at least one starport (Medivac/Viking, lets see if sometime in the future we will se a Raven mixed in to prevent the minerals loss due to scanning the whole time. That would require a 2nd starport cause you don't want to switch all the time). Then we have 2 Upgrades for the Bio and Upgrades for mech, in order that your hellbats soak up damage they should have Armor as well, but most don't make that (yet), at least Infernal preigniter or what it is called. But the hardest part is the engagement because if you lose it one time decisively you lost the game, whereas this isn't necessary true for the zerg (depending how much is left of the terran army and what, the Zerg (if he hit all injects of 3-4 or 5 bases) makes 100 units of the counter- unit ^^ (overexaggerate much, Rollora?)
Don't really care about soO advancing, he's good but he's proven himself disappointing and boring enough for me to not be a fan, but I'm nearly infinitely happy for DRG!
God as a nickname leads to all those annoying "checkmate (a)theists" jokes, so it annoys me. And I don't know if it will inspire good fanart the same way that a nickname like Emperor or Prince will.
On September 07 2014 06:42 TeamLiquid ESPORTS wrote: Born on a Monday. Won Proleague on a Tuesday. Won GSL ro32 on a Wednesday. Flew to Toronto on a Thursday. Won IEM Toronto on a Friday Killed by soO on a Saturday Buried by DRG on a Sunday
On September 08 2014 04:55 Painchiller wrote: Haha Flash hype already over?
Is it? I don't see that. Flash has been and will still be a great player, even though he lost. But he made it further than other great terrans (like maru) so, guess the hype is still somewhat justified.
On September 08 2014 06:31 sparklyresidue wrote: Don't really care about soO advancing, he's good but he's proven himself disappointing and boring enough for me to not be a fan, but I'm nearly infinitely happy for DRG!
this is me exactly, except i wouldnt say soo dissapoints
On September 08 2014 06:31 sparklyresidue wrote: Don't really care about soO advancing, he's good but he's proven himself disappointing and boring enough for me to not be a fan, but I'm nearly infinitely happy for DRG!
this is me exactly, except i wouldnt say soo dissapoints
On another note I found this quote from soO randomly last year and it made me laugh
Q: So who do you want to play in the Ro16? A: Who's in it? Q: Bomber, YoDa, RorO, Flying. A: Whoa, they're all good. I think a lot of toss players will come up, so I have to prepare ZvP. I want to avoid them if possible, but I think a lot of them will advance. I want to pick Prime players if they come up.
Q: So who do you want to play in the Ro16? A: Who's in it? Q: Bomber, YoDa, RorO, Flying. A: Whoa, they're all good. I think a lot of toss players will come up, so I have to prepare ZvP. I want to avoid them if possible, but I think a lot of them will advance. I want to pick Prime players if they come up.
Q: Why? A: They just seem easy, the Prime team.
It's especially funny considering Maru won the season after that, while beating an SKT player in the finals
Q: So who do you want to play in the Ro16? A: Who's in it? Q: Bomber, YoDa, RorO, Flying. A: Whoa, they're all good. I think a lot of toss players will come up, so I have to prepare ZvP. I want to avoid them if possible, but I think a lot of them will advance. I want to pick Prime players if they come up.
soO was just too strong. I wanted for Flash to advance so much, but reality is much worse. But still I know there's a bright future for him after he got his first major championship in SC2, because from the next year Flash will be more prepared, more calm, fixed and concentrated.
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
I don't see why Flash hype would be over. GSL ro16 has bassicly 16 players competing that are so close to each other in terms of skill that any of them might win GSL.
Thats why the current form-meter matters so much here and same time just a bit of luck or lack of it can decide who goes to ro8.
I would actually love to see bo5 in ro16 instead of in ro8. But i guess they have some sort of time scedule for this.
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
On September 08 2014 19:17 Svizcy wrote: I don't see why Flash hype would be over. GSL ro16 has bassicly 16 players competing that are so close to each other in terms of skill that any of them might win GSL.
Thats why the current form-meter matters so much here and same time just a bit of luck or lack of it can decide who goes to ro8.
I would actually love to see bo5 in ro16 instead of in ro8. But i guess they have some sort of time scedule for this.
good day, svizcy
I would say Reality and Effort were the only two in the Ro16 and thought, "these two will certainly not win GSL" but I see your point. Going out in the Ro16 is no shame to be sure, it's just the Flash hype was getting a little out of hand very fast
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
I miss seeing ventral sacs upgraded in general ._.
Such a cool aspect of Zerg that mostly died with WoL save for a few all-ins on Akilon Wastes early in HotS.
They should scrap the swarm host and replace it with a baneling bomber: - morphs from an overlord - builds banelings similar to a reaver or carrier - can only be dropped
On September 07 2014 07:02 TheBloodyDwarf wrote: Im getting tired of this fake God called Flash.
He was a "god" in BW. I wonder why people still call him god in sc2 though. He is very good but not comparable to his skill in bw.
Same reason people called Bisu the Revolutionist or Boxer the Emperor. Nicknames stick, especially when they're good or catchy.
You think "god" is a good nickname? Bleh..
You'd agree if you'd watched him in his prime.
On September 07 2014 22:33 Rollora wrote:
On September 07 2014 13:42 Phredxor wrote:
On September 07 2014 12:50 Rollora wrote:
On September 07 2014 11:51 Shellshock wrote:
On September 07 2014 11:27 Darkhorse wrote:
On September 07 2014 10:58 Rollora wrote: Being happy about fans of other players being sad sounds kinda stupid and childish to me
Welcome to esports
welcome to everything
so practically everything where infantile minds are allowed to speak Thank god I am teaching in a school for "more then average" intelligent kids, where I haven't seen such a behavior yet.
You will.
well given that I have about 150 kids a year to teach, and that several years now, if it happens to me once in a while, I won't bother. So its 1 out of 500 to maybe 1000 kids, which shows the kids are actually smarter or more "developed" then most "grown ups" here
Put your gifted rich kids on the internet and see if 'such a behavior' happens. If you're naive enough to think how a teenager behaves in a classroom remotely compares to how they behave anonymously on public forums... you should probably stick to teaching the "less than average" kids.
No. God is a lame nickname regardless of skill. Bergkamp was called god. One of the most skillful footballers of all time but of all his nicknames (he had many) this was by far the lamest. It's unimaginative and unoriginal (many people in many sports were called it). It has no connection to the person besides being believed the best at the time. It has the silly super hero comic book over the topness in it. It's bleh. Unfortunately the damage has been done; Nicknames can't be controlled, Artosis can call his pylon "Incontrol" a milion times, it's still going to be the Artosis Pylon. So I just have to cope with it. :/
While I agree, that god is a lame nickname by itself, Flash still has "The ultimate Weapon", which is pretty cool. If I would be a Flash fan, I would use that.
I prefer The ultimate weapon too :p His ultimate weapon is actually his ruler :D
Those games were depressing. The lack or poor splitting against banes and the void of Tank or Mine support for disengages really costs Flash in the games he lost and made the games he won against soO and True more difficult. At this level of competition, his macro ability just isn't enough to "out stuff" zergs with his current unit composition playstyle.
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
I miss seeing ventral sacs upgraded in general ._.
Such a cool aspect of Zerg that mostly died with WoL save for a few all-ins on Akilon Wastes early in HotS.
inefficient? How much does the upgrade cost? 100-100? And INSTANTLY you have over 20 dropships? No, just a lame excuse, and dropping 2-3 banelings into a mineral line because the terran (or whatever) thinks its only a scouting overlord isn't inefficient use. No its just an excuse for lazyness and shows that there is still a lot of potential in the game. I NEVER lost a game where I could make 2 simultanous banelingdrops happen while i harrassed with my force or fought the main army of the opponent.
On September 09 2014 01:47 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:
On September 09 2014 00:19 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 20:35 Tanzklaue wrote:
On September 08 2014 18:14 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 17:24 Rollora wrote:
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
I miss seeing ventral sacs upgraded in general ._.
Such a cool aspect of Zerg that mostly died with WoL save for a few all-ins on Akilon Wastes early in HotS.
inefficient? How much does the upgrade cost? 100-100? And INSTANTLY you have over 20 dropships? No, just a lame excuse, and dropping 2-3 banelings into a mineral line because the terran (or whatever) thinks its only a scouting overlord isn't inefficient use. No its just an excuse for lazyness and shows that there is still a lot of potential in the game. I NEVER lost a game where I could make 2 simultanous banelingdrops happen while i harrassed with my force or fought the main army of the opponent.
Well, in casual games I wouldn't doubt that. At the professional level though, I don't see it being reliable enough to be part of a typical game.
The upgrade is actually 200/200, requires a lair, and takes a long time to research. Also those 20 drop ships eat into supply if they're lost as well. Now let's examine how the match ups are played.
ZvP: Banes are almost never used here to begin with. Protoss love stargate openings which makes it even riskier to pull off consistent baneling drops. Furthermore, Protoss arguably has the best scouting in the game what with the mothership core, observers, stargate units, and hallucinations all being very accessible.
ZvT vs Bio: Why not just stick with making more mutas? They do just fine at not only killing scvs, but also add-ons and they can assist in holding off pushes and reducing the dreaded medivac count. I should concentrate my apm in using those. Also, that 3/3 window for Terran is brutal on Zerg in pro play. Why not use that 200/200 to assist in getting to hive and my own 3/3 easier? In addition, there's numerous times where Terrans can be so relentlessly good at pushing (see Bogus) that a few banes could totally make or break whether you hold one of your bases/mineral lines or not. Then you have to compound all that with the fact that worker losses hurt Terran the least of the 3 races and it just doesn't seem worth it at all.
ZvT vs Mech: Banes don't really fit in here (unless you're Nestea!). Generally I want to avoid making lings as soon as I see that the Terran is meching. The stockpiled resources are also better spent on tech switching to mutas later or just getting them out quickly to abuse any lack of AA in the early stages.
ZvZ: You better Hyun that shit
I could maybe see ventral finding its way into roach/hydra play. Yet, once again that composition strikes me as vastly inferior to muta/ling to begin with.
On September 09 2014 01:47 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:
On September 09 2014 00:19 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 20:35 Tanzklaue wrote:
On September 08 2014 18:14 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 17:24 Rollora wrote:
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
I miss seeing ventral sacs upgraded in general ._.
Such a cool aspect of Zerg that mostly died with WoL save for a few all-ins on Akilon Wastes early in HotS.
inefficient? How much does the upgrade cost? 100-100? And INSTANTLY you have over 20 dropships? No, just a lame excuse, and dropping 2-3 banelings into a mineral line because the terran (or whatever) thinks its only a scouting overlord isn't inefficient use. No its just an excuse for lazyness and shows that there is still a lot of potential in the game. I NEVER lost a game where I could make 2 simultanous banelingdrops happen while i harrassed with my force or fought the main army of the opponent.
Interesting. Sounds like you are a unknown pro genius.
On September 09 2014 01:47 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:
On September 09 2014 00:19 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 20:35 Tanzklaue wrote:
On September 08 2014 18:14 nimdil wrote:
On September 08 2014 17:24 Rollora wrote:
On September 08 2014 13:58 cutler wrote: less terrans means less fun watching...at least for me
in the future, when the other races learn to drop, micro, multiprompt-harass and attack from different angles at the same time, this will not be the case anymore- I hope. But that would also need some redesign of the game, as one of the problems is, that for protoss its just more practical to have a deathball, rather than split the army to 2-3 parts and simultanously attack with it, while also having something at home, for defense (not needed now, because of warpin mechanic).
Also Terrans are maybe more fun to watch, cause their units are based on humans and our units I guess. I have not yet figured out, why I find it so extremely boring to watch Protoss or even play it. Although I am pretty good with it (macro game, not allins).
I liked when in early WoL there was a concept of baneling bombardment - I'd like the concept to come back as it was rather cool.
the reason why nobody does it anymore is because it is very inefficient and you have to sacrifice too many overlords.
I know why it's not used - I'm just saying that it was cool style to watch and if it was revived somehow it would be cool (I don't know - baneling has +15dmg for 0.5s after leaving overlord or something as an upgrade.
I miss seeing ventral sacs upgraded in general ._.
Such a cool aspect of Zerg that mostly died with WoL save for a few all-ins on Akilon Wastes early in HotS.
inefficient? How much does the upgrade cost? 100-100? And INSTANTLY you have over 20 dropships? No, just a lame excuse, and dropping 2-3 banelings into a mineral line because the terran (or whatever) thinks its only a scouting overlord isn't inefficient use. No its just an excuse for lazyness and shows that there is still a lot of potential in the game. I NEVER lost a game where I could make 2 simultanous banelingdrops happen while i harrassed with my force or fought the main army of the opponent.
Interesting. Sounds like you are a unknown pro genius.
it doesn't always require to be a pro, to know whats efficient and what isn't right? And sometimes looking at things from the outside is definately better then being stuck in a what you would maybe call "Betriebsblindheit", not seeing the problem/solution because you are so deep in your thoughtprocess that just points out the things how you always did them. I said several things back in 2010 which are strong or maybe too strong, and of course I wasn't alone (lots of complaining going onabout "imbalances" in the game or "too strong attack" that took pros years to pick up and are now the "new meta"
EPT
Flash. He was 65-17 from July to the end of August. 79.27% in win rate against some of the best in the world. The current map pool has some of the best maps Terrans have had since the release of HotS. He then won Proleague Finals. He won IEM Toronto. He got into the easiest group in the ro16 after bribing Innovation with a meal. He even had a few days of rest from getting back from Toronto before he had to play his ro16 against all Zerg players: TRUE, soO, and DRG. On top of that Flash had only lost one series to Zerg in the past two months (to Action). All told everything was going right for Flash. Just the sheer momentum alone should have easily carried Flash to the quarterfinals. Should have.
TRUE, crushing him into the ground with a 11/11 and an early hellbat marine banshee timing. He had all of the hype in the world following him into that winner’s match, and the Winners' Match seemed like a formality.
it's a sad day for terrans![[image loading]](http://i.minus.com/ibtiQhkpQrH8nw.gif)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/7FSJ2Lw.jpg)
