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Leagues being adjusted - Page 2
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
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Ercster
United States603 Posts
On May 11 2014 04:14 Waise wrote: well, if you need leagues and care about "points," that's fine. but a lot of us are able to improve and set goals without unreliable trinkets and badges such as league placement. whatever works for you though! Well the combo of league and points are essentially ELO, which is your skill rank. So the only unreliable part is with leagues being adjusted, and they're doing that to make things much more accurate for the outside viewer. | ||
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ThePastor
New Zealand380 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27405 Posts
Neither for or against, as long as Master league doesn't get massively overfilled again, as it should be something for your average joe to aspire towards. | ||
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frajen86
168 Posts
On May 11 2014 03:49 RavingRaver wrote: Personally, I find that this is a good change as it's bringing leagues closer to how they were in WoL, which is superior to how it was in HotS for the most part. Do you realize that the nios.kr league distributions are for ALL players and not "active" players? The true distributions are not any closer to WoL right now. Blizzard's desired ladder distributions are only for active players. Bonus pool as activity metric: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/423477-ladder-analysis-activity-metric My own analysis isn't as accurate as the bonus pool analysis, but there are tens of thousands of players that haven't done more than 10 games on ladder this season. These "inactive" players inflate (at least!) the bronze and silver league percentages: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/448455-sc2rankscom-official-thread#10 | ||
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TTBest
Germany74 Posts
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
On May 11 2014 05:50 Wombat_NI wrote: What are the current percentages per league they're looking for? Neither for or against, as long as Master league doesn't get massively overfilled again, as it should be something for your average joe to aspire towards. I don't think it directly answers your question, but I think you'd find it interesting: http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/254uj2/ladder_so_far_in_numbers/ | ||
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frajen86
168 Posts
On May 11 2014 05:50 Wombat_NI wrote: What are the current percentages per league they're looking for? http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/10059616/ From Masters-to-Bronze: 2/18/20/32/20/8 These distributions are not going to be directly visible from nios or sc2ranks because those sites look at "ALL" players and not "active" players. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27405 Posts
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frajen86
168 Posts
On May 11 2014 06:51 Wombat_NI wrote: Thanks for the links, I was more wondering what Blizzard's actual intended breakdowns would be, although ofc how the ladders themselves look is good information to know! The post above yours show Blizzard's actual intended breakdowns | ||
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CrazyPieGuy
United States41 Posts
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TRaFFiC
Canada1448 Posts
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imre
France9263 Posts
On May 11 2014 07:00 TRaFFiC wrote: Because of smurfing, a lot of spots in plat, di, ML are held by people from other servers. Maybe this is their way to counteract this. I think they should just kill the smurfs. i don't think smurfing is a pbm but the league with the higher percent of alt accounts is definitely gm :p | ||
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RavingRaver
Canada57 Posts
On May 11 2014 06:15 frajen86 wrote: Do you realize that the nios.kr league distributions are for ALL players and not "active" players? The true distributions are not any closer to WoL right now. Blizzard's desired ladder distributions are only for active players. Bonus pool as activity metric: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/423477-ladder-analysis-activity-metric My own analysis isn't as accurate as the bonus pool analysis, but there are tens of thousands of players that haven't done more than 10 games on ladder this season. These "inactive" players inflate (at least!) the bronze and silver league percentages: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/448455-sc2rankscom-official-thread#10 I know nios.kr isn't 99% reliable, but it's better than SC2 ranks because it constantly updates imo. Each site has their pros and cons though and I'll post the SC2 ranks website to offer a more varied perspective. I do wonder what the actual ladder distributions are though based on active players. | ||
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frajen86
168 Posts
On May 11 2014 07:45 RavingRaver wrote: I know nios.kr isn't 99% reliable, but it's better than SC2 ranks because it constantly updates imo. Each site has their pros and cons though and I'll post the SC2 ranks website to offer a more varied perspective. I do wonder what the actual ladder distributions are though based on active players. My point isn't really about update time although that is kind of important if we were trying to get ladder distributions every day. The point is that if you assume that the nios.kr league distributions are the same as Blizzard's target distributions then you are wrong. Even if SC2ranks website is off by even a week, the fact that 71% of the players in bronze league divisions have played less than 10 games and 55% have played 5 or less games should suggest to you that there is a lot of inactivity in the low leagues. If you actually read the "activity metric" thread you will see some analysis that Excalibur Z did on 2013 Season 4 which proves that if you only look at players with relatively small bonus pool, the league distributions are a lot closer to what the Blizzard targets are. 1 bonus week: Master - 5.4%, Diamond - 15.27%, Platinum - 18.95%, Gold - 28.84%, Silver - 20.26%, Bronze - 11.26% 2 bonus weeks: Master - 5.56%, Diamond - 15.34%, Platinum - 19.37%, Gold - 29.58%, Silver - 20.07%, Bronze - 10.05% 3 bonus weeks: Master - 5.62%, Diamond - 15.06%, Platinum - 19.53%, Gold - 30.31%, Silver - 20.18%, Bronze - 9.26% 4 bonus weeks: Master - 5.64%, Diamond - 14.57%, Platinum - 19.46%, Gold - 31.27%, Silver - 20.46%, Bronze - 8.57% 5 bonus weeks: Master - 5.53%, Diamond - 13.87%, Platinum - 19.21%, Gold - 31.94%, Silver - 21.17%, Bronze - 8.25% 6 bonus weeks: Master - 5.09%, Diamond - 12.60%, Platinum - 18.35%, Gold - 31.96%, Silver - 22.93%, Bronze - 9.03% | ||
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Blargh
United States2103 Posts
On May 11 2014 04:14 Superouman wrote: What if I told you should get some psychology courses? I have actually taken two, both of which were pretty useless, in my opinion. Just like leagues! Obviously, people want to have some sort of symbolic representation of their skill, like MASTER LEAGUE, but it really does not make any difference, as the ladder is terrible at appropriately ranking people, except for Grandmaster League in Korea. Honestly, if people want leagues, instead of just having an accurate rating, then it should be divided evenly (20/20/20/20/20), and possibly further tiered (tier 1 Masters, tier 2 Masters, etc.) as that would make the clearest "milestones" for people. | ||
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[F_]aths
Germany3947 Posts
On May 11 2014 09:09 Blargh wrote: I have actually taken two, both of which were pretty useless, in my opinion. Just like leagues! Obviously, people want to have some sort of symbolic representation of their skill, like MASTER LEAGUE, but it really does not make any difference, as the ladder is terrible at appropriately ranking people, except for Grandmaster League in Korea. Honestly, if people want leagues, instead of just having an accurate rating, then it should be divided evenly (20/20/20/20/20), and possibly further tiered (tier 1 Masters, tier 2 Masters, etc.) as that would make the clearest "milestones" for people. Even GM in Korea only reflects ladder skills, not tournament skills – which is, what really counts. 20/20/20/20/20 has some downs. Have a look at the bell curve. The middle 20% would be extremely close in skill while the outer 20% would include extreme deviations. Leages should give a very rough, but still useful classification. And they actually provide that. | ||
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RavingRaver
Canada57 Posts
On May 11 2014 08:53 frajen86 wrote: My point isn't really about update time although that is kind of important if we were trying to get ladder distributions every day. The point is that if you assume that the nios.kr league distributions are the same as Blizzard's target distributions then you are wrong. Even if SC2ranks website is off by even a week, the fact that 71% of the players in bronze league divisions have played less than 10 games and 55% have played 5 or less games should suggest to you that there is a lot of inactivity in the low leagues. If you actually read the "activity metric" thread you will see some analysis that Excalibur Z did on 2013 Season 4 which proves that if you only look at players with relatively small bonus pool, the league distributions are a lot closer to what the Blizzard targets are. 1 bonus week: Master - 5.4%, Diamond - 15.27%, Platinum - 18.95%, Gold - 28.84%, Silver - 20.26%, Bronze - 11.26% 2 bonus weeks: Master - 5.56%, Diamond - 15.34%, Platinum - 19.37%, Gold - 29.58%, Silver - 20.07%, Bronze - 10.05% 3 bonus weeks: Master - 5.62%, Diamond - 15.06%, Platinum - 19.53%, Gold - 30.31%, Silver - 20.18%, Bronze - 9.26% 4 bonus weeks: Master - 5.64%, Diamond - 14.57%, Platinum - 19.46%, Gold - 31.27%, Silver - 20.46%, Bronze - 8.57% 5 bonus weeks: Master - 5.53%, Diamond - 13.87%, Platinum - 19.21%, Gold - 31.94%, Silver - 21.17%, Bronze - 8.25% 6 bonus weeks: Master - 5.09%, Diamond - 12.60%, Platinum - 18.35%, Gold - 31.96%, Silver - 22.93%, Bronze - 9.03% I don't assume that nios.kr and SC2 ranks league distributions are the same as Blizzard's target distributions. Statistics sites such as nios.kr and SC2 ranks should be taken with a grain of salt. I'm sure that the actual distributions are closer to the target distributions than the statistics sites would have you believe. I assume that Blizzard has looked solely at the active player base's league distribution upon making their decision to change the league percentages. | ||
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Waise
3165 Posts
On May 11 2014 05:39 Ercster wrote: Well the combo of league and points are essentially ELO, which is your skill rank. So the only unreliable part is with leagues being adjusted, and they're doing that to make things much more accurate for the outside viewer. your "skill rank" is impossibly subjective. the only thing that actually matters is identifying flaws in your play and improving upon them. statistically i would be the best player in bronze league but the worst player in grandmaster, and conversely there might be people who have never even played starcraft but would be better than me if they started. who needs these useless direct numerical comparisons other than the most self-serving and insecure gamers? do people really play starcraft just to feel "better than others"? | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27405 Posts
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