EPTDrama for drama's sake, as far as I can tell. /shrug.
O'Gaming/Millenium/aAa and ESL dispute French stream for W…
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Noobity
United States871 Posts
Drama for drama's sake, as far as I can tell. /shrug. | ||
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iknowthetrue
13 Posts
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FiWiFaKi
Canada9858 Posts
On February 15 2014 08:11 iknowthetrue wrote: The problem is not twitch or dailymotion. The fact is that ESL claiming a percentage of income that generate the stream of wcs on millenium or ogaming. The fact is that ESL is too greedy. So in the end it's all a question of money. Seriously? ESL is incurring all the costs of running the tournament, and someone else can just take their content and monetize it for free? Something about that seems wrong? I definitely think ESL should be compensated by the other streamers. Hopefully a compromise of a solution and both English speaking viewers and French viewers are happy. | ||
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lopido
Canada245 Posts
such things is impossible with twitch, that's why they are fighting and that's why they have 2k views on their streams even at 5 am. WCS should just ban them forever | ||
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Pontius Pirate
United States1557 Posts
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Complete
United States1864 Posts
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Battery
Finland18 Posts
While I kinda understand decisions made my ESL because twitch is their sponsor at it seems, they should allow french streamers to cast under the circumstances they add "sponsored by twich" to their UI's. Might get a bit odd but still, more the merrier. Gotta say ESL have done pretty great job since WCS started and I hope you guys keep the same quality with streaming, commentating and casting! | ||
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iknowthetrue
13 Posts
Remember this, its blizzard who finance WCS EU, not ESL. | ||
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v_lm
France202 Posts
On February 15 2014 11:02 Pontius Pirate wrote: You'd think it would be easier to just follow the rules and stream on Twitch, but apparently someone is throwing a hissy fit about their cpm... If you follow those rules whatever they are (sharing x percent with ESL, streaming on Dailymotion rather than twitch, as it is we don't know the issue for sure) then you can't monetize the event and it just doesnt happen. So basically theres no rule to follow, theres no event. | ||
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rnst
Germany42 Posts
On February 15 2014 11:11 v_lm wrote: If you follow those rules whatever they are (sharing x percent with ESL, streaming on Dailymotion rather than twitch, as it is we don't know the issue for sure) then you can't monetize the event and it just doesnt happen. So basically theres no rule to follow, theres no event. well if they don't want to do it like all the other none-english streams, maybe they should try to get the exclusive rights for wcs europe 2015 then... | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
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GuoJing
France30 Posts
On February 15 2014 10:59 lopido wrote: french want to use dailymotion to use bots to create an imaginary viewers audience and earn money from the ads. such things is impossible with twitch, that's why they are fighting and that's why they have 2k views on their streams even at 5 am. WCS should just ban them forever You are pointing something interesting. First, yes, french webtv use dailymotion because it's french and it pays more than Twitch. Secondly, we (french viewers) are now forced to cut streams because they put them on their homepages, automatically started even if they are muted, that creates a fake audience. Some would even say it is necessary for them to keep dailymotion because what they (more or less) couldnt live without it. One among ogaming/aaa/mill even said few months ago that the homepage stream would be there till the end of a tournament, and should disappear later, which it didnt, of course because a rival streaming website was doing this homepage abuse. So they decided to keep it that way. To be honest, i'm not that interested in issue happening right now because it will probably be fixed. I'm more worried about how could 3 rivals TV work together to stream 1 unique event as there will not be 3 french streams for WCS. | ||
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SinCitta
Germany2127 Posts
TaKe has recently given an interview in German giving some details about Twitch and WCS. He said that only the English (ESL) production gets money from Blizzard to improve their production, all other streams only get their Twitch ad revenue, which doesn't really cover the cost. He did not mention anything about having to give a share of that to ESL. If I remember correctly (although I am not sure), he said (not in that interview) that the WCS stuff was only good for self promotion, but it isn't worth it financially. Temporarily, the German WCS was covered by someone else, maybe for that reason. He also said that Dailymotion pays 5 Euro (or was it $?) CPM. Twitch is a fraction of that. But he also said that Twitch is much better at showcasing streams. It's Blizzard's call whether they want their league covered in other languages and want to pay for it. But if they pay extra (or miss some terms of their Twitch sponsorship) for the French stream, why not give the German stream extra money, or the Russian stream? Sure, the French probably have the best production and higher cost involved with it, but they can't just expect Blizzard to pay the bills without having a deal with them in the first place. If Blizzard does not decide to support Non-English streams financially, they will not be able to up their production and some of them will probably drop out in the long run. | ||
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mikumegurine
Canada3145 Posts
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v_lm
France202 Posts
On February 15 2014 11:18 rnst wrote: well if they don't want to do it like all the other none-english streams, maybe they should try to get the exclusive rights for wcs europe 2015 then... Lol nice logic. Yet in other fields there's no such thing as "European Exclusivity" Take Soccer : Champion's league ONE french society (channel) has bought the right to broadcast it, ONE german society... etc. In sc2's case it is really different ONE european society receives money to organize and broadcast it in english. On February 15 2014 11:41 SinCitta wrote: This seems to be an issue between the French partners and Blizzard, not with ESL. It seems unreasonable for ESL to give the French preferential treatment compared to their other "other language" partners just so they can compete against their own product. TaKe has recently given an interview in German giving some details about Twitch and WCS. He said that only the English (ESL) production gets money from Blizzard to improve their production, all other streams only get their Twitch ad revenue, which doesn't really cover the cost. He did not mention anything about having to give a share of that to ESL. If I remember correctly (although I am not sure), he said (not in that interview) that the WCS stuff was only good for self promotion, but it isn't worth it financially. Temporarily, the German WCS was covered by someone else, maybe for that reason. He also said that Dailymotion pays 5 Euro (or was it $?) CPM. Twitch is a fraction of that. But he also said that Twitch is much better at showcasing streams. It's Blizzard's call whether they want their league covered in other languages and want to pay for it. But if they pay extra (or miss some terms of their Twitch sponsorship) for the French stream, why not give the German stream extra money, or the Russian stream? Sure, the French probably have the best production and higher cost involved with it, but they can't just expect Blizzard to pay the bills without having a deal with them in the first place. If Blizzard does not decide to support Non-English streams financially, they will not be able to up their production and some of them will probably drop out in the long run. Really good points / insight.  He said that only the English (ESL) production gets money from Blizzard to improve their production Hmmm... the main issue here is it's very hard to tell if the money flux Blizzard --> ESL is exclusively to subcontract the task of organizing a tournament OR if part of that money is to help broadcasting it. Then yeah, in that last case, Blizzard should fund Take and French TVs or any "local" TV that puts a good effort on production value. | ||
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bduddy
United States1326 Posts
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Boucot
France15997 Posts
On February 15 2014 11:45 mikumegurine wrote: what happened in previous seasons? WCS and ESL french on Dailymotion without any problems? Last year ESL (and not Blizzard) gave the exclusive rights to aAa on Twitch without asking to the other websites. The average viewer count was something like 200-300 viewers the good days (it would have been at least 6-7000 on O'Gaming or Millenium). Fun fact : ESL France's boss is the creator of aAa. | ||
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jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
How are Twitch, ESL, Blizzard looked at in the wrong here at all, I do not understand. This is how things work in the real world. Broadcast rights mean something. You can't just do what you want because you feel like it. O'Gaming/Millenium/aAa need to either accept the terms or not broadcast, simple as that. Obviously there are negotiations where they need to decide if its worth it or not. | ||
digmouse
China6328 Posts
On February 15 2014 11:10 Battery wrote: More the merrier. While I think Daily motion is far weaker than twitch is atm, and in any circumstances I wouldn't watch Daily if there's twitch stream available, I'd still prolly would let them stream. The french stream audition is so small it wouldn't make any significant difference to add values, I think. While I kinda understand decisions made my ESL because twitch is their sponsor at it seems, they should allow french streamers to cast under the circumstances they add "sponsored by twich" to their UI's. Might get a bit odd but still, more the merrier. Gotta say ESL have done pretty great job since WCS started and I hope you guys keep the same quality with streaming, commentating and casting! A little trick is DailyMotion seems to have a way better service status than Twitch in Europe atm, having them hurts no one, but yeah, I don't see why ESL can't require them to stream on Twitch as well. | ||
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Strangways
United States13 Posts
On February 15 2014 10:31 Maniak_ wrote: I think you're vastly overrating the importance of french viewership, and especially the number of french viewers who would *only* watch a french stream. I for one could not be tortured nor bought into watching a french stream of anything. All other french SC2 viewers I know only watch english streams, except one who has no problem watching english streams when it's the only option. Sure, there *are* french viewers who can't understand/enjoy english casts and who would miss out on WCS if there was no french stream. But I highly doubt their number is as critical as some would like to make us believe. English *is* pretty widespread over here. Only about a third of French people can speak English. But among French video game enthusiasts between the ages of, say, 13 and 30, the percentage is probably far, far higher. I've watched a lot of European video game streams and I don't think I've ever seen a European in any of them who could not speak English. | ||
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