EPTStarbow - Page 75
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da_head
Canada3350 Posts
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Ammanas
Slovakia2166 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:33 Arco wrote: lol being bad is macroing BW strats perfectly (lol sc2 UI) and dying everytime to the same stuff I stop in BW? Okay...keep dreaming. Starbow is not BW though. | ||
Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
Can't stress this enough. | ||
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Ovi
164 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:20 Xiphias wrote: The Dragoon is definitely the "core" unit and have the central role. We actually only had the stalker for the longest time as the core unit but it was problematic. It had to be strong, since there were no force fields, but they were also mobile with blink. It turned into "only make stalkers" protoss, which was lame. After the goon switch we tried to give the stalker a new and unique role. Not it is the "mutalisk" of protoss. Light, fast, agile, but low hp. It can dart in, snipe and dart out again. It cannot be too strong because Starbow is a much more positional game than SC2 and any unit who abuses terrain (blink, reapers etc...) has to be a bit weaker in Starbow compared to SC2 There are probably other stuff I am forgetting. Remember, 2 years of development. We don't all remember every phase and reason for every thing that this mod has gone through. Hope it answered your question though. Ye it did. Seems like the coexistence of the dragoon and the stalker makes perfect sense in Starbow then. I hope starbow grows, these last days it has always been a delight to check out some Starbow action whenever its been streamed. Best of luck to you. | ||
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SCST
Mexico1609 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:33 Arco wrote: lol being bad is macroing BW strats perfectly (lol sc2 UI) and dying everytime to the same stuff I stop in BW? Okay...keep dreaming. This game is not Broodwar. How many times does this have to mentioned? Can RTS players really be this dense that they can't understand this basic concept? We're suppose to be smart people.I repeat: the game is NOT Broodwar. | ||
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
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SCST
Mexico1609 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:37 Arco wrote: Okay, let me know when you find a build that's good in PvZ until then playing BW style is unwinnable against a player of equal skill. You must be trolling man, if you won't shut up about Broodwar after like 5 posts explaining to you that this game isn't Broodwar | ||
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Hider
Denmark9405 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:33 da_head wrote: why are lings faster then probes? in broodwar they were the same speed allowing the protoss to keep up some scouting until speed kicked in. You can scout with zealots + rift. Pretty underused combo. | ||
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:38 SCST wrote: You must be trolling man, if you won't shut up about Broodwar after like 5 posts explaining to you that this game isn't Broodwar Not trolling at all, but please tell me what innovative Starbow strat you have to win PvZ, because the only way to play PvZ is BW style without Phoenix, Colossus, Force Fields, Void Rays, SC2 Stalkers, early game Warpgate etc. | ||
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Ammanas
Slovakia2166 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:38 Hider wrote: You can scout with zealots + rift. Pretty underused combo. Indeed. Plenty of disappointed vultures in my games :D On January 18 2014 08:40 Arco wrote: Not trolling at all, but please tell me what innovative Starbow strat you have to win PvZ, because the only way to play PvZ is BW style without Phoenix, Colossus, Force Fields, Void Rays, SC2 Stalkers, early game Warpgate etc. Actually, stalkers are pretty good for sniping drones and sometimes even queens on some maps. DTs are fine. And dragoon/reaver/storm is actually capable of beating ling/hydra/lurker combos-few reaver shots mean a lot of sad hydras actually. | ||
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:32 Ammanas wrote: nope, you are just bad~~ (sorry, couldn't help it. whining about imbalance in a game without any real strategies discovered is just weird). I don't know, it's a time honored tradition in the SC community  | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:38 SCST wrote: You must be trolling man, if you won't shut up about Broodwar after like 5 posts explaining to you that this game isn't Broodwar I think you guys are trolling him, he knows that sb isn't BW, that is the problem here though^^ All he said is that he thinks Hydras are too good vs toss now, cause it is so easy to use them (and/or the strategy). And from watching streams i think he is right, maybe there is something you can do (maybe sentinel and the "mines") but it is no coincidence that a lot of people play BW strats, if both games have kinda the same units (that changes from race to race ofc) | ||
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SCST
Mexico1609 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:40 Arco wrote: Not trolling at all, but please tell me what innovative Starbow strat you have to win PvZ, because the only way to play PvZ is BW style without Phoenix, Colossus, Force Fields, Void Rays, SC2 Stalkers, early game Warpgate etc. Alright the game is not explored yet. It's been out for like a week. There many elements adopted from both SC2 and BW, but also completely new features that don't exist in either game. This is a completely new game with a new, undiscovered meta. Complaining that BW strategies don't work is ridiculous - try something new, dude. Enjoy exploring new strategies. Hell, the meta will be figured out soon enough. Half the fun of this being a new mod is figuring out shit that no one else has and going on a win streak. Just relax. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:44 SCST wrote: Alright the game is not explored yet. It's been out for like a week. There many elements adopted from both SC2 and BW, but also completely new features that don't exist in either game. This is a completely new game with a new, undiscovered meta. Complaining that BW strategies don't work is ridiculous - try something new, dude. Enjoy exploring new strategies. Hell, the meta will be figured out soon enough. Half the fun of this being a new mod is figuring out shit that no one else has and going on a win streak. Just relax. I tried the new units...not just BW strats. Stalkers and Sentinels are harass units. That's not my concern, the army melts vs Hydras where Goon/Templar or Goon/Reaver can deal with Hydra/Lurker in BW quite handily. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9405 Posts
Not trolling at all, but please tell me what innovative Starbow strat you have to win PvZ, because the only way to play PvZ is BW style without Phoenix, Colossus, Force Fields, Void Rays, SC2 Stalkers, early game Warpgate etc. Have you tried 1gate expand into Leglots/Stalker (and Dragoons vs Lurkers) --> templar tech + lots of rift usage? Everytime I use it, I expect my zerg opponent to rage, cus it feels like such an imbalanced strategy. | ||
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:47 Hider wrote: Have you tried 1gate expand into Zealot/Stalker --> templar tech + lots of rift usage? Everytime I use it, I expect my zerg opponent to rage, cus it feels like such an imbalanced strategy. I'll look into trying it, I haven't tried many variations of the 1 gate expand build, that sounds like an interesting new build for Starbow though. I'll give it a try. Thanks for the suggestion. | ||
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saltis
159 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:37 Arco wrote: Okay, let me know when you find a build that's good in PvZ until then playing BW style is unwinnable against a player of equal skill. That's what I thought about ZvT mutas vs irradiate. But after some practice games and thinking from a different angle I am happy devs are not in hurry to change things. Yes, it was frustrating but eventually I found the key. Starbow is in its meta infancy and you should be happy to look for new strats and counters rather whining. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:47 Arco wrote: I tried everything...not just BW strats. Stalkers and Sentinels are harass units. That's not my concern, the army melts vs Hydras where Goon/Templar or Goon/Reaver can deal with Hydra/Lurker in BW quite handily. Umm...goons sucks vs Hydras period. Yeah you may throw down a few good storms there and there but if the Zerg can macro decently, you are screwed. You need Zealot/HTs to combat Hydras. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9405 Posts
On January 18 2014 08:49 Arco wrote: I'll look into trying it, I haven't tried many variations of the 1 gate expand build, that sounds like an interesting new build for Starbow though. I'll give it a try. Thanks for the suggestion. Yeh I suggest you try to be very active early on with Zealots. If you can get off a drone kill or 2 is great, but mainly try to force Queen to waste energy and for scouting purposes + deny 3rd. Always try to have roughly 50 energy saved up so you can Rift home. When twilight tech is done I typically get 1 stalker just and blink it into main (remember it has high ground vision) to see what opponent is doing. If Mutas you continue Stalker production, if risk of Lurker tech you go for Robo + Dragoons. Further, against the risk of a speedhydra rush, its important to chrono out Legspeed (which already researches faster than in BW), and rely on mass Zealots against the Hydras. If you macro well and also chrono your gateways out, you should be able to hold it off. | ||
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