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Each of these rumors cuts like a knife
the soundtracks were quite appropriate. >_>
I went with Escape, always a good choice. Surprised nobody posted One Winged Angel.
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You know it's a cataclysm when SC2 is more chaotic after The International than Dota2 is.
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On September 01 2013 04:03 Shiori wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:59 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:55 pigmanbear wrote:On September 01 2013 03:53 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:50 sCCrooked wrote:On September 01 2013 03:41 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:38 pigmanbear wrote:
The writing is definitely on the wall for SC2, though I think there will be decent purses for the next 12-18 months (optimistically). The real question is, when do we see a modern competitor? I know I'm not the only one who is only interested in competitive RTS where managing economies and armies are important, and not pure micro, single-player on team games like DOTA and LOL.
I don't fear for the fall of SC2, Blizzard brought that on itself by forcing the game through Blizzard servers. If they distributed SC2 like they did SC1/BW, obviously people would copy it for free and it could rival BW as the ubiquitous RTS over time.
What I find worrying is the prospect that SC2 is the last even semi-popular RTS, and that people who enjoy these games are dinosaurs, like playing text adventures. This happened in brood war many times. Lots of players retired, teams died out, teams gained new sponsors, etc. This isn't something new. And Brood war survived for 10+ years. This is nothing like BW. Rumors are just rumors but if something this cataclysmic were to occur in SC2, the scene is nowhere near as well-funded, well-liked or deeply rooted as the BW scene. You cannot make a well-founded argument for the SC2 surviving using the BW scene as a basis for your theory. Yes, I can. BW didn't have much of a foreign scene. You are ignoring this fact. The SC2 scene has a vibrant foreign community. Dunno why you are neglecting this fact. Half the reason the foreign scene is so big is that you get the best Koreans attending major events, maintaining the highest level of play, along with a few choice foreigners. Nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play. If the Korean scene collapses, these guys stop showing up at major foreign events, ergo the foreign scene becomes dull and dries up as well. Look at the LA scene if you want to see what a foreign scene with no KR influence looks like. It ain't pretty. What do you mean "nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play?" There's a large segment of the sc2 scene that is clamoring for region locking. Don't you see all the TL, twitter, and reddit post about people saying that WCS should be region locked, etc. That's because region locking would still permit high-level play of a few Koreans who actually would (or already have) move to different countries to play in WCS. If there isn't any Korean scene, foreigners become less marketable, because the relevance of foreign players has always been directly proportional to their tendency to measure up against Koreans.
So, now you are ignoring all the Koreans on foreign team. We have Taeja, Hero, Alive, Jaedong, Oz, Innovation, MMA, Forgg, etc. You are basically saying these Koreans aren't good as the koreans on korean teams. The Koreans on foreign teams bring a high level of play to foreign tournaments. So, I don't understand when you say we wouldn't be able to measure the foreign players to korean players.
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People seem to think that the Korean scene dissolving = no more Korean players. What?
I would like to remind people that even if GSL disappeared overnight, we would be able to see players such as Polt, HerO, Mvp, Innovation (now that he is sponsored by a foreign team), JD, MC, and more compete. I am not even including the players who are technically on Korean teams but are sponsored by foreign organizations who are willing to send them overseas (such as FXO, ST, and Axiom).
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On September 01 2013 04:01 pigmanbear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:59 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:55 pigmanbear wrote:On September 01 2013 03:53 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:50 sCCrooked wrote:On September 01 2013 03:41 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:38 pigmanbear wrote:
The writing is definitely on the wall for SC2, though I think there will be decent purses for the next 12-18 months (optimistically). The real question is, when do we see a modern competitor? I know I'm not the only one who is only interested in competitive RTS where managing economies and armies are important, and not pure micro, single-player on team games like DOTA and LOL.
I don't fear for the fall of SC2, Blizzard brought that on itself by forcing the game through Blizzard servers. If they distributed SC2 like they did SC1/BW, obviously people would copy it for free and it could rival BW as the ubiquitous RTS over time.
What I find worrying is the prospect that SC2 is the last even semi-popular RTS, and that people who enjoy these games are dinosaurs, like playing text adventures. This happened in brood war many times. Lots of players retired, teams died out, teams gained new sponsors, etc. This isn't something new. And Brood war survived for 10+ years. This is nothing like BW. Rumors are just rumors but if something this cataclysmic were to occur in SC2, the scene is nowhere near as well-funded, well-liked or deeply rooted as the BW scene. You cannot make a well-founded argument for the SC2 surviving using the BW scene as a basis for your theory. Yes, I can. BW didn't have much of a foreign scene. You are ignoring this fact. The SC2 scene has a vibrant foreign community. Dunno why you are neglecting this fact. Half the reason the foreign scene is so big is that you get the best Koreans attending major events, maintaining the highest level of play, along with a few choice foreigners. Nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play. If the Korean scene collapses, these guys stop showing up at major foreign events, ergo the foreign scene becomes dull and dries up as well. Look at the LA scene if you want to see what a foreign scene with no KR influence looks like. It ain't pretty. What do you mean "nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play?" There's a large segment of the sc2 scene that is clamoring for region locking. Don't you see all the TL, twitter, and reddit post about people saying that WCS should be region locked, etc. Let me put it this way: Two Bo7s are about to start. You can watch MarineKing vs. Taeja, or Scarlett vs. Naniwa. Which do you watch? Or how about choosing Kas vs. Nerchio, or Life vs. Maru?
I personally would watch Scarlett vs. Naniwa. As to the second pick, I'd play LoL/watch LoL as opposed to watching either of those series.
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Thank god for a sense of humor from the OP and the community replies with the dramatic soundtrack (and 2 hours of my life re-dedicated to my mortal combat VHS tape). You guys just made at least one day.
So, anyway. Rumors? What?
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On September 01 2013 04:08 babylon wrote:
People seem to think that the Korean scene dissolving = no more Korean players. What?
I would like to remind people that even if GSL disappeared overnight, we would be able to see players such as Polt, HerO, Mvp, Innovation (now that he is sponsored by a foreign team), JD, MC, and more compete. I am not even including the players who are technically on Korean teams but are sponsored by foreign organizations who are willing to send them overseas (such as FXO, ST, and Axiom).
Korean scene folds -> a bunch of the best talent does stop playing the game -> less tournament money -> the best players (including the best Koreans) move on to other games because they're damned good at computer games. Incredible players like HerO and ForGG aren't going to do what they do for $5k purses.
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What the fuck is going on
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On September 01 2013 04:08 babylon wrote:
People seem to think that the Korean scene dissolving = no more Korean players. What?
I would like to remind people that even if GSL disappeared overnight, we would be able to see players such as Polt, HerO, Mvp, Innovation (now that he is sponsored by a foreign team), JD, MC, and more compete. I am not even including the players who are technically on Korean teams but are sponsored by foreign organizations who are willing to send them overseas (such as FXO, ST, and Axiom).
And you can argue that result and skill level wise Koreans on foreign teams>ESF>KeSPA at the WCS season 2 finals
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On September 01 2013 04:01 pigmanbear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:59 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:55 pigmanbear wrote:On September 01 2013 03:53 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:50 sCCrooked wrote:On September 01 2013 03:41 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:38 pigmanbear wrote:
The writing is definitely on the wall for SC2, though I think there will be decent purses for the next 12-18 months (optimistically). The real question is, when do we see a modern competitor? I know I'm not the only one who is only interested in competitive RTS where managing economies and armies are important, and not pure micro, single-player on team games like DOTA and LOL.
I don't fear for the fall of SC2, Blizzard brought that on itself by forcing the game through Blizzard servers. If they distributed SC2 like they did SC1/BW, obviously people would copy it for free and it could rival BW as the ubiquitous RTS over time.
What I find worrying is the prospect that SC2 is the last even semi-popular RTS, and that people who enjoy these games are dinosaurs, like playing text adventures. This happened in brood war many times. Lots of players retired, teams died out, teams gained new sponsors, etc. This isn't something new. And Brood war survived for 10+ years. This is nothing like BW. Rumors are just rumors but if something this cataclysmic were to occur in SC2, the scene is nowhere near as well-funded, well-liked or deeply rooted as the BW scene. You cannot make a well-founded argument for the SC2 surviving using the BW scene as a basis for your theory. Yes, I can. BW didn't have much of a foreign scene. You are ignoring this fact. The SC2 scene has a vibrant foreign community. Dunno why you are neglecting this fact. Half the reason the foreign scene is so big is that you get the best Koreans attending major events, maintaining the highest level of play, along with a few choice foreigners. Nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play. If the Korean scene collapses, these guys stop showing up at major foreign events, ergo the foreign scene becomes dull and dries up as well. Look at the LA scene if you want to see what a foreign scene with no KR influence looks like. It ain't pretty. What do you mean "nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play?" There's a large segment of the sc2 scene that is clamoring for region locking. Don't you see all the TL, twitter, and reddit post about people saying that WCS should be region locked, etc. Let me put it this way: Two Bo7s are about to start. You can watch MarineKing vs. Taeja, or Scarlett vs. Naniwa. Which do you watch? Or how about choosing Kas vs. Nerchio, or Life vs. Maru?
I'm pretty sure most people would choose Scarlett vs. Naniwa because they are both doing really well lately whereas MarineKing has been doing bad and his TvT is terrible. Bad examples, but I get your point.
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I want to cry. SC, please!
I need you : <
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Honestly, I would not mind if sc2 was heading in the direction of having a smaller scene, with WCS as the focus for half a dozen team per region at max, each having 5 to 6 players.
That leaves a lot of players behind from what we currently have, but we need to start organizing the scene in a realistic manner.
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These are korean rumors SNM translated for fun. They are not facts, they are not back up by anything, they are just rumors. He wanted to point out that koreans have as much drama and rumors as we do.
THESE ARE NOT FACTS.
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On September 01 2013 04:10 ptbl wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 04:08 babylon wrote:
People seem to think that the Korean scene dissolving = no more Korean players. What?
I would like to remind people that even if GSL disappeared overnight, we would be able to see players such as Polt, HerO, Mvp, Innovation (now that he is sponsored by a foreign team), JD, MC, and more compete. I am not even including the players who are technically on Korean teams but are sponsored by foreign organizations who are willing to send them overseas (such as FXO, ST, and Axiom). And you can argue that result and skill level wise Koreans on foreign teams>ESF>KeSPA at the WCS season 2 finals
Eh. I would hesitate to draw many conclusions from just one finals. A lot of players played awful given their usual standard, while others stepped up their game drastically. But it's about consistency, not just results.
I do agree that Bomber > all though~! 
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On September 01 2013 04:01 pigmanbear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:59 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:55 pigmanbear wrote:On September 01 2013 03:53 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:50 sCCrooked wrote:On September 01 2013 03:41 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:38 pigmanbear wrote:
The writing is definitely on the wall for SC2, though I think there will be decent purses for the next 12-18 months (optimistically). The real question is, when do we see a modern competitor? I know I'm not the only one who is only interested in competitive RTS where managing economies and armies are important, and not pure micro, single-player on team games like DOTA and LOL.
I don't fear for the fall of SC2, Blizzard brought that on itself by forcing the game through Blizzard servers. If they distributed SC2 like they did SC1/BW, obviously people would copy it for free and it could rival BW as the ubiquitous RTS over time.
What I find worrying is the prospect that SC2 is the last even semi-popular RTS, and that people who enjoy these games are dinosaurs, like playing text adventures. This happened in brood war many times. Lots of players retired, teams died out, teams gained new sponsors, etc. This isn't something new. And Brood war survived for 10+ years. This is nothing like BW. Rumors are just rumors but if something this cataclysmic were to occur in SC2, the scene is nowhere near as well-funded, well-liked or deeply rooted as the BW scene. You cannot make a well-founded argument for the SC2 surviving using the BW scene as a basis for your theory. Yes, I can. BW didn't have much of a foreign scene. You are ignoring this fact. The SC2 scene has a vibrant foreign community. Dunno why you are neglecting this fact. Half the reason the foreign scene is so big is that you get the best Koreans attending major events, maintaining the highest level of play, along with a few choice foreigners. Nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play. If the Korean scene collapses, these guys stop showing up at major foreign events, ergo the foreign scene becomes dull and dries up as well. Look at the LA scene if you want to see what a foreign scene with no KR influence looks like. It ain't pretty. What do you mean "nobody wants to watch consistently so-so play?" There's a large segment of the sc2 scene that is clamoring for region locking. Don't you see all the TL, twitter, and reddit post about people saying that WCS should be region locked, etc. Let me put it this way: Two Bo7s are about to start. You can watch MarineKing vs. Taeja, or Scarlett vs. Naniwa. Which do you watch? Or how about choosing Kas vs. Nerchio, or Life vs. Maru?
Nerchio vs Kas
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On September 01 2013 03:53 ptbl wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:50 sCCrooked wrote:On September 01 2013 03:41 ptbl wrote:On September 01 2013 03:38 pigmanbear wrote:
The writing is definitely on the wall for SC2, though I think there will be decent purses for the next 12-18 months (optimistically). The real question is, when do we see a modern competitor? I know I'm not the only one who is only interested in competitive RTS where managing economies and armies are important, and not pure micro, single-player on team games like DOTA and LOL.
I don't fear for the fall of SC2, Blizzard brought that on itself by forcing the game through Blizzard servers. If they distributed SC2 like they did SC1/BW, obviously people would copy it for free and it could rival BW as the ubiquitous RTS over time.
What I find worrying is the prospect that SC2 is the last even semi-popular RTS, and that people who enjoy these games are dinosaurs, like playing text adventures. This happened in brood war many times. Lots of players retired, teams died out, teams gained new sponsors, etc. This isn't something new. And Brood war survived for 10+ years. This is nothing like BW. Rumors are just rumors but if something this cataclysmic were to occur in SC2, the scene is nowhere near as well-funded, well-liked or deeply rooted as the BW scene. You cannot make a well-founded argument for the SC2 surviving using the BW scene as a basis for your theory. Yes, I can. BW didn't have much of a foreign scene. You are ignoring this fact. The SC2 scene has a vibrant foreign community. Dunno why you are neglecting this fact.
You are overestimating the importance of the foreign scene, especially at this time. Foreign scene merely provides an outlet for Korean Starcraft to the western audience.
Foreign teams sponsor Korean players, foreign tournaments feature Koreans, the (very) few relevant foreign players train/ed in Korea and are measured by Korean standards, and the far and away most prestigious tournaments and leagues are actually based in Korea.
It isn't all that different from Brood War when you think about it. The main differences being that the game is not popular in Korea to begin with, and western organizations + Blizzard spending money to bring Korean Starcraft overseas.
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On September 01 2013 03:57 babylon wrote:Show nested quote +On September 01 2013 03:47 TwilightRain wrote:On September 01 2013 03:45 TheBloodyDwarf wrote:
As fan of foreign sc2 this is meanless for me... Without at least a halfway "healthy" Korean sc2 scene, there is a pretty big chance "foreign sc2" will follow suit next. Are you joking me? It'll decline, because that's what all games do over time, but the foreign scene is not dependent on the Korean scene. If anything, the foreign scene is propping up the Korean scene atm. The worst case scenario seems to me to be a War3 post-map scandal scenario in Korea, where there is pretty much no more Korean scene (i.e. very few big tournaments in Korea) but still a lot of good players in Korea. The best and most marketable Koreans are then picked up by foreign teams and flown out to compete in foreign tournaments, where they make lots of money and fly back home. Rinse and repeat for years. Story of Korean War3 players' lives, and it's already happening anyways.
Well, don't you aggree it's would be a horrible development for the Korean scene, considering how big BW was and LoL is?
Teams shrinking to a size of 5-6 players without any B-teamers would already be bad enough imo. 5-6 Players is not exactly what I would call a deep line-up for a team-league.
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Should have known that the Apocalypse would immediately follow Bomber winning WCS. >.<
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On September 01 2013 04:14 Nerchio wrote:
Nerchio vs Kas
Nice one, Nerchio 
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EPT
