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On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/
Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up.
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On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up.
there is "running"
and "running well"
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On August 10 2013 00:21 Eggi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up. there is "running" and "running well"
As I said: get out. Your post is unless and serves no purpose. You are just stiring up shit because you can and you are bored in the middle of the day.
P.S. there is a WCS out by Blizzard today for Iphone and Andriod. Its pretty bad ass and I would recommend it.
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On August 10 2013 00:21 Eggi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up. there is "running" and "running well"
There is also "running amazingly". Which is what we are talking about when looking at WCS viewer numbers.
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On August 10 2013 00:23 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:21 Eggi wrote:On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up. there is "running" and "running well" As I said: get out. Your post is unless and serves no purpose. You are just stiring up shit because you can and you are bored in the middle of the day. P.S. there is a WCS out by Blizzard today for Iphone and Andriod. Its pretty bad ass and I would recommend it.
You don't have to agree with this pal, neither do it. But it's not your role to tell people who should and should not post here.
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On August 10 2013 00:25 Cele wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:23 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:21 Eggi wrote:On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up. there is "running" and "running well" As I said: get out. Your post is unless and serves no purpose. You are just stiring up shit because you can and you are bored in the middle of the day. P.S. there is a WCS out by Blizzard today for Iphone and Andriod. Its pretty bad ass and I would recommend it. You don't have to agree with this pal, neither do it. But it's not your role to tell people who should and should not post here.
I am just staying my opinion on his post. There is nothing wrong with that. I truely think it is useless shit stiring and he is only here to cause drama. I truely believe we would be better off if he took this shit to reddit. If he didn't want a response, he shouldn't have posted.
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you also cut out of my qoute where i said "i love this game to death"
awesome, doesnt want drama, creates own drama
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We are already well into the first expansion and many of the problems that existed in WOL are still there in HOTS. The thing is I don't think Blizzard cares/realizes how bad their game is compared to their previous releases.
Like everybody said SC2 is STILL a lonely game. It's very difficult to meet people on Battle.net playing SC2 because of the very lonely interface. What made SC:BW great was that every time I logged in the chat interface was the main part. Not some small little dialog box but the entire screen was mostly chat related panels. I meet so many people online with SC:BW, I haven't made a single one playing SC2 online.
Blizzard really dampened the custom map scene. They probably don't think so but they did. First of all the WC3/SC:BW custom map interface was much better than the SC2. It simply just listed an open games list. This way new maps can get exposure giving map makers an incentive to make them. Now with how the games are organized only top maps get played all the time which leads to a stagnation of great maps. Right now there's Nexus Wars/Desert Strike/Monobattles, those are the big three and I haven't seen much quality maps out there. Blizzard also thought they were being clever with their ridiculously complicated map editor. Well now only a small percentage of people with a programming background can attempt to make a decent map with that thing.
1v1 game design is still not very good. Protoss in my opinion needs an overhaul big time. Warpgate, Colossus, Forcefields all lead to gimicky, all-in, or deathball style of play. Balance will always be discussed till end of the time for an RTS but game design is still very questionable to a lot of people and we're already in first expansion!
Blizzard has one last chance with LOTV, if they don't do some MAJOR fixing the Starcraft series, just like the Diablo series, will lose all the luster it once had.
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The chat channel and game room argument again. You guys do realize that even if blizzard adds these features tomorrow, sc2 won't magically become popular. Lol is still way more popular than dota2 (don't get fooled by ti3's number) without most awesome features from dota2. The most fundamental is that the game needs to be fun to play for a greater amount of people. And this is not the case due to sc2's nature and the taste of today's gamer (don't get me wrong, it's fun to play for me and many people). They are good features to have but it can only boost the game's popularity in the margin.
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Kyrgyz Republic1462 Posts
Blizzard is sadly out of touch with the reality of modern competitive games, they behave like they have no competition whatsoever.
Leaving game design aside, their online model had been obsolete since the beginning. No reconnects, no proper observing system (observers potentially lagging games), no Dota TV-like broadcasts, obvious maphack vulnerabilities. All those small (and not so small, in case of hacks) things really add up. If I feel too tired to play Dota I can still start the game and watch my friends play, or observe high-level matchmaking games being played live. How cool is that? But all you can really do in Starcraft is play on ladder. How much time and community outrage did it take them to add chat channels, or the "watch replay together" button?
I honestly think they should just revamp the whole online portion of the game, both Battle.net and network subsystem of the client, in order to keep the game alive. But that is simply not Blizzard style. Maybe they will be able to do that for Warcraft IV?
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On August 10 2013 00:27 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:25 Cele wrote:On August 10 2013 00:23 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:21 Eggi wrote:On August 10 2013 00:13 Plansix wrote:On August 10 2013 00:11 Eggi wrote:This has been stated by Destiny over 9 MONTHS AGO This is nothing new. Blizzard doesn't care, blizzard won't care. They will bow out of the esport business soon enough seeing as LoL and DOTA 2 are in an enormous lead. They do not have the time or resources to allocate into Starcraft 2 esports. They are pretty much doing it because of its long time legacy. link to destinys thread below + Show Spoiler +http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/ Get out. There are major events running every day with high level players from each region. Go back to reddit with this crap, they will eat it up. there is "running" and "running well" As I said: get out. Your post is unless and serves no purpose. You are just stiring up shit because you can and you are bored in the middle of the day. P.S. there is a WCS out by Blizzard today for Iphone and Andriod. Its pretty bad ass and I would recommend it. You don't have to agree with this pal, neither do it. But it's not your role to tell people who should and should not post here. I am just staying my opinion on his post. There is nothing wrong with that. I truely think it is useless shit stiring and he is only here to cause drama. I truely believe we would be better off if he took this shit to reddit. If he didn't want a response, he shouldn't have posted.
i have to disagree. I myself have been called beeing "poisonous to the community" a couple of times, when i just wanted to apply constructive criticism/ express my opionion. I think it's a bad call if you just want to make people should up.
Of course people posting shit because they are bored is a problem, but shutting them up in this way won't better the siatuation.
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Blizzard is just not the same company it once was.The last Blizzard game I really enjoyed was original World of Warcraft. Later they turned WoW into a cash-cow and they've been doing it with their games ever since. Diablo 3 was a huge disappointment. Blizzard were once gamers who made games for other gamers. Now they just care about profit.
I can't comment on LoL, since I never played that game, but Dota 2 is an incredible example of what a company with clear vision can make out of a game. I haven't played Dota 2 in couple of months. The other day I log in and there has been a dozen additions to the game. This keeps the game interesting, something that SC2 is sorely missing. Valve has done an amazing job with their game. Just look at Gabe Newell's interviews! Guy is so enthusiastic about Dota 2. Plus, it helps that lead game developer is Icefrog, the guy who developed Dota for free for 5-6 years.
Also, to all the elitists thinking that SC2 is incredibly difficult, while Dota is easy... The game only has a steep entry point. It's kind of like those old Nintendo / SNES games where there are dozen of enemies on the screen, missiles are flying from everywhere and the game control are so bad that you can't move an inch without dying. Are those games hard? Yes, but for all the wrong reasons. Now, SC2 obviously doesn't have bad controls, but same analogy can be applied. The game is just too unforgiving for casuals. Go for macro opening while your opponent goes for cheese? Sorry, you lose. Go for wrong army composition? Sorry, you lose. Casual players won't waste their time on frustrating 5 minute games. Especially not if they have to pay 100 bucks for it. Dota is free and has some great options for new players (tutorials, heroes having their roles listed, recommended items, cool stuff is being constantly added, etc).
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On August 10 2013 00:33 larse wrote:
The chat channel and game room argument again. You guys do realize that even if blizzard adds these features tomorrow, sc2 won't magically become popular. Lol is still way more popular than dota2 (don't get fooled by ti3's number) without most awesome features from dota2. The most fundamental is that the game needs to be fun to play for a greater amount of people. And this is not the case due to sc2's nature and the taste of today's gamer (don't get me wrong, it's fun to play for me and many people). They are good features to have but it can only boost the game's popularity in the margin.
Who cares whether SC2 is more popular than whatever other game.
The chat channel situation is probably the biggest issue this game has. It's asocial. This has a huge negative influence on creative initiatives and on the fun people have in game. Nothing is more important. It won't change anything overnight, but if it doesn't happen, things will never improve.
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On August 10 2013 00:41 Passion wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:33 larse wrote:
The chat channel and game room argument again. You guys do realize that even if blizzard adds these features tomorrow, sc2 won't magically become popular. Lol is still way more popular than dota2 (don't get fooled by ti3's number) without most awesome features from dota2. The most fundamental is that the game needs to be fun to play for a greater amount of people. And this is not the case due to sc2's nature and the taste of today's gamer (don't get me wrong, it's fun to play for me and many people). They are good features to have but it can only boost the game's popularity in the margin. Who cares whether SC2 is more popular than whatever other game. The chat channel situation is probably the biggest issue this game has. It's asocial. This has a huge negative influence on creative initiatives and on the fun people have in game. Nothing is more important. It won't change anything overnight, but if it doesn't happen, things will never improve.
The whole strelok's article is about Why sc2 is not popular.......
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Really hate the mindset of this post. I can understand where it's coming from, but I still feel strongly negative about it.
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I think the biggest difference between Blizz and the rest is this: They are in it for the money. This is not inherently bad(at least for Ferengis which they clearly are) but it means that content can suffer(hows Diablo 3 holding up?) I really like Gabe's mindset after watching him talk a bit about Dota and corporate structure. He realizes that if you care about the game and the community the money will follow from your effort.
Imagine if Blizzard was focused on building a sport, which Valve and Riot(so I hear and see with numbers) clearly are doing well (at least currently), instead of making money. Corporations work best when they are working to meet the needs of the consumer. Corporations will still work if they are working to make money and meet the needs of the consumer as a byproduct. WHen I bought WOL, that should have been my one purchase to them and it should have come with all of the expansions. Why? BEcause the expansions didnt really add a whole new game they added a couple new units, cause I really dont care about the single player honestly and what little I have played of both are just ok, THis is not worth buying a full priced game basically as an expansion. This is minor and a quibble because I can afford it, and to my ever lasting shame I bought, at full price, HOTS. I will not buy LOV.
I really hate to use the cliche but: they held onto that butterfly to tightly when it was first hatched and not its wings are mangled and barely functioning. They have flown this far, but I am not sure how much farther they can fly. I also think that having WCS during the International is both stupid and childish. It seems they are but hurt about losing the DOTA IP and wanted to hurt them so there is a chance, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, for Blizzards All Stars to take off.
Blizzard has quickly been eclipsed as sees this and is starting to panic.
I just want to end this rant with this: I loved SC and SC BW. I was not into the pro scenes of either but still played the shit out of them with friends and family. I really loved WOL and was hoping that Blizz was just a little rusty after being stuck in the WOW hole for so long. But that rust never wore off. And to quote the coolest cat ever "This deal is getting worse all the time." But just like the movie Blizzard's general response has been "Pray that I do not alter it any further"
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On August 09 2013 22:44 LaLuSh wrote:
Unfortunately changes at this stage will have no effect anyway.
I never thought infestor or whatever was the balance whine of the "current period" was ever the biggest problem with SC2 -- it was just something people focus their whine on because they think it's the main problem of gameplay. The gameplay's biggest problmes are definitely things you can't ever change with a simple balance patch, so the result is that nobody whines about them.
You max much faster. You reach max number bases faster. Your economy develops faster (...so you hit all caps faster). The game is faster (but defender's advantage is paradoxically... weaker).
So Blizz put in more and more changes so nobody has to die early game to compensate for no defender's advantage... Queen range, Mothership core, Mines, Spores with no evo, ... (not to mention that everything early/mid game has been havily nerfed since WoL to compensate for no defender advantage, game being faster and reaching max quicker: stim research time, blink research time, zealot build time increased, supply before barracks and barracks build time increased, siege tank damage decrease, khaydarian removed, ghost snipe nerf, ghost EMP nerf, reaper build time increase, nexus life and zerg building life increase, warp gate research time increase). All necessary because units are produced in a different way in SC2, and because the game is faster and hits all artificial caps (supply, max bases economy) earlier. If I counted all changes in beta as well to make the point...
Even more matches now go to max supply, max economy, max bases. When SC2 games go to max supply and 3 bases, they are no longer Starcraft games... they become Warcraft 3 games. Nobody wants to attack. Just babysit army like it's a hero.
More likely reason why every non top level Terran quits is because Terran is the only race that still produces units like Brood War. So you have to have some brains and huge amounts of aggression to be succesful.
If I remember hearing correctly, Blizzard designed the game to be played on a lower speed setting.
First battle report for reference: Battle Report # 1
I agree with all of your statements and think that the easy fix is to slow the speed down. This will encourage early/mid game play (players will have more real time in these phases of the game), it will alleviate some of the dps issues (by definition, dps will go down), and it will take some of the randomness out of the game (players will have more time to scout and react). The last and probably the most important change that slowing the game down would bring is it will make the game much more accessible and less stressful to newcomers.
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Moba games for me, are so boring to watch and it's a spamm fest of kiddy spells and powers!
This is my view on this, please don't get upset, i understand if people like it but i can't stand it.
I also think that many things need to be done:
- Blizzard should stop asking money for organizations that want to run events
- Blizzars should make WCS region locked not nationality locked, i mean only people that live in that region could eventually participate, that way we can have in a couple of years a full broadcast offline like GSL and OSL
- More dialogue beetween blizzard, teams and pro players
- more spreading of seasons to allow more tournaments
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On August 10 2013 00:43 larse wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 00:41 Passion wrote:On August 10 2013 00:33 larse wrote:
The chat channel and game room argument again. You guys do realize that even if blizzard adds these features tomorrow, sc2 won't magically become popular. Lol is still way more popular than dota2 (don't get fooled by ti3's number) without most awesome features from dota2. The most fundamental is that the game needs to be fun to play for a greater amount of people. And this is not the case due to sc2's nature and the taste of today's gamer (don't get me wrong, it's fun to play for me and many people). They are good features to have but it can only boost the game's popularity in the margin. Who cares whether SC2 is more popular than whatever other game. The chat channel situation is probably the biggest issue this game has. It's asocial. This has a huge negative influence on creative initiatives and on the fun people have in game. Nothing is more important. It won't change anything overnight, but if it doesn't happen, things will never improve. The whole strelok's article is about Why sc2 is not popular.......
Yes. Not why it's less popular than game X. Thank you for your support.
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Is Dustin Browder still in charge of the game? Have not heard anything from him since HOTS came out.
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EPT
