EPTOn July 09 2013 02:33 Entirety wrote:
Blizzard just nerfed INnoVation!
Blizzard just nerfed INnoVation!
Blizzard nerfed macro?
Balance patch this week - Hellbats nerfed, Banshees buffed…
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DaemonX
545 Posts
Blizzard nerfed macro? | ||
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( bush
321 Posts
On July 10 2013 08:45 Xequecal wrote: 1/1/1 died because they removed all the maps it was broken on, which at one point was almost all of them. Beating 1/1/1 in WoL requires a choke out of range of your natural that you can drop FFs and stall, which no maps had then and almost all do now. I can definitely see it coming back on a few maps now that don't have any chokes since you can get a PDD to totally negate the nexus cannon, like Neo Planet S where you can siege your tanks behind that little stump making up the natural choke and still hit the nexus. I dont see it coming back. Did you see what made it disappear in WoL? It was mostly a metagame development thing, in the end of WoL nobody was doing that anymore. I see you talking about PDD to negate nexus cannon and in WoL it was used to negate stalker shots but still, the build was not being used anymore. Nexus Cannon almost nullifies any 1 base terran strategy. | ||
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IgnE
United States7681 Posts
On July 10 2013 08:13 LOLZEY wrote: Anyone think the banshee cloak buff would make 1-1-1 stronger versus toss? you can now go Raven first AND still get cloakshees in time. With a faster raven and free siege, you can throw down 2 pdds :O Don't understand what you are thinking. Have you been seen HOTS? | ||
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dirtydurb82
United States178 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On July 10 2013 08:13 LOLZEY wrote: Anyone think the banshee cloak buff would make 1-1-1 stronger versus toss? you can now go Raven first AND still get cloakshees in time. With a faster raven and free siege, you can throw down 2 pdds :O Protoss still has nexus cannon so shouldn't matter. | ||
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FeyFey
Germany10114 Posts
On July 10 2013 08:48 Spec wrote: I wonder if they did any internal testing... since there was no call to balance this time. It might still be that the timing is still good enough in TvT that everyone just get the upgrade then proceed to hellbat drop each other anyways. It'd be the funniest thing. http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/10223258/call-to-action-june-14-balance-testing-6-14-2013 you only missed it, had a ton of time to test around. | ||
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EleanorRIgby
Canada3923 Posts
like in tvp now you have to get a techlab factory and research blue flame and then get reactor. | ||
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Matt_D_
Australia14 Posts
Main reason I like this change is: CHOICE. do you put down a tech lab for your starport and get super-cheap-cloak and skip on reactored medivacs? or do you stick a techlab down for blue flame? or do you do both and swap starport/factory over once the initial banshe(s) are out. choice GOOD!. | ||
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MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
On July 10 2013 14:18 Matt_D_ wrote: HELL YES Main reason I like this change is: CHOICE. do you put down a tech lab for your starport and get super-cheap-cloak and skip on reactored medivacs? or do you stick a techlab down for blue flame? or do you do both and swap starport/factory over once the initial banshe(s) are out. choice GOOD!. While choice is good, rock paper scissors is not. Cloak Banshees did lead to boring and coinflippy games in the past. Also, a cloak banshee catching you offguard is most likely end of your economy, a hellbat drop can be dealt with even unprepared. It will leave you behind, but you can minimize damage. Against a cloak banshee, having units is not enough and I dare to say it requires either a raven or more defensive investment compared to hellbat drops. At least 1 turret per economy and possibly one to cover production or to zone out the banshee. Furthermore cloak banshee in addition to free siege could make for very strong 1-1-1s against Terran. If you don'T open 1-1-1 yourself, you will not defend it or at least not "as easy" as hellbat drops. Its a very strong allin. | ||
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iCheeseUcry
United States18 Posts
On July 09 2013 02:33 Entirety wrote: Blizzard just nerfed INnoVation! This is my immediate reaction also. | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
A dumb reaction as well | ||
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Railgan
Switzerland1507 Posts
Onwards to Code B | ||
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
If anything, they've nerfed Bomber. | ||
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Foxxan
Sweden3427 Posts
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Kim Hyuna
Korea (South)264 Posts
On July 10 2013 16:16 NarutO wrote: While choice is good, rock paper scissors is not. Cloak Banshees did lead to boring and coinflippy games in the past. Also, a cloak banshee catching you offguard is most likely end of your economy, a hellbat drop can be dealt with even unprepared. It will leave you behind, but you can minimize damage. Against a cloak banshee, having units is not enough and I dare to say it requires either a raven or more defensive investment compared to hellbat drops. At least 1 turret per economy and possibly one to cover production or to zone out the banshee. Furthermore cloak banshee in addition to free siege could make for very strong 1-1-1s against Terran. If you don'T open 1-1-1 yourself, you will not defend it or at least not "as easy" as hellbat drops. Its a very strong allin. Yes. It makes 1/1/1 very strong because of the cloak buffed. Free siege without research and now reduce research for cloak. What? It makes window mines or hellbat drops pretty less to be used on ladder. | ||
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Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
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dargul
Russian Federation125 Posts
They should buf banshee speed instead. As for blue flame grade it's a big question what is better drop 2 hellbat with flame or 4 hellions with flame. Main reason why hellbats was so good is that they could kill workers with 2 shots. Now without flame they will need 3 shots. It's the same thing as hellions, except that you can;t run from hellions and the yhave greater splash | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9847 Posts
this is just an immediate reaction though, i haven't tried to think through the consequences or anything. | ||
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Ameisenmann
Albania296 Posts
So overall I think it's an ok change, but far from perfect. I mean banshee openings aren't "exciting to watch" either compared to hellbat drops. | ||
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