On April 11 2013 02:11 tuho12345 wrote: this bullshit thing is gonna hurt GSL code S so badly. Fuckkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk, GSL won't be the same anymore without MVP, MC, Nestea, MMA
On April 11 2013 01:53 Dexington wrote: Sweet, WCS NA is now GSL. Blizzard has effectively killed the NA scene in my opinion by allowing this many Koreans to play in NA.
Hey now, there wasn't much of a scene to ruin. While this is still nowhere near what it should have been (i.e a proper NA GSL), it's still much better than the nothing they had before.
The tournament fucked over most by this is the GSL and the Korean scene which just lost a bunch of great players.
They didn't "lose" them. The players choose to go outside of Korea in the hope of making money. How does that fuck over the Korean scene? If anything, it leaves room for new players to make a name for themselves. As far as I can tell, this means more money from outside Korea to Korean players.
There will probably need to be a culling of heads in the Korean SC2 scene, but that is because there are too many SC2 progamers and because SC2 is not very popular in SK. The home market is not able to support them. NOT because of Blizzard.
A lot of us liked having a tournament which was just the pure best of the best all the time no exceptions. We had that in Code S, we don't have that anymore.
That title will still easily be held by the the Korean WCS. Does it matter much for the quality of the league that MVP/Nestea/Center/Hyun etc will no longer play? I don't see it. It will lose some name recognition for sure, but very few of the very best are leaving, and there will be new names rising to the top. The Kespa-invasion really has only just begun.
I honestly feel more then 3/4 of the people in this thread hasnt actually stopped to think about the WCS and looking at it from BOTH freakin sides, before posting. The stupidity of some of these posts is astounding.
On April 11 2013 02:17 ronpaul012 wrote: Congrats to blizzard on completely mismanaging this tournament. The original idea is to have local tournaments and leagues for each location. While the message never seemed to change, they are now changing it to just 3 code S around the world. The better players will be winning more money, but that seems to be the complete opposite of what the intention for the WCS as initially.
You mean like they showed here? ^^
The idea of a Code S for each region is a way, way better idea that what we had last year. The EU/NA finals were good last year but most of the domestic tournaments sucked and while there is kind of a coolness to seeing who the best player in Bolivia or Peru is it doesn't really improve their scene like having all the American players playing together does.
Blizzard had a great idea for this they just fucked up by not having a residency rule.
On April 11 2013 00:46 vesicular wrote: Does nobody else realize that almost half of that NA list is EG-TL players? And that EG-TL players doing well is NA is great for teams like EG as a whole and TL, the site you're f'n POSTING on?
The stupidity of this forum is impressive to say the least.
Lol, just noticed that too.
As long as people are thinking entirely on the present and near future about their biases and wallets, stupid outcries like this are always bound to happen.
I'm pretty sure every NA pro had a raging boner that was immediately killed because they realized that they might actually have to compete for prize money. Once their perceived injury has been accepted through all the stages of grief they will realize that this is very good news for the long term. Blizzard didn't owe anyone anything of this scale, nor the money they injected into it. What makes NA/EU players more entitled to this money when they weren't really winning any of the big tournaments anyway? If this hadn't been done as it is Koreans would keep widening the gap until it became BW 2.0, and then no one would have any chance and SC2 would become a Seoul centered niche attraction.
Just because they can't cash in asap obviously means that it has already failed and that their is no hope, /s. True, the short term does not alleviate the immediate concerns, but in the end the outcome will hopefully reveal a much more internationally competitive and sustainable endeavor. Immediate and strict region locks would actually kill that off and it might be decades, if ever, until the 2nd rate NA/EU scenes might even take a single game off a KR in Global Finals.
Blizzard has stated, numerous times very clearly that they intend to transition into fully region locked offline only tournaments. I already shared my view on why this is significantly beneficial. If these pros are suggesting that they might as well retire because of the WCS system, then they should have done it a year ago. But looking at the prize distribution of these regional WCS it seems to me that these foreigners have a greater chance of winning more money more often than they have this entire past year. Subjective bias is always present and constant, and the level of idiotic statements reflect that.
How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it.
If you try to play 10 hours a day in NA you can't because NA doesn't have the infrastructure that Korea has, you don't have a team backing you or a job for money you're gonna starve trying to keep up with the Koreans that are farming NA for money.
I think your idea is great that the people who can't keep up in the scene should just retire and people that can't break through because they have zero opportunities to shine and have to play against players that can practice 10 hours a day without worrying about anything else.
Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it.
Ok, let's say WCS wasn't announced and Blizzard did nothing to change the status quo. What then? Oh right, and I'm going to quote you: "Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it."
Long run
Long term
Ostensibly bad
Eventually good
"How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it." - Blizzard wants to make this a reality. To expect that it will happen in 5 months? Please, have realistic expectations. I don't want to explain something I've already written in this thread so I kindly ask you, for my sake, to read my earlier post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=407158¤tpage=56#1113
If Blizzard didn't want to someone else would have tried, It's great that Blizzard is making this effort and I was fucking excited when I read about it, it doesn't mean that the system they are creating can't be criticized. WCS was awesome last year and I actually learned about a lot of NA players that I had never really heard of because of it. There is no way that it will happen in 5 months, but with the way they are doing it now it's NEVER going to be a reality because people can't even dream about it when they're going to get beat down by players who have more time and a better environment to practice.
I read your previous post but I don't understand how Blizzard is going to create infrastructure to have everything offline with what they're doing now, I wish I could ask someone at Blizzard what their plan is because I can't figure it out. I don't see how a team like LG - IM could afford to relocate to a team house in Germany because it will be a lot more expensive then the one in Korea with travel costs included, also the esf teams don't have that much money, I think if we grow the NA scene and get more team houses in NA then LG - IM can partner up with them and have some players move over just like foreigners do now. I guess we'll have to wait and see if the combined SKLG - IM has enough money to do it Europe.
LG-IM has ~10 sponsors...... Not all eSF teams are broke you know.
They were asking us to send facebook messages to LG not so long ago to help them out.
On April 11 2013 02:35 LighT. wrote: I honestly feel more then 3/4 of the people in this thread hasnt actually stopped to think about the WCS and looking at it from BOTH freakin sides, before posting. The stupidity of some of these posts is astounding.
There is a lot of knee-jerking, I agree, but I really don't see the upside in NA (past season 1). Korea looks fine (especially with a better prize distribution), EU looks pretty brilliant, but the US players are somewhat shafted with the flooding of Koreans.
The current system mainly benefits Korean players on foreign teams and foreign teams who have invested in Korean players (over US ones). Are they really meant to be the main beneficiaries of the system?
On April 11 2013 02:21 LighT. wrote: Look at other sports. Basketball as a prime example. You have the NBA, the Euroleague and then smaller leagues like the Chinese basketball association, Korean basketball association etc. During lock out years that just happened recently you had an influx of NBA stars going to the Euroleague, the CBA and dominating the competition (because..you know they're top of the class) Was there complaints about how this is going to ruin their league because it's going to deter people from trying to make basketball a profession? No. If anything it encouraged. I see the Koreans coming to the NA in the same way.
none of it helped.
the only way to become the best basketball player on the planet is to leave your country and play in the NCAA/NBA AND learn how to speak ENGLISH... that was true in 1970 and it remains true today.
if you want to be the best Starcraft player on the planet you must move to korea.. live their 12 months out of the year and learn how to speak KOREAN AND ASSIMILATE. so far ... only grrrr elected to go that route... and he is still the only real foreign starcraft world champion.
this WCS format changes nothing... they are just shuffling around some cash... and manipulating a few high level rules.
a new WCS rules set is irrelavent. you want to be the best Starcraft player on the planet even though you were born outside korea. do what grrr did. end of story.
My problem is rather simple: I firmly believe an American should represent North America, a European should represent Europe and a Korean should represent Korea. + Show Spoiler +
The lack of Africa is understandable, leaving out China and SEA is not.
On April 10 2013 22:23 avilo wrote: This is pretty terrible lmao. The entire point of WCS and this initiative was to get other countries/regions to have an ecosystem of their own, as well as infuse prize money that those players in those regions could feasibly win.
Instead, what we have set up is a system where blizzard basically said, "here koreans, free moneys, foreigners...screw you." Perhaps that was not their intention, but that's going to be the result.
So what is the incentive here for people to train, and invest their own money to go to events, etc? You know a korean with 10x the training, a team house, team backing will be at the event.
Oh wait, I got that wrong. Instead of a few like previously, now it's going to be 15+ all here to take your region's cash lol.
This is insanely stupid. Imagine the Olympics allowing NBA teams to play "in any region." I can imagine it now.
"Welcome to the 2016 Olympic basketball finals! Your finalists, China's LA lakers, Russia's Boston Celtics, Canada's Clippers," wait a minute...what happened to the other countries basketball teams?
How does this prevent the various regions to have their own ecosystem in any way?
How does Blizzard offering "foreigners" (though I don't understand the relevance of "foreigners" in this context) a chance to win more money by playing a game translate into "foreigner... screw you"?
What the incentive is? Good question. However, given the amount of cash available, I sure do hope these people don't train and go to events to make a living, as 99% of them will never manage such, despite the extra money Blizzard is putting on the table. I hope that it's, like in any sport, the fact that they enjoy the game and enjoy being competitive. Training to earn cash only becomes relevant after you've gone professional.
Your region's cash? First of all, what the hell makes you feel so entitled to that money? Though more importantly maybe, why should people from with different nationalities not be allowed to participate in a tournament located in "your region"? Sure it's good to also have national championships, however, this never was intended to be such.
NBA teams at the Olympics? You really have a hard time understanding competitive sports, don't you? Besides, if you look at other sports like you do, this luckily happens all the time. Half of the average football squad consists of foreign players. They improve quality, mix things up and keep the leagues interesting. I'm pretty certain the premier league wouldn't be the most entertaining competition in the world if it weren't for this.
Obviously Blizzard isn't doing thing perfectly, but it seems a good effort at setting up a global league system, something that has direly been missing in SC2. It's basically the next step towards having a truly professional competitive scene. It's good (EVEN if only for the extra cash spent). What ever mistakes they make, they'll learn from those. All this bitching and whining is totally uncalled for (without meaning to say we shouldn't give feedback, once we bump into issues, not before) - even though I realise it was inevitable, given how entitled and narrow minded this community has seem to become.
It is not rocket science to understand. Blizzard intended this to help stimulate each region's player base, not turn NA into Korea2, and EU into Korea3.
You're one of those people that has no clue. You're blanket calling people "entitled and narrow minded." You don't see the larger picture, that this does not help facilitate NA/EU growth.
Apparently, you also have no understanding of real sports or progression systems. You don't join a local basketball qualifer tournament and have to play against Lebron James straight away if you're a basketball player. That would be ridiculous.
You start with your local region, you win that, you go to regionals, then national level, pro level, etc. There has to be a progression.
Yes, professional sports have athletes from other countries, but you're dellusional if you think that players from other countries are joining another countries NATIONAL TEAM. Sports do not work like that.
Read Catz post from reddit. He basically covers and echos the thoughts of rational minded people in the foreign scene.
You might be sad that top level players in each region will have to be imported from Korea on the short run, but this doesn't turn said region into Korea2 or 3 - if only because those players moving there won't be in Korea anymore. Having a top division that's worth watching in fact helps the local competition.
And there we have it. Top division. You even mention the topic yourself: progression system! The WCS is not a local basketball qualifier. It's a place where the absolute best compete, in order to give a great show, a showcase of the sport.
I'm all for having such a progression system, and so seems Blizzard, as this seems to be exactly what they're trying to create here, starting by setting up the top layers.
However, I don't get why you think this means they ought to set up charity matches exclusively for American or European players. This seems to be the main point you're not getting. This is the Champions League, not the World Cup or some national tournament. Perhaps you don't like it, but that's what they're offering. (Not to get me wrong, a large scale world cup sounds awesome as well.) Edit: Also, for all existing sports, you can sign yourself or your team into a local competition and compete. This doesn't depend on your nationality in any way.
Catz makes some interesting point and I see where he's coming from (there's plenty I disagree with a well), and there's no one saying the international competitive SC2 scene is perfect right now. However, this won't be fixed that easily, and while there are other things that can and should be done, these effort on the WCS are definitely a good thing and a step in the right direction. To give one example, Koreans moving to NA/EU will create an competition worth watching, while also result in them bringing the Korean esports knowledge/mentality/(team house)infrastructure to these places. Local players will benefit a lot more from this than giving the top 3 NA/EU players a little bit of cash.
Ps. "its not rocket science", "you're one of those people that has no clue", "you have no understanding", "you don't see the larger picture", "you're delusional", "rational people" while not posting a single good point and failing to understand a word I write... kind of sad. Makes me think... Kind of sad I'm still trying to explain as well.
You still don't seem to grasp the concept of local/regional/national events and organizations that help grow a scene within that community. No one is arguing they don't want to see the best players play.
This league is meant to promote regional play, meaning the best of the best from that region fight it out and then fight the top dogs (aka the koreans).
What it's not supposed to be is you just import koreans, destroy all local competition that has no chance to develop, and then say, "job well done, all the best players are playing."
The point is basically flying way over your head. It's about developing the NA/EU scenes. You have no "free money" argument. The local competition earns those prizes.
Also, spectators want people to root for. Not just koreans. That's another thing you don't seem to get. How the fuck do you think this "e-sport" looks to people outside of this niche viewing audience/market? "Oh, wow, all koreans...let's go watch NFL, this asian stuff is boring." -> that's an outsider perspective or the common person that is not a massively educated viewer.
You seem to think this is about "giving NA/EU players free cash" then yes, you're missing the entire point. Your point of view is very short sighted, or you must be in your teens and not understand how the real world works.
Why does everyone think blizzard meant to promote regional play with this? It looks like the plan was to make new GSL's in NA/EU timeones... with constant high level gameplay going on, and last year many people were asking/hoping for something like this.
Regional play is a different thing, where there is a period of low level play ( nationals ) , period of mid-level play (regionals) and then period of high level play, or in startcraft terms bunch of onesided curbstompage ( world finals ) - completely different concept.
Now - allowing bunch of koreans to play in NA/EU GSL looks scary, but there are tons of hurdles in the way - mostly the lan part that already has GSTL/Proleague conflicts for most of the players listed in OP. And the lan part will only grow, so only option will be to move over here - and for that they need a team house, and in that team house they might need a coach and more practice partners - many of them possibly locals --- and that is what blizzard is hoping for in the long run.
For nation-pride , and domestic leagues there very likely will be other tourneys (like WCG) where pro's could wave their flag around awkwardly.
On April 11 2013 02:43 Xacez wrote: My problem is rather simple: I firmly believe an American should represent North America, a European should represent Europe and a Korean should represent Korea. + Show Spoiler +
The lack of Africa is understandable, leaving out China and SEA is not.
And south america. But seems like we should want koreans representing us, because they win shit.
Meh sorry for the bitterness, but this thread had taken the best of me, specially the bashing on foreigners players "wanting ez money" like the koreans going to play on NA are doing it as charity.
My worry is the short-term. This screw short term, and progamers careers aren't right now long enough, so i don't understand why they wouldn't complain about it.
On April 11 2013 02:17 ronpaul012 wrote: Congrats to blizzard on completely mismanaging this tournament. The original idea is to have local tournaments and leagues for each location. While the message never seemed to change, they are now changing it to just 3 code S around the world. The better players will be winning more money, but that seems to be the complete opposite of what the intention for the WCS as initially.
The idea of a Code S for each region is a way, way better idea that what we had last year. The EU/NA finals were good last year but most of the domestic tournaments sucked and while there is kind of a coolness to seeing who the best player in Bolivia or Peru is it doesn't really improve their scene like having all the American players playing together does.
Blizzard had a great idea for this they just fucked up by not having a residency rule.
Ok so with this residency rule how should players outside of Korea, NA and EU get to play? You can't get a residence ship that fast lol.
Blizzard have said that they will want to move it to entirely offline so at the end of this year or next year you will pretty much need that anyway to compete in time anyway so it will sort itself out without fucking people in the bum.
On April 11 2013 02:11 tuho12345 wrote: this bullshit thing is gonna hurt GSL code S so badly. Fuckkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk, GSL won't be the same anymore without MVP, MC, Nestea, MMA
I was actually looking forward to something just like LoL's LCS regional tournments that fed into one big showdown. I don't think Im alone in wanting to watch an NA only tournament. Will it be the best starcraft? No. But it will be some of my persnal favourite players playing, and bigger chances for a breakout star. Right now it looks like GSL NA
Yes the koreans are the best, But whats wrong with crowning regional champions for everyone to cheer for.
Blizzcon final could be 16players. 4 NA 4 EU 8 korean. That gives the koreans ( the best players) more spots, as well as leaving the NA and EU scenes alone to at least have a shot on the big stage. The amount of koreans in the NA WCS is more than comical, its downright stupid.
On April 11 2013 00:46 vesicular wrote: Does nobody else realize that almost half of that NA list is EG-TL players? And that EG-TL players doing well is NA is great for teams like EG as a whole and TL, the site you're f'n POSTING on?
The stupidity of this forum is impressive to say the least.
Lol, just noticed that too.
As long as people are thinking entirely on the present and near future about their biases and wallets, stupid outcries like this are always bound to happen.
I'm pretty sure every NA pro had a raging boner that was immediately killed because they realized that they might actually have to compete for prize money. Once their perceived injury has been accepted through all the stages of grief they will realize that this is very good news for the long term. Blizzard didn't owe anyone anything of this scale, nor the money they injected into it. What makes NA/EU players more entitled to this money when they weren't really winning any of the big tournaments anyway? If this hadn't been done as it is Koreans would keep widening the gap until it became BW 2.0, and then no one would have any chance and SC2 would become a Seoul centered niche attraction.
Just because they can't cash in asap obviously means that it has already failed and that their is no hope, /s. True, the short term does not alleviate the immediate concerns, but in the end the outcome will hopefully reveal a much more internationally competitive and sustainable endeavor. Immediate and strict region locks would actually kill that off and it might be decades, if ever, until the 2nd rate NA/EU scenes might even take a single game off a KR in Global Finals.
Blizzard has stated, numerous times very clearly that they intend to transition into fully region locked offline only tournaments. I already shared my view on why this is significantly beneficial. If these pros are suggesting that they might as well retire because of the WCS system, then they should have done it a year ago. But looking at the prize distribution of these regional WCS it seems to me that these foreigners have a greater chance of winning more money more often than they have this entire past year. Subjective bias is always present and constant, and the level of idiotic statements reflect that.
How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it.
If you try to play 10 hours a day in NA you can't because NA doesn't have the infrastructure that Korea has, you don't have a team backing you or a job for money you're gonna starve trying to keep up with the Koreans that are farming NA for money.
I think your idea is great that the people who can't keep up in the scene should just retire and people that can't break through because they have zero opportunities to shine and have to play against players that can practice 10 hours a day without worrying about anything else.
Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it.
Ok, let's say WCS wasn't announced and Blizzard did nothing to change the status quo. What then? Oh right, and I'm going to quote you: "Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it."
Long run
Long term
Ostensibly bad
Eventually good
"How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it." - Blizzard wants to make this a reality. To expect that it will happen in 5 months? Please, have realistic expectations. I don't want to explain something I've already written in this thread so I kindly ask you, for my sake, to read my earlier post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=407158¤tpage=56#1113
If Blizzard didn't want to someone else would have tried, It's great that Blizzard is making this effort and I was fucking excited when I read about it, it doesn't mean that the system they are creating can't be criticized. WCS was awesome last year and I actually learned about a lot of NA players that I had never really heard of because of it. There is no way that it will happen in 5 months, but with the way they are doing it now it's NEVER going to be a reality because people can't even dream about it when they're going to get beat down by players who have more time and a better environment to practice.
I read your previous post but I don't understand how Blizzard is going to create infrastructure to have everything offline with what they're doing now, I wish I could ask someone at Blizzard what their plan is because I can't figure it out. I don't see how a team like LG - IM could afford to relocate to a team house in Germany because it will be a lot more expensive then the one in Korea with travel costs included, also the esf teams don't have that much money, I think if we grow the NA scene and get more team houses in NA then LG - IM can partner up with them and have some players move over just like foreigners do now. I guess we'll have to wait and see if the combined SKLG - IM has enough money to do it Europe.
LG-IM has ~10 sponsors...... Not all eSF teams are broke you know.
They were asking us to send facebook messages to LG not so long ago to help them out.
Well not because they were poor, because they wanted to make sure they continued being funded (which they are)
On April 11 2013 02:35 LighT. wrote: I honestly feel more then 3/4 of the people in this thread hasnt actually stopped to think about the WCS and looking at it from BOTH freakin sides, before posting. The stupidity of some of these posts is astounding.
There is a lot of knee-jerking, I agree, but I really don't see the upside in NA (past season 1). Korea looks fine (especially with a better prize distribution), EU looks pretty brilliant, but the US players are somewhat shafted with the flooding of Koreans.
The current system mainly benefits Korean players on foreign teams and foreign teams who have invested in Korean players (over US ones). Are they really meant to be the main beneficiaries of the system?
What blizzard wants is esports growth. How they perceive esports growth in my opinion is different from others. They do not care about the rise of amateur small market team/clans. They want to cultivate the current crop of foreign teams (complexity, Quantic, Evil Geniuses, Root Gaming) and indirectlygive them additional funding. Remember: Quantic was dropping a lot of its players, Roots is just starting up, Complexity was in shambles and still might be not too long ago. What they want to do is firmly establish the roots of the known teams before transitioning into smaller branches.
The main beneficiaries are the teams that are on the fringe looking up, or teams that is on the decline that could take a nice boost to keep them afloat.. And Evil Geniuses.
On April 11 2013 00:46 vesicular wrote: Does nobody else realize that almost half of that NA list is EG-TL players? And that EG-TL players doing well is NA is great for teams like EG as a whole and TL, the site you're f'n POSTING on?
The stupidity of this forum is impressive to say the least.
Lol, just noticed that too.
As long as people are thinking entirely on the present and near future about their biases and wallets, stupid outcries like this are always bound to happen.
I'm pretty sure every NA pro had a raging boner that was immediately killed because they realized that they might actually have to compete for prize money. Once their perceived injury has been accepted through all the stages of grief they will realize that this is very good news for the long term. Blizzard didn't owe anyone anything of this scale, nor the money they injected into it. What makes NA/EU players more entitled to this money when they weren't really winning any of the big tournaments anyway? If this hadn't been done as it is Koreans would keep widening the gap until it became BW 2.0, and then no one would have any chance and SC2 would become a Seoul centered niche attraction.
Just because they can't cash in asap obviously means that it has already failed and that their is no hope, /s. True, the short term does not alleviate the immediate concerns, but in the end the outcome will hopefully reveal a much more internationally competitive and sustainable endeavor. Immediate and strict region locks would actually kill that off and it might be decades, if ever, until the 2nd rate NA/EU scenes might even take a single game off a KR in Global Finals.
Blizzard has stated, numerous times very clearly that they intend to transition into fully region locked offline only tournaments. I already shared my view on why this is significantly beneficial. If these pros are suggesting that they might as well retire because of the WCS system, then they should have done it a year ago. But looking at the prize distribution of these regional WCS it seems to me that these foreigners have a greater chance of winning more money more often than they have this entire past year. Subjective bias is always present and constant, and the level of idiotic statements reflect that.
How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it.
If you try to play 10 hours a day in NA you can't because NA doesn't have the infrastructure that Korea has, you don't have a team backing you or a job for money you're gonna starve trying to keep up with the Koreans that are farming NA for money.
I think your idea is great that the people who can't keep up in the scene should just retire and people that can't break through because they have zero opportunities to shine and have to play against players that can practice 10 hours a day without worrying about anything else.
Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it.
Ok, let's say WCS wasn't announced and Blizzard did nothing to change the status quo. What then? Oh right, and I'm going to quote you: "Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it."
Long run
Long term
Ostensibly bad
Eventually good
"How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it." - Blizzard wants to make this a reality. To expect that it will happen in 5 months? Please, have realistic expectations. I don't want to explain something I've already written in this thread so I kindly ask you, for my sake, to read my earlier post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=407158¤tpage=56#1113
If Blizzard didn't want to someone else would have tried, It's great that Blizzard is making this effort and I was fucking excited when I read about it, it doesn't mean that the system they are creating can't be criticized. WCS was awesome last year and I actually learned about a lot of NA players that I had never really heard of because of it. There is no way that it will happen in 5 months, but with the way they are doing it now it's NEVER going to be a reality because people can't even dream about it when they're going to get beat down by players who have more time and a better environment to practice.
I read your previous post but I don't understand how Blizzard is going to create infrastructure to have everything offline with what they're doing now, I wish I could ask someone at Blizzard what their plan is because I can't figure it out. I don't see how a team like LG - IM could afford to relocate to a team house in Germany because it will be a lot more expensive then the one in Korea with travel costs included, also the esf teams don't have that much money, I think if we grow the NA scene and get more team houses in NA then LG - IM can partner up with them and have some players move over just like foreigners do now. I guess we'll have to wait and see if the combined SKLG - IM has enough money to do it Europe.
LG-IM has ~10 sponsors...... Not all eSF teams are broke you know.
They were asking us to send facebook messages to LG not so long ago to help them out.
Well not because they were poor, because they wanted to make sure they continued being funded (which they are)
My cynical self was thinking that they weren't asking to be continued funded, but in an increase in funding.
EPT
