|
United States4883 Posts
Well...10 minutes into the campaign and I was wondering which 15 year-old wrote the script. The script and voice acting are quite horrible, the storyline falls flat on its face. The only thing this campaign had going for it was a handful of scenes with Kerrigan killing stuff and the fun of playing around with Kerrigan in-game. It had its moments, like the scene where Kerrigan saves Raynor, but they're few and far between, and even then, the script is barely tolerable. Overall, the missions were SUPER easy, even on brutal. But it's always fun to ram jumping banelings down your opponent's throat, so I guess I'm okay on that.
But seriously, the moment Blizzard tried to start to "characterize" the characters in SC2, they lost a ton of depth, ironically. I honestly enjoyed much more of the professional talk, the feeling of being a commander, the awesome feeling of interacting with the characters from purely a second-person view; all this BW had. It allowed you to guess more into the character's life, to see emotion only at the most important times, etc. In addition, macro actually mattered in the BW campaign, something I LOVED; in HotS, the only skill you need is microing Kerrigan. If I wanted to micro, I'd go back and play the WC3 campaign...which I might, because at least Arthas is a more interesting character than Kerrigan ends up being in HotS.
All in all, at least it's better than the WoL campaign, albeit a lot shorter.
|
United States4883 Posts
On March 15 2013 14:12 Slaughter wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 14:06 paralleluniverse wrote:On March 15 2013 13:34 Slaughter wrote:
Maybe because Blizz is probably targeting people 10-18ish when they write their story campaign? I dunno the older crowd who grew up on Brood War are already hooked and I think are most likely to buy the game for the multiplayer. The single player campaign seems to be something that is targeted at newer players who most likely will be in that younger demographic. Starcraft came out when I was 12 and I grew up playing the shit out of SC and BW. Hell I spent an ungodly amount of time on Bnet back then lol and I loved the campaign then and as a 26 year old now I like the campaign story in SC2. Its a different style (I also am a huge sucker for love stories >_>) and I do agree with the people who say the old way was better (having a bigger perspective is better imo) I mean we don't know jack about what the Protoss are doing in two games outside of some small appearances and Zeratul doing his best impersonation of roaming crazy man who comes out of no where to scream "DOOM IS COMING".
I actually resented Zeratul a bit because he basically told Kerrigan "Go get rezergified for the greater good!" I wanted her to remain humanish. You base this on what? The average age of gamers is in the 30s. So targeting 10-18 year olds would mean that they're not going where the money's at. In fact your Disneyesque ideas on what the story should have been is more consistent with stories for 10-18 year olds. Where i'm going with is that older gamers are already going to buy the game and are likely to be more concerned with the multiplayer so they aren't as concerned with how the older crowd views the story itself. Younger gamers will be more inclined to be more interested in the story because they haven't played the 1st game and thats what everyone seems to be saying "story for 12 year olds" so Blizz wrote it that way.
Dude, I totally agree. When I originally played WC3, I read that fucking manual and all of the history. I know my fucking War of The Ancients damnit!! I ain't gonna be thrown off by that in the campaign!! Just give younger generations some reading material to go along with SC2....
|
On March 15 2013 15:13 BreakPointSC wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 14:49 Slaughter wrote:On March 15 2013 14:34 paralleluniverse wrote:On March 15 2013 14:12 Slaughter wrote:On March 15 2013 14:06 paralleluniverse wrote:On March 15 2013 13:34 Slaughter wrote:
Maybe because Blizz is probably targeting people 10-18ish when they write their story campaign? I dunno the older crowd who grew up on Brood War are already hooked and I think are most likely to buy the game for the multiplayer. The single player campaign seems to be something that is targeted at newer players who most likely will be in that younger demographic. Starcraft came out when I was 12 and I grew up playing the shit out of SC and BW. Hell I spent an ungodly amount of time on Bnet back then lol and I loved the campaign then and as a 26 year old now I like the campaign story in SC2. Its a different style (I also am a huge sucker for love stories >_>) and I do agree with the people who say the old way was better (having a bigger perspective is better imo) I mean we don't know jack about what the Protoss are doing in two games outside of some small appearances and Zeratul doing his best impersonation of roaming crazy man who comes out of no where to scream "DOOM IS COMING".
I actually resented Zeratul a bit because he basically told Kerrigan "Go get rezergified for the greater good!" I wanted her to remain humanish. You base this on what? The average age of gamers is in the 30s. So targeting 10-18 year olds would mean that they're not going where the money's at. In fact your Disneyesque ideas on what the story should have been is more consistent with stories for 10-18 year olds. Where i'm going with is that older gamers are already going to buy the game and are likely to be more concerned with the multiplayer so they aren't as concerned with how the older crowd views the story itself. Younger gamers will be more inclined to be more interested in the story because they haven't played the 1st game and thats what everyone seems to be saying "story for 12 year olds" so Blizz wrote it that way. You keep making things up. I said it as speculation, I never said it was the actual truth. your argument is very flawed and i think most people will agree they could have done a better job with the plot. basing your defence on demographics when you have no idea about the complexities of the area is not a good idea
Wasn't an argument lol. I was simply speculating as to why the plot seems the way a lot of people are perceiving it to be. And you saying "most people will agree" is also flawed because there are also quite a bit of people out there who are satisfied/like the plot.
|
You're expecting the second coming of Shakespeare or a story so good that it's the story to end all stories.
I hate to tell you this but if that's what you want, sorry but if this game ain't gonna offer that to you. It's funny that just about every sci-fi movie ever made, has so many glaring and absurd plot-holes that you guys are completely and utterly willing to overlook - and yet all of a sudden, when HOTS doesn't measure up to the latest Star Trek film(which was only average) - you're up in arms.
Prometheus. A movie in every respect worse than Aliens(1986). Where were you guys on Prometheus?
Remember the Borg queen revealed in TNG movie? The sci-fi community unanimously decreed that even the idea of a so-called queen - weakened the entire concept of the Borg. Where were you guys on the Borg Queen?
What about the way Captain Kirk's death was handled? Where the hell were you guys on that one?
--
Don't even talk about how bad HOTS campaign was, if you can't even answer as to why you didn't protest all those other sci-fi events and storylines far preceding HOTS.
|
The side characters were developed pretty well in WOL I can't even name a side character in HOTS.
The general direction of the plot line doesn't sit to well with me the actual telling of it is okay it just feels like they didn't really build off of SC and BW ,but just made up their own story using a few facts and the same characters.
It also feels like it assumes there was more character development in BW than their actually was i.e. when did mengsk become a super genius/evil mastermind BW made him out to be some guy who recruited masterminds who did all his work for him.
Kerrigan even made specific mention of mengsk being useless without duke in BW then the SC2 writers just sort of assumed we knew that mengsk had become some sort of evil genius as opposed to just an evil guy who hired talent.
My biggest complaint is that half the campaign could have been cut out completely since it added nothing to the plot line basically raynor get's captured in mission 2. Kerrigan does a bunch of travelling around meeting various zerg who contribute next to nothing.
Then the unrelated stukov events happen.
Then raynor get's free'd and the final few missions happen.
The entire middle 16 missions could have been cut with no real effect on the plot line.
|
You're expecting the second coming of Shakespeare or a story so good that it's the story to end all stories.
I'm expecting a story at least as good as SC:BW, which was excellent despite its flaws.
when HOTS doesn't measure up to the latest Star Trek film(which was only average) - you're up in arms.
So what does it say if it can't measure up to something that's "only average"?
Prometheus. A movie in every respect worse than Aliens(1986). Where were you guys on Prometheus?
Check the Prometheus thread. You'll find plenty of haters like me.
|
On March 15 2013 09:56 ZenithM wrote:
People are having way higher expectations than they should. It's a video game story line, not a book.
Read some books dudes, it's just a video game.
A lot of herping and derping in this thread, much of it comes down to sentiments similar to this quote. "It's just a video game", "your expectations are too high", "go read a book instead". These sentiments are so hurtful to me, so dismissive of what video games can and should be, that I can only imagine that in 100 years people will read sentiments like these and shake their heads, they'll think "my god, were people really satisfied with that?". Or maybe I'm wrong, maybe in 100 years everything will be so bad, like imagine the Mike Judge film Idiocracy will be reality, that people will look back at the HotS campaign as a gem of 21st century storytelling. These are two extremes of what the future might look like, what I think is more likely is that nobody will remember Starcraft at all, it'll be just another Halo or Call of Duty or Command and Conquer, fun distractions of the time but nothing worth rememering. Which is a damn shame, it could've and should've been much more.
On March 15 2013 10:19 cullam wrote:
bw: Fenix: "The Khala awaits me, Kerrigan. And although I am prepared to face my destiny, you'll not find me easy prey!"
Kerrigan: "Then that shall be your epitaph."
hots: Mengsk: "Korhal will endure, as will I."
Kerrigan: "Nice quote. I'll engrave it on your tombstone."
did this bother anyone else?
I didn't notice this, but this is really symbolic of how bad and juvenile the SC2 campaigns are. A lot of people in this thread and the last one have defended SC2 and HotS by saying "well, the SC1/Brood War storylines weren't that good either! You're just being nostalgic". That line of reasoning may have some merit, but just look at what's happening in the above quotations.
The exchanges above, between Fenix and Kerrigan, and Mengsk and Kerrigan are nearly identical in theme. Let's forget for a second that Fenix's last words are better written than Mengsk's, and focus on Kerrigan's replies. In the first, she uses the word epitaph. When I was 13 or 14 and playing Brood War, I don't think I knew what that word meant. In fact, I think I probably looked up the word in a dictionary to find out what it meant. I learned a word from Starcraft. Someone learning from a video game? What a ludicrous notion! Video games are supposed to be mindless entertainments somewhere far below books, even below movies, and tier above masturbation, right?
In HotS, she says instead "engrave it on your tombstone". Did the writers remember what she said to Fenix and say "oh wouldn't it be a cool throwback if we reused that same line she said to Fenix?", to which another guy would say "nah, 'epitaph' is too hard a word, I don't think the average 13 year old will know what that means, we better keep it simple."
It's a perfect example of how dumbed down everything is in SC2. While the rest of us have grown up, Starcraft grew down. I'm 24 years old now, maybe it's too much to ask of a video game to engage with me at the same level SC1 did when I was 14, but for it to have not even have merely stagnated, but to have gotten dumber, is an insult to me as a consumer.
Someone might say, "But Gatesleeper, you see, you're 24 now, and Blizzard isn't making games for you anymore! They're making games for the 14 year olds of today. It's like the same thing with MTV not playing music videos anymore, they're just adapting to their new target audience!". This might be true, but if it is, it's an equally sad prospect. Because that means the 14 year olds of today will play SC2 and think that's how good video game stories should be. They'll take that as the best video games can offer in terms of narrative and characters. And that would be a real tragedy.
|
Wasn't there a scene from BW where the corpse of Stukov was launched into space or something? It seemed like this entire campaign wasn't really necessary. They could've just erased the "old Queen of Blades," with the artifact, and used the next mission in WoL to kill off Mengsk and that would've been the end of it, and have Zeratul come to Kerrigan about news of naruD and Amon. But still it's interesting in its own way because we finally get to see into the mind of Kerrigan, something I've wanted to see since grade 4.
|
Once the story picked up past the whole tutorial phase, I really enjoyed it. Sure, I skimmed some of the side dialogue, but I was more eager to get back to the story. It really held my attention, and there were a few moments that I got those nerd chills. It was a really fun experience.
|
"Why are Jim and Kerrigan so hot for each other all of a sudden in SC2? I don't think we ever got anything more than a debatable implication that they were an item in the BW story. But they're exchanging sloppy makeouts within the first twenty minutes of this story. Is it just like, there is an attractive man and an attractive woman on screen, of course they have to be all over each other?"
She kissed him. How the hell is that a sloppy makeout?
A kiss can be non intimate, as well. It can be loving, without sexuality behind it.
She may LOVE him, she DID love him. Feelings like that never change. Ill always care about my exes, in some part of me. Maybe she does too?
But where the hell were they sloppily making out?
Furthermore, Jim Rayner is far from attractive. Hes a drunk, hes full of scars, and age hasnt been kind to him.
|
On March 15 2013 14:08 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 14:06 mordk wrote:On March 15 2013 14:02 oogieogie wrote:
The only way I can see the story redeemed is if Karrigan gets killed by Raynor at the end of LOTV or middle or something.
Also the one thing I really hated was just the ending..why the fuck is she just floating away like wth? Not gonna happen. Remember in WoL it was clear that if Kerrigan dies, Xel'Naga win. Only positive outcome is with her alive and not controlled by the ancients. And that's because she's permanently zerged now, no point in staying with Raynor, Mengsk is dead, no point in staying in Korhal, so she's leaving to find the dead god. I'm still hoping that the DV was manipulating Zertaul by shapeshifting into Tassadar on Aiur. How amazing would it be to have a twist like that? Then again at this point that is incredibly unlikely 
No way. Unless they are reading those forums, I seriously doubt they would even think of such idea, with all the shallowness writers had showcased.
|
On March 15 2013 15:27 HiTeK532 wrote:
The side characters were developed pretty well in WOL I can't even name a side character in HOTS.
The general direction of the plot line doesn't sit to well with me the actual telling of it is okay it just feels like they didn't really build off of SC and BW ,but just made up their own story using a few facts and the same characters.
It also feels like it assumes there was more character development in BW than their actually was i.e. when did mengsk become a super genius/evil mastermind BW made him out to be some guy who recruited masterminds who did all his work for him.
Kerrigan even made specific mention of mengsk being useless without duke in BW then the SC2 writers just sort of assumed we knew that mengsk had become some sort of evil genius as opposed to just an evil guy who hired talent.
I think this effect is partly due to the fact that they used lore from the expanded universe of books and such, which is bad because it assumes that people are familiar with these and most are not. Hell I had to read some Wiki pages to get updated on some of the expanded universe stuff.
Especially when it comes to Jim and Sarah having feelings as it was not fully developed and only implied in the actual games. The relationship was supposedly elaborated on in the books. Like in the quote in the OP he seemed to be surprised at the sudden love that is between the two, when in fact it was established prior in other mediums outside the games.
|
Playing through it again, I gotta say the CGIs of Kerrigan and her battles really steal the show. Pretty damn cool.....Shoulda made a movie :|
|
Disliked how there was so little build up leading to the ending of WoL. If Raynor still cared and wants to save her, then show me. I wouldn't mind playing missions that was designed to flesh out character, get rid of filler missions to make room.
What we get is nothing but her picture on a wall and that lame plot twist presented by Zeratul. You want Kerrigan to die? haha you fool, she is actually the chosen one predicted in the prophecy to save the world! Ugh. Way to provide Jimmy with an easy way out writers. He get to save his girl, save the world, soothing his conscience in the process. ![[image loading]](http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080415001948/starcraft/images/a/a1/FenixZealot_SC1_HeadAnim1.gif) would approve.
|
Campaign was great. Story was great.
|
I thought the campaign was much to short and after the ending cinematic I was really dissatisfied. I never got to build up a big base, every mission was finished in ~25min max. Didn't feel like a RTS campaign :/
|
Story was wayyy too cliche. I do think the campaign was a lot better than WoL though.
|
First of, let me say that I really liked the game and the missions and I really wanna replay them as they were well designed and most of all, fun.
Second of all, I thought the story was predictable as hell
When Raynor was "killed", my first thoughts was "oh wellz secret hostage inccc", cus that'd be the most obvious thing, Raynor getting suprise saved by the protoss would've been awesome cus then when Kerrigan goes into his prison it's like "huh.. wtf!?" and the protoss would've suddenly had a relevant role in hots, I also expected the Golden Armada to attack Kerrigan when she assaulted Korhal, so the conflicts and who has whose allegiance would've been interesting even if it was a predictable scenario.
Instead the only thing about protoss we get in the next campaign is that Zeratul is gonna be chastised and the Broodmother who infected the protoss ship is gonna cause trouble on Shakuras.
On another note: what I hate the most is that Zeratul was turned into a "pure for the greater good guy" from the unpredictable enigma which was his trademark in BW imo
|
On March 15 2013 16:42 TAMinator wrote:
Story was wayyy too cliche. I do think the campaign was a lot better than WoL though.
That's like saying since Avatar was better than Terminator 3 we should give James Cameron another Oscar.
|
Story was pretty obvious, nevertheless I did enjoy it. They simply don't have time to make any reasonable plot hole in the pace they tried to rush the story trough, we only got LotV left. Too much stuff to be resolved.
Had some issues with the:
- Tal'Darim working with Narud? Sounds logically to hire a guy to fight your own 'employees' over gas cannisters and shit..
- I'm playing a girl trying to save a guy hmm...
- Obviousness
- Kerrigan hesitating against a goddamn shapeshifter.
- Zeratul with his small appearance. totally expected some epic speech from him at the end, but no
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
