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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:10 kyllinghest wrote: Yes its live. I just did a two base marine raven all-in vs protoss, and it felt very strong. Helped that the other guy made dt's though! well you blindcountered his built^^ Were you able to use a hsm? | ||
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kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:15 SpikeStarcraft wrote: well you blindcountered his built^^ Were you able to use a hsm? Yes, my Nighthawks were able to use HSM with no upgrade required;) | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:09 avilo wrote: They are good nerfs, but I think what is debatable is this: can zerg still just opt to mass infestor broodlord every single game? I think we'll still be seeing infestor broodlord virtually every game to be honest. And why wouldn't we see this? Mutalisks aside - which lead to terribly gameplay (basetrade as only positive outcome for zerg) - there is no other strategy for PvZ. And on high level PvZ I'm not sure if mutalisks are a viable choice no matter what. Similar for TvZ. In the end infestors are the only midgame choice for Zerg that cannot be a BO-loss, all other roads in TvZ and PvZ can run into (multiple different) blindcounters. | ||
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TheFrankOne
United States667 Posts
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LeSioN
United States325 Posts
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Ramone
Canada85 Posts
If damage doesn't carry over, storm isn't going to be THAT great against them.... If eggs have 70 HP and take 5 seconds to hatch, that means that you'd to storm within 1 second after the egg is thrown or you'd end up doing 40 damage to the egg and 20 damage to the infested terran. Still pretty nice I suppose, at least storm has the CHANCE to kill eggs before they're hatched. Cheers, Ramone | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
On December 05 2012 23:15 plogamer wrote: I think i read wrongly; The first part of the first sentence of the first quoted post was the following 'I find it weird how many people assume -1 range to fungal won't be impactful'. I thought the posts quoting that were about having impact at all, while they were in fact only towards the second part of the sentence 'when the -2 range to neural ' etc,etc....You seriously don't understand how queen and immortal buff made them go from doing no damage to full damage and support everyone using those situations that are completely apples to oranges? Morrow never said how noticeable it is. Don't try to twist his words for your own purpose if you really do respect him. Do you really think he will equate this change to the immortal range buff or the queen range buff? And really, as far as ZvT is concerned, IT eggs are used to initiate by giving zerg 3 second window to close in when all seige tanks fire their first volley on IT eggs. It matters little how much damage they can take. Infested terran is a bigger problem for protoss than terrans usually. I repeat: I'm not saying there is no difference. I'm saying that the difference will never be as big as it was with immortal buff or the queen buff that people keep talking about. Don't hide behind morrow and man up with your own arguments on why it's gonna make a big impact. That was my mistake. If you read my post again while thinking from that view my post makes perfect sense. I agree my post looks very stupid in the current conversation. But on the other hand, wtf is with the overly aggressive wording? was that really necessary? | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:48 Ramone wrote: It does carry over.Newb question regarding infested terran eggs: How does damage done to the eggs carry over to the hatched infested terran? If damage doesn't carry over, storm isn't going to be THAT great against them.... If eggs have 70 HP and take 5 seconds to hatch, that means that you'd to storm within 1 second after the egg is thrown or you'd end up doing 40 damage to the egg and 20 damage to the infested terran. Still pretty nice I suppose, at least storm has the CHANCE to kill eggs before they're hatched. Cheers, Ramone I tried by letting roaches attack my own it-eggs. The it's came out damaged. Not sure if that being friendly fire makes a difference, but i don't think so. | ||
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DoNuTs84
Denmark24 Posts
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mongoose22
174 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:48 Ramone wrote: Newb question regarding infested terran eggs: How does damage done to the eggs carry over to the hatched infested terran? If damage doesn't carry over, storm isn't going to be THAT great against them.... If eggs have 70 HP and take 5 seconds to hatch, that means that you'd to storm within 1 second after the egg is thrown or you'd end up doing 40 damage to the egg and 20 damage to the infested terran. Still pretty nice I suppose, at least storm has the CHANCE to kill eggs before they're hatched. Cheers, Ramone Damage to the egg carries over as a percentage to the Infested Terran. Example: You do 28 points of damage to an Infested Swarm Egg before it hatches, leaving it with 42 health. That's 42/70 = 60% health remaining. When the Infested Terran hatches, it has 60% health to start, or 50 * 0.60 = 30 health out of the gate (or egg, as it were). So if you do a ton of damage to an egg but not quite enough to kill it, that Infested Terran is still a dead Terran walking when it hatches. | ||
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:01 DoNuTs84 wrote: No nerf to Immortal/Senty 2base all-ins? Kind of booring to see every single Protoss get free wins with this in every game they use it Only bad Zergs let that happened, I haven't seen Leenock or Life lost to that build like ever. They can mass roaches and flank that build easily | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:01 DoNuTs84 wrote: No nerf to Immortal/Senty 2base all-ins? Kind of booring to see every single Protoss get free wins with this in every game they use it You watch some pretty selective games then or you are just making stuff up to complain. I can't be 100% sure. | ||
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c0sm0naut
United States1229 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:04 tuho12345 wrote: Only bad Zergs let that happened, I haven't seen Leenock or Life lost to that build like ever. They can mass roaches and flank that build easily lol this is so ignorant, but it is true that this buildhas become weaker than it used to be in the meta there are a lot of unexplored options against it, nydus,muta etc. my favorite way to beat this now is to just sac my 3rd base and take a ninja 4th, spine up and counter with mutalisks while he pushes and then nydus drones to the base to mine, spines +transfuse = really good | ||
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Ramone
Canada85 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:04 mongoose22 wrote: Damage to the egg carries over as a percentage to the Infested Terran. Example: You do 28 points of damage to an Infested Swarm Egg before it hatches, leaving it with 42 health. That's 42/70 = 60% health remaining. When the Infested Terran hatches, it has 60% health to start, or 50 * 0.60 = 30 health out of the gate (or egg, as it were). So if you do a ton of damage to an egg but not quite enough to kill it, that Infested Terran is still a dead Terran walking when it hatches. Thanks for that. So I guess storm does hard counter infested terran armies: Eggs take 5 seconds to hatch and storm lasts 4 seconds doing 80 damage. So if the egg is hit by: 4 seconds of storm, it dies 3 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 7 HP and dies to the next tick of storm 2 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 21 HP and dies to the remaining 2 seconds of storm 1 second of storm, the infested terran hatches with 35 HP and dies to the next two seconds of storm I think that math is right anyways. Thank god for this change...I actually felt the infested terran were more annoying than the fungals in a lot of ways. | ||
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Mariosatr
294 Posts
On December 05 2012 08:18 BigBossX wrote: Make zerg a bad option as a race, you mean like terran is now? And I disagree, not all zergs are reliant on infestors, only the bad ones, only the patch zergs. Before infestors started raping, zergs were winning with muta ling bling, hell nestea was winning GSLs. Nerfing infestors to the ground will simply weed out the shitty zergs and let the elite shine and stand out. This is what I would LOVE to see. I admit Zerg is OP, but you guys are complaining about how Terran is bad; why make it worse by nerfing Zerg so much that it becomes the bad race option? Two wrongs don't make a right. | ||
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doggy
Germany306 Posts
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CyDe
United States1010 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:20 Mariosatr wrote: I admit Zerg is OP, but you guys are complaining about how Terran is bad; why make it worse by nerfing Zerg so much that it becomes the bad race option? Two wrongs don't make a right. I agree with you. It's a really common way that players look at balance in this community. Everyone wants everyone else to undergoe the same struggle they supposedly had to go through from previous patches. It's really frustrating, because it can invalidate anyone who claims that something has been overnerfed and that the inbalance has tipped the other way. I mean, even the pros pull this. It's quite bothersome. | ||
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KrazyTrumpet
United States2520 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:19 Ramone wrote: Thanks for that. So I guess storm does hard counter infested terran armies: Eggs take 5 seconds to hatch and storm lasts 4 seconds doing 80 damage. So if the egg is hit by: 4 seconds of storm, it dies 3 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 7 HP and dies to the next tick of storm 2 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 21 HP and dies to the remaining 2 seconds of storm 1 second of storm, the infested terran hatches with 35 HP and dies to the next two seconds of storm I think that math is right anyways. Thank god for this change...I actually felt the infested terran were more annoying than the fungals in a lot of ways. Is everyone sure this is how IT works, though? | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:19 Ramone wrote: Thanks for that. So I guess storm does hard counter infested terran armies: Eggs take 5 seconds to hatch and storm lasts 4 seconds doing 80 damage. So if the egg is hit by: 4 seconds of storm, it dies 3 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 7 HP and dies to the next tick of storm 2 seconds of storm, the infested terran hatches with 21 HP and dies to the remaining 2 seconds of storm 1 second of storm, the infested terran hatches with 35 HP and dies to the next two seconds of storm I think that math is right anyways. Thank god for this change...I actually felt the infested terran were more annoying than the fungals in a lot of ways. If that is correct, it is awesome. Finally protoss can trade energy for energy and use feedback to pick off the magic space slugs. | ||
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theinfamousone
United States103 Posts
On December 06 2012 02:20 Mariosatr wrote: I admit Zerg is OP, but you guys are complaining about how Terran is bad; why make it worse by nerfing Zerg so much that it becomes the bad race option? Two wrongs don't make a right. I assume you're implying Protoss will be too strong now. While Protoss are doing ok (certainly better than terran) at high levels, they're certainly not winning every tournament. GSL, Protoss aren't looking overpowered by a long shot. And IPL5, L....O....L..... Scroll down to the bracket please. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/IGN_ProLeague_Season_5 | ||
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