EPTIT egg reduced by 20hp is not going to rebalance the game. I think reverting the queen buff could help with TvZ, but PvZ would still be an issue. Protoss could be helped with a 25hp reduction in IT egg (not sure how they went to 80hp, since they still take the same amount of tank shots and the same number of storms), but I'm not sure if that is enough. It would be a good start to help the other races a little bit. I think one other change that would be very good for the game is to have BLs/ITs/Overseers/banelings not get 100% HP regen upon hatching. It makes it really challenging to know if you can snipe off morphing BLs or if you will mostly damage them only to have them have full HP instantly.
Call to Action #2: November 30 Balance Testing - Page 40
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convention
United States622 Posts
IT egg reduced by 20hp is not going to rebalance the game. I think reverting the queen buff could help with TvZ, but PvZ would still be an issue. Protoss could be helped with a 25hp reduction in IT egg (not sure how they went to 80hp, since they still take the same amount of tank shots and the same number of storms), but I'm not sure if that is enough. It would be a good start to help the other races a little bit. I think one other change that would be very good for the game is to have BLs/ITs/Overseers/banelings not get 100% HP regen upon hatching. It makes it really challenging to know if you can snipe off morphing BLs or if you will mostly damage them only to have them have full HP instantly. | ||
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Berailfor
441 Posts
Something needs a change for the infestor, but not this. This was the most pathetic attempt at balancing I've seen blizz do so far. And they've done a lot of crap balancing already... | ||
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zmansman17
United States2567 Posts
I'm really upset with these balance changes, which essentially do nothing. Ravens still must accumulate the 150 requisite energy for SM and all this does is save 150/150 from the late game. Did Zergs ever have to research fungal/infested terrans? No, their most useful abilities are free. Whereas the Raven essentially has limited utility outside of a timing attack in the late game w/o SM. The egg change does nothing as it will still take tanks 2 shots to kill eggs. I just don;t understand Blizzard.. | ||
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TJ31
630 Posts
And I don't think that Seeker Missile change will do anything at all. Mid game there's just no use for ravens.. well, almost no use. And late game it will be insignificant as well, you still can't get enough of ravens fast enough and they die easily vs corruptors and fungal works on them too. Egg health.. I won't even bother to comment that, everything was said already. But, I can't say that was unexpected. I just don't see them working hard to balance WoL anymore, HotS coming in 4 months. Want a chance for some better balance? Buy it. That's what are they thinking probably. Too bad they didn't count those upset people, who won't buy HotS just because they were unhappy with WoL's balance. /conspiracy theory | ||
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RDaneelOlivaw
Vatican City State733 Posts
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tMomiji
United States1115 Posts
Uh Really, Blizzard? ...Really? *Really*? I wish I could say something constructive but I'm just...at a loss for words. Are they really operating on the same plane of reality as the rest of humanity? | ||
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tMomiji
United States1115 Posts
On December 02 2012 06:13 RDaneelOlivaw wrote: I really feel like they should just scrap the infestor in HotS. I'm a Zerg, so I get how important they are to the zerg game and the extent to which that removal would break the game. But they are just so damn boring, they are really killing ZvX matchups. I don't care about balance, they just aren't fun to watch or play with in their current state. Just get rid of them and then rebalance accordingly. Oh, and get rid of colawlossus as well while we're at it :p Hey, as a Protoss I won't complain if they get rid of the colossus. ...As long as they give us back the Reaver. I want the Reaver! ...Roar. | ||
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zmansman17
United States2567 Posts
On December 02 2012 06:23 tMomiji wrote: Hey, as a Protoss I won't complain if they get rid of the colossus. ...As long as they give us back the Reaver. I want the Reaver! ...Roar. Reaper <3 | ||
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mrjpark
United States276 Posts
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SuperYo1000
United States880 Posts
On December 02 2012 06:48 mrjpark wrote: Uh, isn't the egg nerf actually a decent nerf? It means one storm will now kill however many eggs are within the radius, while feedbacks are always options in the earlier part of the game to just deal with the infestors themselves. oh come on please...how many times has this been corrected. One storm WILL NOT kill eggs. Eggs just like every other zerg unit regen life. eggs survive with 1 or 2 hp | ||
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WeRRa
378 Posts
On December 02 2012 06:48 mrjpark wrote: Uh, isn't the egg nerf actually a decent nerf? It means one storm will now kill however many eggs are within the radius, while feedbacks are always options in the earlier part of the game to just deal with the infestors themselves. And this helps terran how? Terran has no decent spellcasters wich deal damage and the change for ravens hardly changes much, if you got ravens you have basicly the same coinflip situation like protoss with the mothership and even if you beat the broodlords, the ultra follow up will still own you. | ||
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Psychlone
Canada90 Posts
This is truly redonkulous now, trying to balance the game around one retarded patch that started all this horrendousness. Make the Queen normal again and Reapers will be an option again, Terrans will have time to build Ravens against this boring BL-Infestor Army. Like others said before, Blizzard MUST know. They're doing this on purpose and it's totally disgusting. | ||
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ZealotSensei
Denmark70 Posts
You guys have to remember that you don't want templars to be able to take down eggs on their own, it will kill the infestor's ability to harass with IT''s. That means that you either have to have 1-2 templars and a cannon or a templar and a 2-3 zealots. Also, remember that you dont "just" storm. You usually have an army. And I believe that if eggs got higher priority by zealots, eggs would melt really really fast in main army engagements. | ||
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CrazyF1r3f0x
United States2120 Posts
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SnipedSoul
Canada2158 Posts
On December 02 2012 09:01 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote: If you Damage the IT egg, you damage the IT when it spawns right? No, all morphing zerg units start at full HP regardless of how much health their cocoon had when they hatched. | ||
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LavaLava
United States235 Posts
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
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Scila
Canada1849 Posts
On December 02 2012 09:31 tuho12345 wrote: how about bring back the old Ghost to deal with BL/infestors? But that would mean admitting they were wrong. They won't do that. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26225 Posts
On December 02 2012 09:31 tuho12345 wrote: how about bring back the old Ghost to deal with BL/infestors? I feel that the nerf was premature, because Zergs weren't given a chance to try and figure it out. However as a composition, ghostmech v Z is kind of a similar 'god' level composition to BL/Infestor. It's harder to transition to perhaps, but it is very catch-all. @Lavalava. Agreed with the concept, however you don't have to apply it to all units or none I guess, but you could selectively apply it. Banelings - Low HP and crucial importance in reactively dealing with means that I think baneling morphs giving them full HP is kind of fair. Overseers- Would also make them return to 100% HP. I mean it's rare that people saving their ovies by exploiting this mechanic ever happens, in the way that changes a battle or something. However I think it's kind of a cool dynamic that you could save an overlord by morphing it, say when you're scouting and facing a couple of marines. There's a cool kind of expense vs scouting importance decision to be made for a little thing like that, and I like that subtelty. Infested Terrans- Because they tend to be spammed on top of things like Nexi, with the ability to snipe a Nexus even if you have defensive forces in position, and that's due in part to the fact they spawn with full HP. I'd remove it here, 100%. It rewards mindless play, but wouldn't affect the intelligent uses of IT. For example using eggs to buff/force splash on tanks is a cool mechanic, but not really linked to the HP/regen issue. It would still be possible. Broodlords- Would remove their ability to regen to 100% health from a corruptor cocoon. Broods are easy enough to transition to, so at the very least they should require careful thought about where and when to morph. It would also open other decisions up to the Zerg, for example if he had a lot of low HP corruptors, it would be good play to bring Queens up to tranfuse them with Queens before morphing to broods, in some situations. | ||
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tuho12345
4482 Posts
On December 02 2012 09:44 Wombat_NI wrote: I feel that the nerf was premature, because Zergs weren't given a chance to try and figure it out. However as a composition, ghostmech v Z is kind of a similar 'god' level composition to BL/Infestor. It's harder to transition to perhaps, but it is very catch-all. @Lavalava. Agreed with the concept, however you don't have to apply it to all units or none I guess, but you could selectively apply it. Banelings - Low HP and crucial importance in reactively dealing with means that I think baneling morphs giving them full HP is kind of fair. Overseers- Would also make them return to 100% HP. I mean it's rare that people saving their ovies by exploiting this mechanic ever happens, in the way that changes a battle or something. However I think it's kind of a cool dynamic that you could save an overlord by morphing it, say when you're scouting and facing a couple of marines. There's a cool kind of expense vs scouting importance decision to be made for a little thing like that, and I like that subtelty. Infested Terrans- Because they tend to be spammed on top of things like Nexi, with the ability to snipe a Nexus even if you have defensive forces in position, and that's due in part to the fact they spawn with full HP. I'd remove it here, 100%. It rewards mindless play, but wouldn't affect the intelligent uses of IT. For example using eggs to buff/force splash on tanks is a cool mechanic, but not really linked to the HP/regen issue. It would still be possible. Broodlords- Would remove their ability to regen to 100% health from a corruptor cocoon. Broods are easy enough to transition to, so at the very least they should require careful thought about where and when to morph. It would also open other decisions up to the Zerg, for example if he had a lot of low HP corruptors, it would be good play to bring Queens up to tranfuse them with Queens before morphing to broods, in some situations. b/c back in the day Zerg didn't know how to use infestor properly like now. May be now infestor can be used to FG and trap ghost. Or if Ghost's snipe range is too far, they could nerf it a bit then I wouldn't mind. Now beside reapers, ghost is the second most useless units in TvZ. Which is not fair consider how Zerg can use almost every single unit except hydras that they have. | ||
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