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On December 02 2012 01:48 Decendos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:40 aksfjh wrote:On December 02 2012 01:22 Decendos wrote:On December 02 2012 00:14 Nourek wrote:On December 01 2012 22:58 Surriel wrote:On December 01 2012 22:44 Insoleet wrote:On December 01 2012 21:45 Frankenberry wrote:The raven change doesn't really solve anything tbh. Its a small buff, that wont really change endgame significantly tbh. I might be wrong. Time will tell x) I feel QXC, Darkforce and Todd gave some really spot on insight on the problems of PvZ and TvZ lategame (Episode 76, + Show Spoiler +) Basically zerg's early and middle game naturally leads to a really strong endgame unit composition, while protoss and terran needs to make some huge tech switches (for instance into a lot of BC's with 3/3 upgrades, vikings and ravens) and these switches take to much time compared to the zerg tech switches. I dont see how the removal of an upgrade changes this fundamental mechanic Also, another problem with TvZ is the Queen change, actually one of the biggest problems. Notice infestors haven't actually been buffed or changed for quite a while, but it's only since then that they became regarded as 'broken' in ZvT. Zergs have gotten better too, especially in terms of Infestor control and retention. However, my analysis of the flow of the game/Queen change is: Queen change enabled Zergs to drone harder, and with fewer offensive units. They can play more greedy, but with less of the risk that balances that out. For example, you see few Zergs building defensive roaches to deal with Hellions now, they'll use pure Queen defences more often. Without spending as much larva on units, and resources, especially gas, Zerg stockpile more. This allows them to get earlier swells of infestors than before, or more of them at Infestors retain their utility and usefulness, so once Infestors are out by and large, there's not a reason to not keep them. Infestors also naturally synergise with almost everything that's Zerg, so there's no downside in having them as part of a composition. They go well with Ultras, and fill almost all of the holes in terms of weaknesses that exist with the Broodlord. The natural progression of Zerg tech is definitely a correct analysis, I'm basically saying that the Queen change enables Zergs to accelerate the progression, with no real downside. You're absolutely right about this. If I look at TvZs before the Queen patch, the matchup was damn balanced and represented Zerg as they should be: They should play reactionary and counter-wise. If a Zerg player knows the Terran is going for hellion/banshee - they should counter it with roaches, spines and spores - not with MASS queens and mass droning behind it. As Terrans invest a lot in hellion/banshee to keep the Zerg low on drones (which makes sense...), Zerg nowadays only can laugh about it and drone like crazy to get insanely strong at late midgame or lategame. You forgot something : the buff happened at the time terran discovered the triple CC build. Which zerg had to counter blindly by attacking with roaches without even knowing if the terran was doing triple CC or not. That was not balanced at all. Thats why blizzard said : ok now, as terran can macro up safely, zerg will macro up safely too. Its justice. The problem is not queen patch, terran just play macro now and its ok. The problem is the fungle in TvZ which is breaking the game (too much punishment for not splitting your marines for 1 second) and IT in PvZ (were 25 infestors can spawn a 200 units army to support his broods...) Are you sure you are not getting mixed up here? The 3 CCs build was only popularized after the queen patch as a way for Terran to catch up on economy with Zergs. I remember during this period a lot of experimentation also went into place mainly ultilizing the Banshees to combat creepspread. Of course there were players using the 3ccs build before the patch but it surely was not the bread and butter build. No, 3 CC builds were around earlier. I distinctly remember a series of MKP vs DRG where MKP either went an early allin such as marauder/hellion or 3 CCs/2 ebay off 1 rax/1 fact. The problem was that for Zerg the visible difference was zero. There were hellions on the edge of your creep and a few marines at the edge of the terran base. That was MLG Winter, ie way before the Queen patch. By the way, over the 5 GSL before the Queen patch, there were a total of 4 Zergs in 5 Ro8s 4 out of 40. But sure, everything was fine and dandy in SC2 before that patch. Selective memory is a wonderful thing. exactly this. people who are crying about queen and overlord buff are completely ignoring the fact that overlordscouting wasnt possible on bigger maps and 1 marine/stalker denying all scouting. also people seem to forget that 4 helions parked outside of the base with 0 apm made for terrible games and in lots of cases terran had a faster 3rd base than the zerg which was seen in terrible winrates for zerg. there is absolutely no problem in nerfing the infestor but talking about reversing the overlord and queen buff is beyond stupid. And yet Zerg had about a 46-47% ZvT winrate in GSL before the buffs. Hellions parked outside the base were actually not a problem if Zerg would have stopped sitting with their thumbs up their asses, refusing to invest in roaches AT ALL. Even then, however, the only real issues with TvZ was the confusion brought by the Terran either going for a hellion banshee all-in, marauder hellion all-in, or a quick 3rd. The overord buff fixed that, then they buffed the queen too. even if zerg invested into roaches and took a 3rd base they were behind. roaches that early that dont do any damage made the zerg get behind. so even if they could get a scout of and made those 4 roaches to take a 3rd they got behind. thats why zergs went for roach bling all ins a lot. it just isnt possible to make some roaches defensively and not get behind. either you make a lot and be all in (or do a lot of damage so you can transition) or you build a few and be behind. thats the main reason for the queen buff. vs helions into banshee you needed roaches AND queens which put you behind. as easy as that. both buffs were needed and are fine. BUT: it would be much more fun if zerg could actually do pressure builds (non-allin builds!!) and take a 3rd behind it. in HOTS this would be possible if you would make hydras hatchtech like they were in BW and then nerf queen range back to 3.
You apparently haven't watched SC2 since early 2011...
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On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself.
Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute?
Alright, cba to continue this conversation.
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On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation.
TaeJa is several leagues above Dimaga and Snute, and still a lot better than Stephano. You have no idea what you're talking about, even Nerchio is better than Dimaga and Snute.
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On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation.
Is this some sort of joke
3 time premier tournament winner ( in recent times ) ro8 GSL s2, ro8 GSL s3 ro4 GSL s4 is not better than Dimaga?
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On December 02 2012 01:56 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. Is this some sort of joke 3 time premier tournament winner ( in recent times ) ro8 GSL s2, ro8 GSL s3 ro4 GSL s4 is not better than Dimaga?
Well, not any more he's not...
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On December 02 2012 01:48 Decendos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:40 aksfjh wrote:On December 02 2012 01:22 Decendos wrote:On December 02 2012 00:14 Nourek wrote:On December 01 2012 22:58 Surriel wrote:On December 01 2012 22:44 Insoleet wrote:On December 01 2012 21:45 Frankenberry wrote:The raven change doesn't really solve anything tbh. Its a small buff, that wont really change endgame significantly tbh. I might be wrong. Time will tell x) I feel QXC, Darkforce and Todd gave some really spot on insight on the problems of PvZ and TvZ lategame (Episode 76, + Show Spoiler +http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfM54hJH8gg ) Basically zerg's early and middle game naturally leads to a really strong endgame unit composition, while protoss and terran needs to make some huge tech switches (for instance into a lot of BC's with 3/3 upgrades, vikings and ravens) and these switches take to much time compared to the zerg tech switches. I dont see how the removal of an upgrade changes this fundamental mechanic Also, another problem with TvZ is the Queen change, actually one of the biggest problems. Notice infestors haven't actually been buffed or changed for quite a while, but it's only since then that they became regarded as 'broken' in ZvT. Zergs have gotten better too, especially in terms of Infestor control and retention. However, my analysis of the flow of the game/Queen change is: Queen change enabled Zergs to drone harder, and with fewer offensive units. They can play more greedy, but with less of the risk that balances that out. For example, you see few Zergs building defensive roaches to deal with Hellions now, they'll use pure Queen defences more often. Without spending as much larva on units, and resources, especially gas, Zerg stockpile more. This allows them to get earlier swells of infestors than before, or more of them at Infestors retain their utility and usefulness, so once Infestors are out by and large, there's not a reason to not keep them. Infestors also naturally synergise with almost everything that's Zerg, so there's no downside in having them as part of a composition. They go well with Ultras, and fill almost all of the holes in terms of weaknesses that exist with the Broodlord. The natural progression of Zerg tech is definitely a correct analysis, I'm basically saying that the Queen change enables Zergs to accelerate the progression, with no real downside. You're absolutely right about this. If I look at TvZs before the Queen patch, the matchup was damn balanced and represented Zerg as they should be: They should play reactionary and counter-wise. If a Zerg player knows the Terran is going for hellion/banshee - they should counter it with roaches, spines and spores - not with MASS queens and mass droning behind it. As Terrans invest a lot in hellion/banshee to keep the Zerg low on drones (which makes sense...), Zerg nowadays only can laugh about it and drone like crazy to get insanely strong at late midgame or lategame. You forgot something : the buff happened at the time terran discovered the triple CC build. Which zerg had to counter blindly by attacking with roaches without even knowing if the terran was doing triple CC or not. That was not balanced at all. Thats why blizzard said : ok now, as terran can macro up safely, zerg will macro up safely too. Its justice. The problem is not queen patch, terran just play macro now and its ok. The problem is the fungle in TvZ which is breaking the game (too much punishment for not splitting your marines for 1 second) and IT in PvZ (were 25 infestors can spawn a 200 units army to support his broods...) Are you sure you are not getting mixed up here? The 3 CCs build was only popularized after the queen patch as a way for Terran to catch up on economy with Zergs. I remember during this period a lot of experimentation also went into place mainly ultilizing the Banshees to combat creepspread. Of course there were players using the 3ccs build before the patch but it surely was not the bread and butter build. No, 3 CC builds were around earlier. I distinctly remember a series of MKP vs DRG where MKP either went an early allin such as marauder/hellion or 3 CCs/2 ebay off 1 rax/1 fact. The problem was that for Zerg the visible difference was zero. There were hellions on the edge of your creep and a few marines at the edge of the terran base. That was MLG Winter, ie way before the Queen patch. By the way, over the 5 GSL before the Queen patch, there were a total of 4 Zergs in 5 Ro8s 4 out of 40. But sure, everything was fine and dandy in SC2 before that patch. Selective memory is a wonderful thing. exactly this. people who are crying about queen and overlord buff are completely ignoring the fact that overlordscouting wasnt possible on bigger maps and 1 marine/stalker denying all scouting. also people seem to forget that 4 helions parked outside of the base with 0 apm made for terrible games and in lots of cases terran had a faster 3rd base than the zerg which was seen in terrible winrates for zerg. there is absolutely no problem in nerfing the infestor but talking about reversing the overlord and queen buff is beyond stupid. And yet Zerg had about a 46-47% ZvT winrate in GSL before the buffs. Hellions parked outside the base were actually not a problem if Zerg would have stopped sitting with their thumbs up their asses, refusing to invest in roaches AT ALL. Even then, however, the only real issues with TvZ was the confusion brought by the Terran either going for a hellion banshee all-in, marauder hellion all-in, or a quick 3rd. The overord buff fixed that, then they buffed the queen too. even if zerg invested into roaches and took a 3rd base they were behind. roaches that early that dont do any damage made the zerg get behind. so even if they could get a scout of and made those 4 roaches to take a 3rd they got behind. thats why zergs went for roach bling all ins a lot. it just isnt possible to make some roaches defensively and not get behind. either you make a lot and be all in (or do a lot of damage so you can transition) or you build a few and be behind. thats the main reason for the queen buff. vs helions into banshee you needed roaches AND queens which put you behind. as easy as that. both buffs were needed and are fine. on cloud kingdom for example the old overlord couldnt even get to a safe place to hide in time before the first marine was able to kill. thats how stupid it was before... BUT: it would be much more fun if zerg could actually do pressure builds (non-allin builds!!) and take a 3rd behind it. in HOTS this would be possible if you would make hydras hatchtech like they were in BW and then nerf queen range back to 3.
I haven't read a single person complaining about the overlord change. Most people when speak specifically about the changes, notices the overlord speed buff was required. The queen buff in the other side, shut down most harassment options for terran, and by the way, the terran if he wants to be greedy still has to deal with the pressure even with non-all in builds. It wasn't even made for tvz man, it had zvz wroted all over it.
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On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation.
On what world do you live ?
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On December 02 2012 01:58 aksfjh wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:56 Dodgin wrote:On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. Is this some sort of joke 3 time premier tournament winner ( in recent times ) ro8 GSL s2, ro8 GSL s3 ro4 GSL s4 is not better than Dimaga? Well, not any more he's not...
care to explain? he just took a silver medal at DHW a week ago.
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Anyone else wants to know what 'global statistics' Blizzard is using? They always claim they are following the top tournaments but keeps on saying everything is close to 50/50. However, I am not really seeing this from statistics from these tournaments at all.
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On December 02 2012 01:58 aksfjh wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:56 Dodgin wrote:On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. Is this some sort of joke 3 time premier tournament winner ( in recent times ) ro8 GSL s2, ro8 GSL s3 ro4 GSL s4 is not better than Dimaga? Well, not any more he's not...
The frak you speaking about
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/TaeJa
Look at his results. Oh he is on code A? Flash news, the gap between code A and code S right now is really really small. So small, check this GSL edition.
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I like the no upgrade HSM . HSM should have been buffed ages ago ... IT aren't that big of a problem IMO and this small nerf might be enough for them , so i like this latest test changes and i hope blizzard sticks with them . I think Blizzard instead of nerfing infestors should buff units that are of little use like the Raven . For example reaper , hydra . carriers . It might not lead to any counter for the infestor , but it would lead to other interesting scenarios that could make the game more interesting .
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On December 02 2012 01:59 Godwrath wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. On what world do you live ?
Earth.
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On December 02 2012 01:59 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:58 aksfjh wrote:On December 02 2012 01:56 Dodgin wrote:On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:
[quote]
Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. Is this some sort of joke 3 time premier tournament winner ( in recent times ) ro8 GSL s2, ro8 GSL s3 ro4 GSL s4 is not better than Dimaga? Well, not any more he's not... care to explain? he just took a silver medal at DHW a week ago.
I was talking about with the +10 skill Zergs have these days. It was a joke...
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On December 02 2012 02:04 FeyverN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:59 Godwrath wrote:On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation. On what world do you live ? Earth.
Interesting. Then it's just another dimension.
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Reminds me when I used to play WoW. I played a shaman (aka the red-head stepchild) for years and years, then I realized that greg street and his team made really bad design decisions, so I quit.
Tell me Blizzard, is Greg Street part of the sc2 design team? Cause their decisions certainly make me want to quit.
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Well, it's just a balance test after all, nothing is final good folks.
I had hoped to see some changes to fungal, though. It's an incredibly boring skill, and has made watching SC2 matches with Zerg a bore. "Great fungals" must be in the top 3 of most frequently said lines by casters.
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To be honest I would rather blizzard focus on balance changes in HOTS instead of testing changes in A game that seemingly won't exist in 3 months
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On December 02 2012 02:11 Shermac wrote:
To be honest I would rather blizzard focus on balance changes in HOTS instead of testing changes in A game that seemingly won't exist in 3 months
I agree with you, the problem is with the pro's who earn a living out of this. They are just dodging the ball and buying time for themselves. That's why most people is mad about it. Test maps are good, fine and dandy, but metagame won't evolve enough in 3 months to really do the drastic changes the infestor and zerg mid game units need.
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On December 02 2012 01:54 FeyverN wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2012 01:47 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 01:37 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:56 Teoita wrote:On December 02 2012 00:52 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:45 geokilla wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 FeyverN wrote:On December 02 2012 00:44 geokilla wrote:
So.... Ryung screaming IMBA doesn't mean anything to them? All these ZvZ finals doesn't mean anything to them? Can someone please remind this thread who the winner of Dreamhack was? A TvP, where the world's best Zergs didn't attend. Stephano, Dimaga, Snute and Nerchio are good zergs. Totally comparable to Taeja and HerO right? Comparable to TaeJa. Stop embarassing yourself. Maybe not Nerchio, but you honestly think TaeJa is better than Stephano, Dimaga and Snute? Alright, cba to continue this conversation.
Now you're really embarrassing yourself, TaeJa destroys those three players even with bad wrists (which only seems to affect terrans btw, like Mvp, Ganzi, Flash and Boxer)
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EPT
