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Call to Action: Balance Testing (2012/11/20) - Page 42

Forum Index > SC2 General
1876 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 40 41 42 43 44 94 Next
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24417 Posts
November 21 2012 18:01 GMT
#821
To the guy who just 10 pooled me: ______________ insert rant here.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
November 21 2012 18:01 GMT
#822
On November 22 2012 02:58 Insomni7 wrote:
Does the sentry immortal all-in need a buff? Not happy at all with the first change.


Well it didn't make them immune to infested terrans or roaches, so the normal way they die is still there.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
kugel
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany116 Posts
November 21 2012 18:01 GMT
#823
HMS buff is kinda cool. intressting to see how this will effect TvT

Doesnt blizzard see that the root is way too strong ? you can micro against storms and emps but if you are fungaled once.... AND ITS GONE...
Root + High IT dps seems to be the mainproblem. like teaja vs dark: x IT + fungal against what ? 15 BCs and he barly won and was able to save , was it 5 bcs ?
Massing up Infestors like a boss is still very strong against terran. against toss mhh we´ll see...
Its kinda strange, back when toss had CA it was very strong to just mass up HT or lets say be very HT sentric with your playstyle , at least in TvP
When terran had the old snipe + emp it was way too strong against lategame zerg and against toss. not sayn that the snipe nerf was fine but it feels like 35 dmg would have been a better solution. but back to topic.
what im trying to say is that every race had a phase in the metagame so far where massing up casters was way too strong and its the same here with Infestors the only difference is that they do affect every MU sooo massive and if you change the infestor just a little bit it will have a huge impact for zerg right now. i think that its cool that blizz is working on the prob but they will have a hard time fixing it.
HaXXspetten
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Sweden15718 Posts
November 21 2012 18:02 GMT
#824
On November 22 2012 03:00 Crawdad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:58 Insomni7 wrote:
Does the sentry immortal all-in need a buff? Not happy at all with the first change.


Infestors were used against Sentry/Immortal rush?

Ling/Infestor is a solid counter, yes?
Diks
Profile Joined January 2010
Belgium1880 Posts
November 21 2012 18:02 GMT
#825
On November 22 2012 02:56 Swisslink wrote:
Uhm... yeah...
Everyone knows: PvZ sucks, Zerg-players has infestors (-> No micro possible!), which leads to a terrible late game. Protoss have Sentries (-> No micro possible!), which leads to terribly strong timing pushs.

Now, the way Blizzard tries to fix this is: Nerf the Infestor in a way that the Sentries get buffed? Seriously?
They just make the already TERRIBLY strong 3 base timing pushs even stronger. I mean, I agree that a nerf is needed, but that's just the wrong way to fix PvZ. They need to nerf the infestor in a way where it does not affect the 3-base pushs of the Protoss AT ALL, because they are very strong (possibly too strong) even with the infestor in its current state.

Everyone knows how hard it was for the Zerg to defend against the "ultimate Protoss Death Ball" before infestors were used. Of course infestors could still be used after the nerf and they WILL be used after the nerf, but Forcefields are going to be a huge issue imo.

Zerg mid game's just horrible compared to the Protoss mid game without Infestors on the field. Every other unit just dies at this stage of the game.


I really agree with that, Zerg is lacking options mid game, the hydra should get a redesign to fit a missing role. (something like a range upgrade buff)
Sabu113
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States11047 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-21 18:03:57
November 21 2012 18:03 GMT
#826
This thread really is a showcase on zerg got buffed so hard to get to the state where they are now.

Some of these lines of thought. I feel like the immortal sentry allin has become some sort of meme. Infestors to hold off the immortal sentry push -.-
Biomine is a drunken chick who is on industrial strength amphetamines and would just grab your dick and jerk it as hard and violently as she could while screaming 'OMG FUCK ME', because she saw it in a Sasha Grey video ...-Wombat_Ni
Iksf
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom444 Posts
November 21 2012 18:03 GMT
#827
Blizzard need to stop trying to balance the game with minimal changes. Do something big to the infestor that rocks lategame ZvP hard, whatever comes out the other side can't be more boring than the current metagame.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
November 21 2012 18:07 GMT
#828
On November 22 2012 03:02 HaXXspetten wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 03:00 Crawdad wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:58 Insomni7 wrote:
Does the sentry immortal all-in need a buff? Not happy at all with the first change.


Infestors were used against Sentry/Immortal rush?

Ling/Infestor is a solid counter, yes?


Yeah, but is mostly hits before they come out and is held off with other units, flanking and better control. The infestors just put the nail in the coffin.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
ChApFoU
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
France2982 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-21 18:10:32
November 21 2012 18:09 GMT
#829
On November 22 2012 02:46 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:44 GeNeSiDe wrote:
Hydras solve the problem the zerg above me was screaming about, they are a high-DPS glass cannon which arent so horribly effected by forcefield as roaches and lings.

Hydralisks would still get utterly crushed by Sentries/Stalkers/Colossi.


If you're still on T2 as zerg while protoss has 2+ collossi with range you messed up somewhere.

To deal with late midgame sentry-heavy timings with collo you can still go ultra/bane Symbol style.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper in a genius" Kang Min
siax
Profile Joined April 2010
United States36 Posts
November 21 2012 18:09 GMT
#830
IMO i think the problem is not with the fungal it is with the infested terran, for a free army they are just way to strong, if the infested terran are weekend than the zerg will have to spend minerals on something to protect the BL and infestors.

the change will keep sentry's from being killed as easy once out of energy still as useless as a dead one and they dont do crap VS broodlords, arcons will not have as hard a time getting into the vortex but they can be blocked with infested terrans , the warp prism play can still be shut down even with out fungal, dt's are not normally used in late game and zerg still have spores and overseers, HT's don't normally get fungaled anyway.

so really i don't think that changing the fungal is really going to do much.
trampel the weak, hurdle the dead
Assirra
Profile Joined August 2010
Belgium4169 Posts
November 21 2012 18:10 GMT
#831
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.
Krogan
Profile Joined January 2011
Sweden375 Posts
November 21 2012 18:12 GMT
#832
Really like these changes.

I'd love to see the pheonix get made into a psionic unit as well, would make them viable for late game as well as an almost straight up counter to infestors.
zhurai
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States5660 Posts
November 21 2012 18:13 GMT
#833
On November 22 2012 03:10 Assirra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.

so your army doesn't like having detection around it?
Twitter: @zhurai | Site: http://zhurai.com
Lukeeze[zR]
Profile Joined February 2006
Switzerland6838 Posts
November 21 2012 18:13 GMT
#834
On November 22 2012 03:10 Assirra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.


yeah easily, it's well known that going through broodlords/infestors is a walk in the park.
Terran & Potato Salad.
Assirra
Profile Joined August 2010
Belgium4169 Posts
November 21 2012 18:14 GMT
#835
On November 22 2012 03:09 ChApFoU wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:46 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:44 GeNeSiDe wrote:
Hydras solve the problem the zerg above me was screaming about, they are a high-DPS glass cannon which arent so horribly effected by forcefield as roaches and lings.

Hydralisks would still get utterly crushed by Sentries/Stalkers/Colossi.


If you're still on T2 as zerg while protoss has 2+ collossi with range you messed up somewhere.

To deal with late midgame sentry-heavy timings with collo you can still go ultra/bane Symbol style.

Zerg takes way longer to go to different tiers of units cause of the whole hatch - lair - hive mechanic. Not only you need to wait to get to a certain tier but then you also need to build dedicated structure for your units.
If you honestly expect to get broodlords by the time that collosi get on the field you have no clue how zerg works.
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
November 21 2012 18:14 GMT
#836
On November 22 2012 03:10 Assirra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.

Such as? Marines? Fungal. Vikings? Fungal. And Zergs are allowed to build more than one Overseer, you know. Good luck sniping 5 Overseers among a BLs/Corruptors/Infestors army.
Tartagueul
Profile Joined March 2012
France4 Posts
November 21 2012 18:14 GMT
#837
Seeker missile change is useless against zerg. When you make ravens in late game versus zerg, you aren't short of 200 min and 200 gas. The issue is when all your ravens get crushed in 5 sec while it takes so much time to build them and get energy.

Assirra
Profile Joined August 2010
Belgium4169 Posts
November 21 2012 18:14 GMT
#838
On November 22 2012 03:13 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 03:10 Assirra wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.


yeah easily, it's well known that going through broodlords/infestors is a walk in the park.

once again with the broodlords, i must have missed the patch where zerg starts with free 10 broodlords.
Arco
Profile Joined September 2009
United States2090 Posts
November 21 2012 18:15 GMT
#839
On November 22 2012 03:02 HaXXspetten wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 03:00 Crawdad wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:58 Insomni7 wrote:
Does the sentry immortal all-in need a buff? Not happy at all with the first change.


Infestors were used against Sentry/Immortal rush?

Ling/Infestor is a solid counter, yes?

No, because it dies to a number of timing attacks that hit earlier than the Sentry/Immortal all in.

It's gambling that they're going to do one specific build against you.
discomatt
Profile Joined March 2012
113 Posts
November 21 2012 18:17 GMT
#840
On November 22 2012 03:10 Assirra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2012 02:53 TheDwf wrote:
On November 22 2012 02:51 Kahlgar wrote:
not sure what is going to prevent cloaked ghosts from wrecking zergs now, overseers are easily dealt with some timely pewpew and having spores with your army at all time doesn't seem that doable

What part of “it takes 9 Snipes to kill one Overseer” didn't you understand?

Wait, did they changed something so no other units can kill overseers?
You can easely snipe it with another group of units and then your cloaked ones have a free playground.


Except fungals will lock another group of units. Or a line of broodlings will prevent them from advancing.

Dropping Overseers over offensive units in a composition like Infestor/Brood Lord would be extremely silly. Bringing only a couple Overseers when cloaked units are a threat would also be extremely silly.
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