EPTCall to Action: Balance Testing (2012/11/20) - Page 38
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Lumi
United States1616 Posts
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figq
12519 Posts
On November 22 2012 01:51 SarcasmMonster wrote: The graph is from wikipedia, I haven't made it. I just saw it for the first time and was impressed, so I also posted it here.Can I ask what program you used to create those graphs? They look very nice and readable. The only thing I did was calculate those totals and averages from the table of the GSL Ranking points. And I had two mistakes, but now it's corrected. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On November 22 2012 01:50 MrFraische wrote: These changes are retarded! - Killing speed warp prisms in the later stages of the game will be completely impossible... Terrans don't have an option to catch up with a speed Warp Prism either, you know. On November 22 2012 01:50 MrFraische wrote: - Seeker missile is WAY too strong to be without the required upgrade (especially against corruptors and bl's) As if it changed anything to (a) the resources required to build a Raven fleet or (b) the time needed to accumulate enough energy to launch numerous Missiles. On November 22 2012 01:50 MrFraische wrote: - If ghosts and DT's are immune to fungal, how the F**** shit are we going to see them at all, considering the fact that overseers suck monkeyballs (slow, weak, easy to snipe and feedback) Overseers with the speed upgrade have a 2.75 movement speed, and they have 200 hit points. It takes 9 Snipes to kill an Overseer. Feedback can be thwarted if you use Changelings to deplete their mana pool, which you should anyway to scout your opponent's army. If Protoss manage to have detection against Cloaked Ghosts with a 60 hit points fragile thing, I guess keeping alive an Overseer cloud among an army of BLs/Corruptors/Infestors should not be that hard, despite the mind-boggling amount of Zerg bias you reveal here. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On November 22 2012 01:55 m0ck wrote: I'm arguing that zerg has no way of attacking into a protoss or terran, who focuses on defending, without BLs (outside of all-ins/all-in'ish timings). I'm saying that in all the talk about BL+infestor being too strong, people forget that there is no alternative for breaking turtling opponents. Terran and Protoss get their siege-units much earlier. Well fungle still damages and roots stalkers, colossi, zealots and immortals, phoenixes, voidrays and carriers. Unless your opponent is going mass archons, which you should be able to scout, I think the infestor will still be useful. If they go mass sentries late game....well they should stop playing SC2. | ||
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Purple Haze
United Kingdom200 Posts
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ZeromuS
Canada13407 Posts
My other worry is that the seeker missile really damages PvT with a new 1-1-1 variant coming out. | ||
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Salteador Neo
Andorra5591 Posts
On November 22 2012 01:59 TheDwf wrote: Terrans don't have an option to catch up with a speed Warp Prism either, you know. Protoss doesn't either. I wonder if they ever considered going back to the (1/3?) chance to miss against units on high ground of Brood War. Everyone seems to agree the game lacks more positional play during the whole game, and that would help. | ||
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marcjpb
Canada64 Posts
On November 21 2012 11:21 Zoku wrote: What exactly is the point of making psionic units immune to fungal. HT's and ghosts still can't get close enough to to feedback/emp infestors because of broodlords. All they've done it make midgame protoss stronger, while leave lategame zerg as still an issue. Seriously, do these guys even play or watch the game? Very nice and constructive post. If everyone would had post like yours, SC2 would be balance withint a few weeks tops. Maybe with all the changes, zerg will get harass more and they wont even reach the lategame everyone point out to be the biggest problem. | ||
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ScandiNAVIan
Korea (South)60 Posts
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Purple Haze
United Kingdom200 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:05 Salteador Neo wrote: Protoss doesn't either. I wonder if they ever considered going back to the (1/3?) chance to miss against units on high ground of Brood War. Everyone seems to agree the game lacks more positional play during the whole game, and that would help. They do have units in their standard army composition that can shoot up and kill it if it goes into phasing mode though. That's a pretty big difference. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:03 ZeromuS wrote: I need to hop on and try this. My worries are that protoss swings into too much favour in PvZ in the mid game thanks to the lack of fungal on psionic units. My other worry is that the seeker missile really damages PvT with a new 1-1-1 variant coming out. 2 PDDs > a single Missile + a lonely Turret in 1-1-1. | ||
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tianGO
Argentina591 Posts
I'm mid masters, NA server. | ||
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Lonyo
United Kingdom3884 Posts
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m0ck
4194 Posts
Zerg needs tier 3 to beat Protoss & Terran tier 1/tier 2. P & T needs tier 3 to beat Zerg tier 3. P&T could both use buffs to their T3 in order for them to actually be competitive. Z could use something in order for them not having to rely on the infestor for fighting the tier 1&2 of the other races and for getting to tier 3. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
I also like the fungal nerf, it could work too. Everything that make infestors less all rounder is good imo. | ||
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Seldentar
United States888 Posts
On November 21 2012 11:19 Sub40APM wrote: Thats all fine and good but how is this going to help in late game for protoss? Isnt their complaint based on that, that if they dont kill the Zerg by minute 18-20 there will be a wall of broodlings between their archons and the infestor? I guess they want to see more base trade scenarios where the protoss just goes mass archons and moves around the brood lords One big, cool change will be that high templars can be loaded into speed prisms and dropped near infestors. Before, this wouldn't be realistic because fungal would just stop any prism dead in its tracks. | ||
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xCherubiMx
United States25 Posts
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AKomrade
United States582 Posts
Also have no idea what they were smoking when they changed Fungal that way. I want some though. | ||
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Crawdad
614 Posts
Otherwise, the change is fine in my book. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:13 m0ck wrote: One way of looking at it: Zerg needs tier 3 to beat Protoss & Terran tier 1/tier 2. P & T needs tier 3 to beat Zerg tier 3. Oversimplification without much interest. You have to factor creep, economy, position... | ||
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![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/images2/6/6c/GSLraceW.png)
