EPTDestiny on where he thinks SC2 is heading. - Page 82
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zJayy962
1363 Posts
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On October 29 2012 02:28 jj33 wrote: I agree. Many of these people are are being super negative just reek of bitterness. they are probably really mad they are horrible at the game or their favorite players are not winning. Agreed. It is just people regurgitation the same information over and over. Slow periods are part of the natural cycle of business. I would be WAY more concerned if SC2 had endless growth at the speed it was. I am glad this period came right before HotS is coming. | ||
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phalanx
France43 Posts
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Toadvine
Poland2234 Posts
On October 29 2012 02:37 Plansix wrote: Agreed. It is just people regurgitation the same information over and over. Slow periods are part of the natural cycle of business. I would be WAY more concerned if SC2 had endless growth at the speed it was. I am glad this period came right before HotS is coming. Sure dawgs. Everything is fine, natural cycle of business, just haters hating, being bitter cause they're BW elitists and horrible at SC2. I'm sure it'll come true if you keep posting about it. See you in half a year or whenever I feel like browsing TL forums again. | ||
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klops
United States674 Posts
however, the manpower required to address the changes we want addressed (i.e. the client) will just be relegated to new projects with higher immediate monetary gain. that is how blizzard has worked since 2004. therefore to the person above me spouting "believe" like an obama campaign slogan, i see no reason to believe. what we have is what we get. | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10641 Posts
The part where DJWheat had to spoon-feed him the question multiple times for Destiny to stop acting stubborn and raising his voice was just off the charts hilarious. Its hard to take anything what Destiny says seriously. Why people are taking jabs at Incontrol is beyond me. | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:05 Emnjay808 wrote: I just watched ITG 57. Its hilarious how they brought Destiny on, cause they knew what would happen, and Destiny took the bait. The part where DJWheat had to spoon-feed him the question multiple times for Destiny to stop acting stubborn and raising his voice was just off the charts hilarious. Its hard to take anything what Destiny says seriously. Why people are taking jabs at Incontrol is beyond me. The whole ITG crew agreed on most things Destiny said, they were angry because destiny said sc2 is gonna die. Which I think was overexaggeration. Saying that hardly anything in destiny's post is true, is at least being ignorant, or completely blinded sc2 fanboy. | ||
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Salazarz
Korea (South)2590 Posts
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Martyrc
217 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:20 Salazarz wrote: People don't realize one thing: LoL growing does in fact hurt potential SC2 development, in fact it hurts a lot. Why? Because it's simply a better business decision to sponsor a LoL event or team than it is to sponsor an SC2 one. Both target the same demographic, but LoL has a much bigger audience. So if you're a company thinking about advertising your product to the 'gamer' demographic, it simply isn't a good choice to invest your money into SC2 any more - it's better spent on LoL related things. You forget that most LoL teams also have a SC2 team, sponsors just sponsor the whole team. So any LoL team that gets sponsored is prolly als money that goes to SC2. (Examples are Startale and Dignitas) | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10641 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:16 bokeevboke wrote: The whole ITG crew agreed on most things Destiny said, they were angry because destiny said sc2 is gonna die. Which I think was overexaggeration. Saying that hardly anything in destiny's post is true, is at least being ignorant, or completely blinded sc2 fanboy. I didnt read what Destiny posted. Just what was said on ITG. I didnt say Destiny was lying, he said SC2 is dying, who doesnt't agree with that? Doesnt take much to not be ignorant on that point. SC2 fanboy? I havent touched SC2 in over a year. My point was that Destiny handles himself in a very poor manner, and how do people take him seriously. That is what I am wondering. | ||
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zJayy962
1363 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:27 Emnjay808 wrote: I didnt read what Destiny posted. Just what was said on ITG. I didnt say Destiny was lying, he said SC2 is dying, who doesnt't agree with that? Doesnt take much to not be ignorant on that point. SC2 fanboy? I havent touched SC2 in over a year. My point was that Destiny handles himself in a very poor manner, and how do people take him seriously. That is what I am wondering. Theres hundreds of celebrities that "handle themselves in a very poor manner" and get paid to do so. | ||
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Coffeeling
Finland250 Posts
On October 29 2012 02:05 Doodsmack wrote: This is a good example of why I'm convinced that these doomsday threads are being primarily fueled by people who already didn't like SC2 and probably get a kick out of saying that there's no hope. Probably a lot of them are BW elitists too, who just love to tell us how much they hate SC2. A quick glance through some of this guy's posts shows almost nothing but negativity towards SC2 lol. Surely someone with a negative opinion towards any given topic is more likely to post than those with positive opinions. The vocal minority is out in full force in these threads. EDIT: LOL the guy 2 posts above me wcr.4fun just further proves my point. His post history is filled with SC2 negativity. He also has a lot of posts in the BW forums. Here's one gem re SC2: "I am SO glad I didn't buy diablo 3 despite some people reassuring me it would be money well spent; I decided to wait because of the failure that is sc2. I'm not buying HOTS any time soon unless some serious, serious changes in mentality and design happen. lmao." I liked SC2. It gave me lots and lots of entertainment. But slowly, over time it just got worse and worse. Balance decisions were made over and over again that made no sense to me, something about Blizzard's commentary on things just reinforced the notion that they don't know what they are doing. More patches came and reinforced the opinion. Then information on HOTS started coming in, the Queendralisk patch happened and Diablo 3 happened. Blizzard turned into a joke. Starcraft 2, very deep down, has pretty excellent foundations, and could turn into something great if managed properly. But the company at the helm isn't interested in enduring, solid fundamentals, simple meaty units that kill stuff and derive their interestingness from movement, a more basic but better-working custom game system, a worldbuilding campaign. Instead it's terrible terrible damage, hard counters, warpgates kept, more gimmicks, the horrid popularity system, and a campaign who thinks Hollywood moneyshots are great and "Who is Sarah Kerrigan?" is a super important question to answer. So sorry I'm a hater. | ||
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VanGarde
Sweden755 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:20 Salazarz wrote: People don't realize one thing: LoL growing does in fact hurt potential SC2 development, in fact it hurts a lot. Why? Because it's simply a better business decision to sponsor a LoL event or team than it is to sponsor an SC2 one. Both target the same demographic, but LoL has a much bigger audience. So if you're a company thinking about advertising your product to the 'gamer' demographic, it simply isn't a good choice to invest your money into SC2 any more - it's better spent on LoL related things. The problem here is that this argument which gets repeated over and over again does sound rational and plausible. It makes sense to anyone who reads it that if game A has more viewers than game B, then game A will inevitably get all the sponsors because they get more back from that. However the world does not operate like that. There are more people willing to do sponsorship's than there are sponsor spots to fill in one particular place. Lets think about this, imagine that we are in a position where neither game has a sponsor and League has twice the viewers of sc2. You are a sponsor looking to invest in either game. Realistically you are going to invest in League because that has more viewers. But what happens when a second sponsor enters the scene? Now the choice is not so obvious anymore. If Starcraft 2 has a viewer count that is above the needed minimum for the investment to be worth it, you probably want to invest there and be the only sponsor rather than to be the second sponsor and be in the shadows of whomever sponsored League first. In fact you have plenty of real life examples in e-sports of why the idea that all the sponsor money goes to the top guy is wrong. EG and Liquid are the biggest foreign teams so they can easily get good sponsors. But other teams are still capable of getting sponsors because you might rather want to go in and sponsor a team where your brand is one of the few ones instead of being the 16'th EG sponsor and barely noticed. You are not going to have Coca Cola and Pepsi sponsor the same tournament or the same team. They are going to sponsor different ones. It is fine for sc2 to be smaller than LoL. Sc2 just needs to concern itself with being big enough for it to be worthwhile to invest into it, that is not dependent on how League is doing. | ||
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mapexsaturn
Canada15 Posts
My take of the argument is that Destiny thinks that if Blizzard were smart, they would want to offer SC2 as a game to be played my a majority of gamers and that the more people we have to offer it to, the more success SC2 will have competitively. Their argument was that SC2 is a smaller game that caters to a smaller dedicated audience, that it never needs to be as big as LoL because it probably just won't happen and as long as they remain dedicated SC2 will do fine. I think that they are both right, although Destiny apparently has higher hopes and standards for where the game should get to in terms of popularity. I don't think he is approaching it negatively, he's saying "SC2 and LoL are not the same, LoL is progressively getting more popular as SC2 numbers are dipping. Why is this happening? Who is responsible. How can we make it better." I honestly don't think Destiny would go through the trouble of acting concerned about a problem he believes exists if he didn't want some conversations, arguments, and support to make the problem realized by everyone in the community - for change.. InControl, Idra, and djwheat are happy with the status of the game because that's what they dedicate their lives to! They want to hold on to their pride and how they've contributed to the gaming community making rationalizing their dedication as 'enough'. I think Destiny wants more for the game and is saying, 'this isn't enough guys, we need blizzard to do something, we need to make them make the game better in case this thing dies.' I think Destiny just thinks he doesn't actually need people to realize what he's actually trying to do when nobody really understands what's going on. | ||
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loiop
34 Posts
I agree thought that blizzard has failed or hasn't done a good job on almost all the things that destiny pointed out and that doesn't include the full list of failures. Worst thing for me is bad zerg and protoss gameplay design. | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:27 Emnjay808 wrote: I didnt read what Destiny posted. Just what was said on ITG. I didnt say Destiny was lying, he said SC2 is dying, who doesnt't agree with that? Doesnt take much to not be ignorant on that point. SC2 fanboy? I havent touched SC2 in over a year. My point was that Destiny handles himself in a very poor manner, and how do people take him seriously. That is what I am wondering. Why I am arguing if you even didn't read his post? djWheat and Incontrol were much worse than Destiny in terms of acting. | ||
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CiCeRoSC2
United States83 Posts
On October 29 2012 04:36 bokeevboke wrote: Why I am arguing if you even didn't read his post? djWheat and Incontrol were much worse than Destiny in terms of acting. Destiny basically ignored everything that iNcontroL and IdrA were saying, completely failing to realize that they were actually agreeing with 95% of what he said. Mostly they just disagreed with how he said it and the belief that SC2 would die without the fixes. Destiny then accused them of "defending Blizzard" which is completely ridiculous considering everything IdrA and iNcontroL have been saying for YEARS. When it was clear that Destiny wasn't listening to anything that he wasn't saying it really went downhill. Yes, iNcontroL was kinda ripping on him earlier, but thats just what he does. He's also made fun of Day9, Artosis, IdrA, you name it, and they all took it in stride. | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
On October 29 2012 04:56 CiCeRoSC2 wrote: Destiny basically ignored everything that iNcontroL and IdrA were saying, completely failing to realize that they were actually agreeing with 95% of what he said. Mostly they just disagreed with how he said it and the belief that SC2 would die without the fixes. Destiny then accused them of "defending Blizzard" which is completely ridiculous considering everything IdrA and iNcontroL have been saying for YEARS. When it was clear that Destiny wasn't listening to anything that he wasn't saying it really went downhill. Yes, iNcontroL was kinda ripping on him earlier, but thats just what he does. He's also made fun of Day9, Artosis, IdrA, you name it, and they all took it in stride. Honestly I don't care anymore. There are so many angles this situation can be viewed from, and even more opinions people generate from it. This discussion won't go anywhere. I just argued with Emnjay808 because he said everything Destiny said is wrong, when actually ITG mostly agreed with Destiny except the way he posted it and Sky falling down attitude. | ||
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Ownos
United States2147 Posts
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stille_nacht
United States34 Posts
On October 29 2012 03:25 Martyrc wrote: + Show Spoiler + On October 29 2012 03:20 Salazarz wrote: People don't realize one thing: LoL growing does in fact hurt potential SC2 development, in fact it hurts a lot. Why? Because it's simply a better business decision to sponsor a LoL event or team than it is to sponsor an SC2 one. Both target the same demographic, but LoL has a much bigger audience. So if you're a company thinking about advertising your product to the 'gamer' demographic, it simply isn't a good choice to invest your money into SC2 any more - it's better spent on LoL related things. You forget that most LoL teams also have a SC2 team, sponsors just sponsor the whole team. So any LoL team that gets sponsored is prolly als money that goes to SC2. (Examples are Startale and Dignitas) yes because Startale and Dignitas definitely were top contenders in the recent LoL finals... most league teams are just that: league teams. They dont see the point of forming an alternative, starcraft team, when the time and effort is better spent in league. but yeah... the primary problem is that as it stands, because there isnt a whole lot of "constant money" from starcraft (whether it be from sales or skins or whatever), Blizzard just isn't making money off the pro-scene. Screw other sponsors, Blizzard isn't making money off of tournaments that feature its product. Riot can blow 2 million on a single tournament's prize money (nevermind the gdamn stadium) and expect a pretty good return, because guess what, they actually attract new customers. Starcraft needs to get more casual friendly in some major way, and only blizzard can really make that happen. (And mind you, i have no definite ideas here ><)... I really hope they do, because LoL is a very boring sport for someone used to all the intricacies of starcraft :l, i mean, it's nice and all, but you can't compare checkers to speed chess. also, the amount of ad hominem in this thread... it is expected and astounding :l | ||
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