Due to the cancellation of the Anime Comics and Games show in Guangzhou, China, we regret to inform that the Intel Extreme Masters China tournament will not take place. The ACG will not be taking place on the dates which were originally scheduled for September 30 - October 4. The official statement by ACG quotes problems with the increased expected visitor traffic and manpower shortage due to the holiday season in China. Unofficial sources in China report that the cancellation was connected to the current political unrest between China and Japan and the nature of the ACG show which heavily features Japanese culture, causing security concerns.
With the venue not being available for the Intel Extreme Masters tournament, no alternative solution could be found for ESL and Intel to deliver a high standard tournament in Guangzhou on the same dates.
ESL's Director of Pro Gaming Michał Blicharz has issued the following statement:
"We were all looking forward to going to China yet again as last year's tournament in Guangzhou, at the same venue, was a great success for us. Fans from all over the world surely remember Greg "IdrA" Fields' successful run through the tournament as well as the first ever encounter between Western League of Legends teams and their Chinese counterparts.
We are terribly sorry to disappoint esports fans that were expecting to enjoy the event, especially all Chinese esports fans. Unfortunately, the circumstances that forced the cancellation upon us were entirely beyond our control, though we understand and respect the decisions made by the Anime Comics and Games organizers.
Despite this setback, we are working very hard on delivering more fantastic events for esports fans around the world. We will soon announce more Intel Extreme Masters tournaments, including another one in Asia."
The teams and players that have already qualified for Intel Extreme Masters China and booked their travel will be contacted by ESL about compensation.
As the disagreement between Japan and China escalates, esports becomes the latest victim.
IEM Guangzhou was scheduled to begin in just a few short weeks on September 30. But with the problems caused by China and Japan's argument over the Senkaku islands getting worse, the computer fair that hosts the event has been forced to close. Without a venue for the tournament, ESL had no choice but to cancel the tournaments and shut down IEM Guangzhou altogether.
The tournament was due to be part of the IEM circuit, leading up to the grand finals in March. The qualifiers for this event are currently ongoing, but with the tournament cancelled the qualifiers become largely meaningless except for the entertainment factor they brought to viewers.
A member of ESL staff told GosuGamers that a large proportion of the exhibitors at the fair were Japanese and were therefore barred from attending during the argument between the two countries. With so many stalls left empty, the ACG expo was left with no choice but to cut their losses and cancel the event.
ESL will be releasing an official statement on the matter shortly.
Well that's killing a little slice of esports. I had previously all but ignored the Japan/China thread, but that problem is a lot bigger than I'd hoped.
On September 19 2012 00:18 TheDougler wrote: That sucks. Makes sense though. Good on IEM for making the safer choice for their tournament and the players.
what choice? the convention they were going to hold the event on was closed
On September 19 2012 00:16 JustPassingBy wrote: Can't they just hold everything online?
A lot less fair and not nearly as fun for the viewers ... they'll probably find something different , but it's likely not as good as this would have been.
this sucks, but safety first. totally understandable decision by the fair organisors. Let`s see what ESL does now. maybe online? maybe in the cologne studios? I prefer the later.
IEM doesn't pay full flights usually though, I get the feeling some of the korean/chinese players only played qualifiers because they knew they could make up the difference of IEM's travel stipend cheaply since the event was geographically close. Even if IEM invited them to the next event in wherever, I dunno if they could afford it (or get visas, especially for the chinese players).
Wow this really is a horrible situation I'm glad that they decided to cancel for safety/finical reasons but it just makes it difficult for the players/spectators. I hope they listed to everyone and have those who qualified participant in the next event!
Wonder if IEM has some kind of insurance that will help it recoup its losses, or whether the company simply has to absorb the revenue loss (if it can).
Wow, that sucks. Really unfortunate turn of events. Sad for the players who already qualified of course, but also for everybody else who has put work into this.
On September 19 2012 00:22 Waxangel wrote: IEM doesn't pay full flights usually though, I get the feeling some of the korean/chinese players only played qualifiers because they knew they could make up the difference of IEM's travel stipend cheaply since the event was geographically close. Even if IEM invited them to the next event in wherever, I dunno if they could afford it (or get visas, especially for the chinese players).
There is even no Chinese qualifier for IEM Guangzhou because ESL China is literally, shit.
On September 19 2012 00:22 Waxangel wrote: IEM doesn't pay full flights usually though, I get the feeling some of the korean/chinese players only played qualifiers because they knew they could make up the difference of IEM's travel stipend cheaply since the event was geographically close. Even if IEM invited them to the next event in wherever, I dunno if they could afford it (or get visas, especially for the chinese players).
There is even no Chinese qualifier for IEM Guangzhou because ESL China is literally, shit.
Unfortunate news, why don't they move the even to Taiwan instead?!?! The location is close to China and I don't see any Taiwanese getting involved in the Chinese / Japanese conflict at all!! Just a thought...
On September 19 2012 00:22 Waxangel wrote: IEM doesn't pay full flights usually though, I get the feeling some of the korean/chinese players only played qualifiers because they knew they could make up the difference of IEM's travel stipend cheaply since the event was geographically close. Even if IEM invited them to the next event in wherever, I dunno if they could afford it (or get visas, especially for the chinese players).
There is even no Chinese qualifier for IEM Guangzhou because ESL China is literally, shit.
*figuratively
this fits too well to be ignored, here the penultimate xkcd chapter: http://xkcd.com/1108/
Really sad, but i don't know why this can be played out online instead. This would mean much less fun and also an smaller price pool, but at least it wouldn't make the whole qualifiers worthless!!
On September 19 2012 00:40 Kazeyonoma wrote: sigh, seriously, this is a huge disappointment. -_-', this definitely isn't helping China earn any karma points taht's for sure.
There are two sides to this issue. Neither country is free of guilt.
On September 19 2012 00:40 Kazeyonoma wrote: sigh, seriously, this is a huge disappointment. -_-', this definitely isn't helping China earn any karma points taht's for sure.
There are two sides to this issue. Neither country is free of guilt.
User was warned for this post
Why is this warned and not the original? Makes no sense
Damn, this is just stupid. A couple of tiny uninhabited islands in the middle of the ocean and you have to cancel a major Starcraft event because of that? Come on.
Yesterday me and some friends talked about the conflict and the potential impact on the WCS Event in China and completly forgot about IEM Guangzhou. But good to see, that IEM tries to compensate the qualified players/teams.
On September 19 2012 00:19 Dismay wrote: Hope it doesn't interfere with WCS finals...
I should hope it would be resolved at that point.. I hope. It would be a shame if it had to be relocated, the WCS final in Shanghai would be amazing for everybody involved, seeing as Blizzards aim to is to promote SC2 in china, it would highly suck if politics gets in the way.
Anyways, I hope everyone gets the point that this isn't directly about the protests/violence/politics. It wasn't Intel making a decision based on ethics. It wasn't their decision at all. Their rental in the venue is simply being denied.
Unlike IEM, I don't think WCS would simply be cancelled. It would most likely be relocated. There's still months left.
I've been watching the dispute closely but never though it'd directly effect SC2 esports like this D:
So no more events in China? If a government can't (won't?) guarantee safety for a venue like this I don't think we should give it the prestige and economy.
Edit: On second thought, threre's more nuance to it...
I wish the selfish people in here who only care about their favourite players qualifying or re-locating elsewhere think for a damn moment that safety is #1 rule in any environment
And that's why esports tournament should stop leeching on conventions and get out of that confort zone, man up and get their own venues. I feel very sad for ESL as this is completely out of their control
It should not affect the WCS event because it's just an esport event and it has nothing to do with Japanese culture whatsoever, there is not even a Japanese gamer in it.
On September 19 2012 00:40 Kazeyonoma wrote: sigh, seriously, this is a huge disappointment. -_-', this definitely isn't helping China earn any karma points taht's for sure.
There are two sides to this issue. Neither country is free of guilt.
User was warned for this post
Why is this warned and not the original? Makes no sense
On September 19 2012 00:49 Louis8k8 wrote: Anyways, I hope everyone gets the point that this isn't directly about the protests/violence/politics. It wasn't Intel making a decision based on ethics. It wasn't their decision at all. Their rental in the venue is simply being denied.
Unlike IEM, I don't think WCS would simply be cancelled. It would most likely be relocated. There's still months left.
I've been watching the dispute closely but never though it'd directly effect SC2 esports like this D:
On September 19 2012 00:54 johnny123 wrote: wonder if the events in china will cancel the WCS finals? isnt that in china as well?
Completely different situation. The IEM event was apparently held together with an anime convention and the place got closed down because of the anime, which of course has a lot of Japanese influence, not because of the eSports event.
WCS is a completely separate event and unless they happen to also host their event together with a convention of a part of Japanese culture, it should be fine.
I thinking "what the hell"... then I read the article and saw it was an ANIME conference. Yeah, not good to attend a conference centered around Japanese culture during the high point of a tide of anti-Japanese racism.
On September 19 2012 00:49 Louis8k8 wrote: Anyways, I hope everyone gets the point that this isn't directly about the protests/violence/politics. It wasn't Intel making a decision based on ethics. It wasn't their decision at all. Their rental in the venue is simply being denied.
Unlike IEM, I don't think WCS would simply be cancelled. It would most likely be relocated. There's still months left.
I've been watching the dispute closely but never though it'd directly effect SC2 esports like this D:
WCS will not be affected.
This is most likely true. From what I can tell, the Chinese public won't give half a shit if a bunch of non-Japanese people are mucking about... the issue was that IEM was at an anime expo, which obviously means there's going to be a lot of Japanese people and products and companies. WCS is an American-sponsored event for an American product with North/South American, European, Korean, and Chinese participants, all of whom are either neutral on the issue or on China's side (in Korea's case).
Thats too bad, unfortunately its way too late to make alternative arrangements. I liked IEM Guangzhou last year and was looking forward to it this year.
I wonder if this will impact the WCS later this year at all if tensions remain.
Can't believe how much nationalism there is over a small rock in the ocean. Sad to see this crap ruin what I expected to be another great IEM tournament.
On September 19 2012 00:16 JustPassingBy wrote: Can't they just hold everything online?
Playing China vs EU games online would be absolute madness for everyone involved. :D
In other words, its because of limitations from the sides of blizzard?
Too bad. There always been the talk about esports going beyond borders, that your gender, race or ethical background simply do not matter plus various others cheesy statements. I think it would've been a good time to prove that and put the spotlight on our scene.
Mmmm WCS and WCG finals in November both in China.. if the political climate deteriorates more with like scenarios of USA having to interfere on Japans side.. then both of those events could be compromised aswell.
Blizzard better prepare a backup plan to host the WCS at Dreamhack Winter.
Shame for IEM hope the players and organizers can be compensated.
Meh, I was pumped to play there and experience China.
Haters gonna hate. They will play their big games over there, we'll play our small games over here. Suit boys fighting :p kinda disappointing and sad that this has to happen in 2012, but that's life. We're not even close to this conflict and still the hate ripples all over the world. Something to bear in mind!
On September 19 2012 01:29 JustPassingBy wrote: In other words, its because of limitations from the sides of blizzard?
EU to China latency was terrible in WC3 (using LAN mode over something like VPN) as well, possible because of the Great Firewall of China in addition to the obvious distance.
On September 19 2012 00:55 Marou wrote: And that's why esports tournament should stop leeching on conventions and get out of that confort zone, man up and get their own venues.
Events are barely breaking even as is. ESL has been running the IEM since 2006 and cutting costs and increasing revenue by holding their tournaments in gaming expos has surely been one of the reasons they are still around.
well thats sad. However, they said they are looking for a replacement tournament in Asia, so maybe this tournament is merely postponed instead of flat out cancelled.
To give a little insight as to how high this tension is, a person in China was dragged out of his car and beat to death on the street for driving a Toyota. And while the current direct cause of this tension is over these islands, the root of the discontent goes way back to Sino-Japanese war in late 1800's. While China-Japan-Korea try to cooperate with each other for advancement of East Asia, there is a pretty deep dislike (or hatred in some people's case) due to history of wars.
If this does affect the WCS World Championships that would suck. But hey, I guess I wouldn't mind Blizzard simply giving Dreamhack the privilege of running another amazing tournament should that happen. Not gonna happen of course, but it would be cool as hell for a Stockholmer like me.
On September 19 2012 00:16 JustPassingBy wrote: Can't they just hold everything online?
While it's possible, I think everyone would agree that cancelling it is the better option. Online tournaments don't cut it these days for major tournament organizers like IEM.
On September 19 2012 02:15 Bogeyman wrote: Hmmmmm..... yes this is unfortunate.
If this does affect the WCS World Championships that would suck. But hey, I guess I wouldn't mind Blizzard simply giving Dreamhack the privilege of running another amazing tournament should that happen. Not gonna happen of course, but it would be cool as hell for a Stockholmer like me.
I don't see how this could have any effect on the WCS unless they were planning on hosting it at the same venue as some manga-anime-con in order to cut costs?
On September 19 2012 02:31 DMZ wrote: I wonder if they can just hold it in another place. Not Guangzhou, but what about Hong Kong or somewhere relatively nearby?
They can't because they were piggy backing on a convention for cheaper hosting. Had this been a venue rented by IEM for IEM, there wasn't going to be an issue. But it was piggy backed on an anime convention - and China is in no mood for anime.
Really bothers me how bad this is getting :/ But still looking forward to the next IEM. I hope the qualified players are transfered over to the next one.
On September 19 2012 00:34 ache7759 wrote: Unfortunate news, why don't they move the even to Taiwan instead?!?! The location is close to China and I don't see any Taiwanese getting involved in the Chinese / Japanese conflict at all!! Just a thought...
On September 19 2012 02:31 DMZ wrote: I wonder if they can just hold it in another place. Not Guangzhou, but what about Hong Kong or somewhere relatively nearby?
As far as I understood it, the Intel Extreme Masters (IEM) is a tournament series latched onto Intel's advertising presence at trade shows and conventions. If Intel isn't there, there will be no IEM that is paid for. It's virtually impossible to find a new equally-sized and serviced venue on such short notice, especially in another country.
And it's not about little uninhabited islands, but about the abundance of natural resources believed to be there. That coupled with historical adverse sentiment led indirectly to a canceled Japanese anime fair, which in turn bereft IEM of their tournament location. A real shame.
China is a nationalistic-educated (brainwashed?) country ruled by one and only communist party. Any gatherings that can be linked to political issues, even as remote as Japanese culture, can have collateral damages, just as this IEM.
Blizzard should have taken this as a lesson, what if WCS in Shanghai is threatened to cancel as well? What if some of the players were denied Visa? Did Blizzard take that into account?
Wow, almost missed that. It's placed so near the banner, with nothing especially outstanding that I just passed it on first page. I'm happy that I noticed it when moving to last page. Lucky me, no ban today!
On September 19 2012 01:29 JustPassingBy wrote: In other words, its because of limitations from the sides of blizzard?
EU to China latency was terrible in WC3 (using LAN mode over something like VPN) as well, possible because of the Great Firewall of China in addition to the obvious distance.
Regarding latency, I saw CN vs foreigners play broodwar recently, and the latency wasn't that horrible. But okay. I admit, I don't know whether the foreigners were in EU or NA, I just assumed EU as the games were played in EU primetime.
On September 19 2012 02:42 Enders116 wrote: I was actually going to post that here myself, but it seems TL beat me to it.
This would've disappointed me if I was in Hong Kong studying for my master's like I plan to. I just want the fucking commies to stop doing this shit.
It's not communism if the profits aren't common to all. They may call themselves whatever they want but it still is not communism, you should stop being offensive on these forums, they are more civil than this.
so will we be getting a replacement event or tournament? I mean the matches still need to be played for the grand finals in march, unless they decide to seed people from their other tournaments.
That's a pity. If their recent show at gamescon was any indicator, IEM has really stepped up their game this year.
What other events do they have lined up for Season VII? Was Guangzhou the only one left this year?
They normally run a tournament in New York during NYCC in October (which I've attended for the past couple of years), but that's barely three weeks away now, and I have yet to encounter any announcements or qualifier information to suggest that they'll be returning for 2012...
On September 19 2012 07:34 Meggiroth wrote: I still don't understand why blizzard chose China to host the wcs finals. What will they chose next year? North Korea?
Marketing their product on a place full of gamers where SC2 isn't that popular yet
On September 19 2012 07:34 Meggiroth wrote: I still don't understand why blizzard chose China to host the wcs finals. What will they chose next year? North Korea?
On September 19 2012 07:34 Meggiroth wrote: I still don't understand why blizzard chose China to host the wcs finals. What will they chose next year? North Korea?
because there are 1.4 billion people in the country which means there are so damn many fans/would be fans... just look at how big WC3 got there
On September 19 2012 07:34 Meggiroth wrote: I still don't understand why blizzard chose China to host the wcs finals. What will they chose next year? North Korea?
China was a huge country in terms of other esports like bw/wc3/dota. Why not?
Small part of me died when reading this. I had all but ignored China/Japan conflict but this is starting to take a turn for worse. I can only hope they settle this so that the WCS can go smoothly. I wonder what IEM would've done had the fare still taken place. Would they have sent the players there knowing there could be a possibility of small mayhem?
Shame people still arguing over events that took place before my own father was even born. WWII vets are all dead or on their deathbeds by now. Wish people would move on past their differences. Something as universial as Esports shouldn't have to suffer.
Marines have been posturing on both sides over and island expansion. One side is bringing carriers around the scene while the other side is showing its tanks force as deterrent but fears the marauders. Overall we see the tension creeping and both sides have started having zealots in reaction.
And this causes a Starcraft 2 event to be cancelled.
I feel bad for ESL, I hope this doesn't end up reflecting poorly on them. More often than not, people don't tend to read the full story. Also huge props to ESL for offering to cover the penalty / cancellation fees for the participants. I booked GLaDe's flights and accommodation 2 days ago, only to discover this yesterday. >_<
lol not surprising..China has a really retarded part of their personality. Not that I have anything against Chinese, but it's true. Gotz tons of Chinese friends and I'm going to China next summer, but they've got some mad issues to get over.
I've been hearing about this for a while but haven't really read in depth about it. Now that it's affecting esports and on TL I think I need to start learning more about it.
This sucks, I currently reside in China and was planning to make a trip to Guangzhou to watch the event . Fuk politics, but it was a wise decision since any thing Japan-related in China right now is very dangerous.
Well,IEM is just a little part of ACG,its impossible for us to have cultural communicate with japan this time. WCS is nothing about japan,it would be going well both Asia and global final in SH
On September 19 2012 11:12 Exia0276 wrote: Well this sucks. First time there's an esports event near me and it gets cancelled...
They could perhaps relocate to Hong Kong?
Perhaps, but not in that time frame, the political dispute began like 3 weeks before event. And you can't get everything done to relocate in that time.
On September 19 2012 12:52 Shinta) wrote: lol not surprising..China has a really retarded part of their personality. Not that I have anything against Chinese, but it's true. Gotz tons of Chinese friends and I'm going to China next summer, but they've got some mad issues to get over.
It's actually quite prudent for them to think far enough a head to cancel an ANIME convention in a MAJOR CITY.
I'd like to think of the Chinese organizers and ESL as pretty damn responsible for taking the hits and protecting the players instead of just going on with it in some smaller way.
On September 19 2012 18:52 CrAyZeD wrote: Why don't WE just keep tournaments out of China WE know they have sketchy political views compared to the rest of the world :O
On September 19 2012 18:16 cronichazel wrote: I am really worried for WCS finals, like most of us....
Keeping my fingers crossed :S
How so? If I recall correctly no Japanese player has qualified for it, and it is going to be an event hosted by Blizzard. There's not really all too much that can go wrong unless Blizzard wants to make a political stand, but otherwise I am not sure how the WCS will be affected.
On September 19 2012 18:16 cronichazel wrote: I am really worried for WCS finals, like most of us....
Keeping my fingers crossed :S
How so? If I recall correctly no Japanese player has qualified for it, and it is going to be an event hosted by Blizzard. There's not really all too much that can go wrong unless Blizzard wants to make a political stand, but otherwise I am not sure how the WCS will be affected.
Yeah it's crap to be worried about WCS ._. If you had read the thread you'd know this only got cancelled because it was held at an Anime Comics and Games convention and thus there were a crap ton of Japanese going to it. WCS on the other hand might have a few Japanese spectators, if at all.
On September 19 2012 11:12 Exia0276 wrote: Well this sucks. First time there's an esports event near me and it gets cancelled...
They could perhaps relocate to Hong Kong?
Perhaps, but not in that time frame, the political dispute began like 3 weeks before event. And you can't get everything done to relocate in that time.
What about postponing the event for a few weeks? Even if the production isn't epic as planned, I'm sure the audience will stow away their pitchforks under such circumstances. FXO's mc-mansion in Malaysia is big enough to host the SC2 portion (omg pool-side tourney!), especially with their uber fios connection and all. :p
I'd much rather this event canceled then players have the potential of being in a firefight or be in a country that is about going to war with Japan. This is really unforntunate this all started with a group fishermen who stumbled onto the island that were captured by Chinese forces and only has escalated since.
On September 19 2012 18:52 CrAyZeD wrote: Why don't WE just keep tournaments out of China WE know they have sketchy political views compared to the rest of the world :O
True! I wondered why Blizzard decided to host the WCS finals in china and not in sweden
On September 19 2012 18:52 CrAyZeD wrote: Why don't WE just keep tournaments out of China WE know they have sketchy political views compared to the rest of the world :O
True! I wondered why Blizzard decided to host the WCS finals in china and not in sweden
On September 19 2012 18:52 CrAyZeD wrote: Why don't WE just keep tournaments out of China WE know they have sketchy political views compared to the rest of the world :O
True! I wondered why Blizzard decided to host the WCS finals in china and not in sweden
Most likely to promote it there. China has enormous amount of people and what better way to promote your game then origanize the World Championship Series there?
On September 19 2012 18:52 CrAyZeD wrote: Why don't WE just keep tournaments out of China WE know they have sketchy political views compared to the rest of the world :O
But they make so nice offers.
This is actually a pretty important thing, and probably get even more important as the time comes. There is a simple fact: China has money. And nother one: China does not answer to anyone. Many people tend to overlook the later because of the temptation of the former.
I can see it even in academia, you hear it here and there - let's go to China with the project, they have money to fund it ... yes, they do, but you have no guarantee of anything when you start fiddling with China. So in the end, it's up to anyone: do we follow the glittering of the gold, or the common sense?
I am not saying that you can't make good business with China. But surely as hell you have to be ready a surprise or two along the way.
I have to wonder why it's held in Guangzhou of all places...that's not exactly the most, um...friendly area of China if you catch my drift. Why not somewhere less eh...shady, shall we say...? Genuinely curious here.
That really does suck.... wow, it must really have gotten serious then. Really a big shame to see an esport event as big as this in China end up getting cancelled.
WCS should still be fine as long as it isn't tied to any anime event. Starcraft isn't Japanese, so it should be spared from Chinese rage. As long as Tokyopop doesn't advertise any of their warcraft or starcraft manga in there ....
On September 19 2012 00:48 acidbean wrote: Yesterday me and some friends talked about the conflict and the potential impact on the WCS Event in China and completly forgot about IEM Guangzhou. But good to see, that IEM tries to compensate the qualified players/teams.
Small rock islands give you huge ocean territory, which could have huge natural resources reservoir.
On September 19 2012 04:21 GhandiEAGLE wrote: This nonsensical hatred in China is even hurting esports T_T
Too bad, I was really looking forward to this.
Nonsensical? The japanese have a history of abusing the chinese
User was temp banned for this post.
Why ban this, but not the previous post? He is stating the facts, in WW II, Japaneses did abuse most east asian countries, just like what Germany did to Jews. Difference is German constantly apologies for many years, Japanese never did once.
If German never apologized, can you imagine the hatred in Polish people when they face a territory argument with Germany?
Even after all those apology and good gesture for decades from Germany, Greek was burning Germany flag for what? for Germany giving them money.
People in TL needs to get out the shell, and look at the real world once a while.
waht the fuck seriously fuck this nationalism bullshit. this shit should never get in between a fair competition. I understand they might have to cancel it out of safety reasons but this is just not right.
On September 21 2012 00:01 Railxp wrote: waht the fuck seriously fuck this nationalism bullshit. this shit should never get in between a fair competition. I understand they might have to cancel it out of safety reasons but this is just not right.
Fair competition is a myth, only kids believe that. US pulled too many tactics on Japanese companies 1 or 2 decades ago, even recently on Toyota, now focus is on China and South Korea.
On September 19 2012 04:21 GhandiEAGLE wrote: This nonsensical hatred in China is even hurting esports T_T
Too bad, I was really looking forward to this.
Nonsensical? The japanese have a history of abusing the chinese
User was temp banned for this post.
Why ban this, but not the previous post? He is stating the facts, in WW II, Japaneses did abuse most east asian countries, just like what Germany did to Jews. Difference is German constantly apologies for many years, Japanese never did once.
If German never apologized, can you imagine the hatred in Polish people when they face a territory argument with Germany?
Even after all those apology and good gesture for decades from Germany, Greek was burning Germany flag for what? for Germany giving them money.
People in TL needs to get out the shell, and look at the real world once a while.
Is it just me... Or does the Japanese just don't care as much about the rioting Chinese around the world? Including some Chinese even in countries where there's been 5-6 generations of Chinese which most have not even been back to China? An honest question..
EPT
