|
|
On September 13 2012 10:14 Jarree wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:04 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 10:02 Pimpmuckl wrote:On September 13 2012 10:00 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 09:57 Integra wrote:
The real main problems are
1) why did they send him over and take his money before the contract was signed.
2) why did they refuse to return his money when he wanted to go back, they didn't offer a return until he threatened to tell people.
3) why did they not allow a another person to view the contract.
If these three things would had been fixed/never happened this drama wouldn't exist today, plain and simple. Exactly. Add in the bad "statements" they're giving and how unprofessionally they've dealt with this stuff. Of course, the "boss" guy's scam-tournament where he basically tried to steal money off teams and you get quite a shady organisation. I didn't get the last part, any link to an explanation? edit: and ban this pallad guy from this thread already, talking about how the "TL community" goes down the drain and attacking everyone left and right. Yea well its the top comment on reddit atm. The guy who runs the house has a scammer's image in Poland. http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/zs2bh/drama_in_mow_house/c678kmj lol
This comment I think is about this Gus guy at some SEA Tourney disaster.
Dont wanna derail the hate train though. If sb comes up with a good story why the "boss" still owes gunrun money roll with it.
|
On September 13 2012 10:15 Integra wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:14 Jarree wrote:On September 13 2012 10:04 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 10:02 Pimpmuckl wrote:On September 13 2012 10:00 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 09:57 Integra wrote:
The real main problems are
1) why did they send him over and take his money before the contract was signed.
2) why did they refuse to return his money when he wanted to go back, they didn't offer a return until he threatened to tell people.
3) why did they not allow a another person to view the contract.
If these three things would had been fixed/never happened this drama wouldn't exist today, plain and simple. Exactly. Add in the bad "statements" they're giving and how unprofessionally they've dealt with this stuff. Of course, the "boss" guy's scam-tournament where he basically tried to steal money off teams and you get quite a shady organisation. I didn't get the last part, any link to an explanation? edit: and ban this pallad guy from this thread already, talking about how the "TL community" goes down the drain and attacking everyone left and right. Yea well its the top comment on reddit atm. The guy who runs the house has a scammer's image in Poland. http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/zs2bh/drama_in_mow_house/c678kmj lol thegunrun 291pistettä 4tuntia sitten
he still owes me 1k usd
LOL, what the hell, he even owns the gunrun, 1k what hahaha.
read the post gunrun is replying to and think for like 5 seconds...
|
I wonder what the sponsors would think if you e-mail'd them about all this shady stuff with this guy being an old scammer and them not allowing Fuzer's lawyer to view the contract xD. Thats ridiculous.
|
On September 13 2012 10:16 scares wrote:
Karmy are you allowed to answer, if the NDA stops a Pro from taking 5 teammates and coaching them in a house paid by the Team/sponsors?
It doesn't stop you from that, It stops you from creating, or help create a company with knowledge that was exclusive from MoW. Say they have a very unique, unused practice regime that NO other team has started using, And when you join onto a new team house they to start up the exact same regime it would be suspicious.
As stated before the NDA wouldn't hold up it court, But it was to scare players into not spilling the secrets.
|
On September 13 2012 10:18 Awesomeness wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:15 Integra wrote:On September 13 2012 10:14 Jarree wrote:On September 13 2012 10:04 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 10:02 Pimpmuckl wrote:On September 13 2012 10:00 Leijona wrote:On September 13 2012 09:57 Integra wrote:
The real main problems are
1) why did they send him over and take his money before the contract was signed.
2) why did they refuse to return his money when he wanted to go back, they didn't offer a return until he threatened to tell people.
3) why did they not allow a another person to view the contract.
If these three things would had been fixed/never happened this drama wouldn't exist today, plain and simple. Exactly. Add in the bad "statements" they're giving and how unprofessionally they've dealt with this stuff. Of course, the "boss" guy's scam-tournament where he basically tried to steal money off teams and you get quite a shady organisation. I didn't get the last part, any link to an explanation? edit: and ban this pallad guy from this thread already, talking about how the "TL community" goes down the drain and attacking everyone left and right. Yea well its the top comment on reddit atm. The guy who runs the house has a scammer's image in Poland. http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/zs2bh/drama_in_mow_house/c678kmj lol thegunrun 291pistettä 4tuntia sitten
he still owes me 1k usd
LOL, what the hell, he even owns the gunrun, 1k what hahaha. read the post gunrun is replying to and think for like 5 seconds...
ya you are right, might as well go to bed, can't read anymore 
|
On September 13 2012 10:01 insanet wrote:
You are wrong. before leaving he asked for the money. not after.
Then he should post some evidence
[11.9.2012 12:41:24] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: so you have to pay me back from th emoney
[11.9.2012 12:41:33] Boss: nope, I don't have
[11.9.2012 12:41:40] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: ok
[11.9.2012 12:41:50] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: so i paid you from this month
[11.9.2012 12:41:53] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: and im not here for this month
[11.9.2012 12:41:56] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: so you give back my money
[11.9.2012 12:41:58] Boss: You are breaking the rules
[11.9.2012 12:42:02] Boss: you know how it works?
[11.9.2012 12:42:06] Boss: If not - read the contract again
[11.9.2012 12:42:08] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: well
[11.9.2012 12:42:11] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: as you said i pooped
[11.9.2012 12:42:17] Boss: So I don't have your money
[11.9.2012 12:42:41] Samuli "Fuzer" Romppanen: I am not worthy.
btw this one is fake. Why is he posting one skype log in a picture and the other one in text? And he was still in his "sign till XX or leave" time when he asked for his money so yeah i wouldn't pay him back either at that time. He has to officially leave before he can see any refund or else he is still using their service.
|
Has anyone considered that Ret is there? For some reason just the fact of that makes me think the 10 year agreement just didn't happen, unless players can/are contracted differently?
|
Does anyone know the timeframe between;
The original amendments made to the contract and Fuzer asking if his lawyer can see it?
Fuzer asking if his lawyer can see it and the MoW not recieving the documentation of a real lawyer?
Was it the month that he stayed there? If so, I'm backing the MoW here.
First of all, 600 euros a month seems pretty cheap for what you get (compared to living in Sydney anyway)
Secondly, 10 hours of gametime (5 hours of private prac + 150 hours per month streaming) per day isn't that long when your goal was to go there to game
Thirdly (unsure on this one really), you'd still get a revenue from streaming - one that you didn't have beforehand - and from what I've heard the cut they take isn't that much?
Finally, there was a month to get the shit sorted and it wasn't. What'd you think was going to happen?
I do think they should return a pro-rata amount for the time he wasn't staying there though (which to my knowledge was offered and declined?) and that 10 years of not being a coach/starting a gaming house is probably a bit much, but since I work for a company that has similar rules on working for the competition (though it's 6 months instead of 10 years) I can understand the reasoning behind it
Off-topic: I've just had the realisation that it'd be cheaper for me to go to the MoW than it is to live where I do in Australia...
Aus: Rent alone = AUD$780 (~630 Euros) per month + all other expenses
MoW: ~AUD$740 (600 Euros) per month incl all other expenses
I have 7 weeks of leave saved up... Maybe I'll go for a 2 month stint lol
|
On September 13 2012 10:16 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:15 LgNkarmy wrote:On September 13 2012 10:13 Shikyo wrote:
Many people missing the point....
The main issue is them not letting him consult his lawyer about the contract(and not paying back immediately). Everything else, like the things with the house, are secondary. They did let him, But he didn't get the proper verification from his lawyer. So you don't think the deadline was too harsh? Do you know what kind of verification they needed and how much time he had to get it and if it was reasonable to get it in that time?
I think it's obvious they had problems with Fuzer before this. MoW even said that he was being "childish" so it seems like they are just trying to cover their asses. Why give such a short ultimatum (according to Fuzer). Why didn't they just look up his name in the registry, or in the bar association? Seemed like a delay tactic to me but they eventually got fed up with the entire situation.
|
On September 13 2012 10:19 LgNkarmy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:16 scares wrote:
Karmy are you allowed to answer, if the NDA stops a Pro from taking 5 teammates and coaching them in a house paid by the Team/sponsors? It doesn't stop you from that, It stops you from creating, or help create a company with knowledge that was exclusive from MoW. Say they have a very unique, unused practice regime that NO other team has started using, And when you join onto a new team house they to start up the exact same regime it would be suspicious. As stated before the NDA wouldn't hold up it court, But it was to scare players into not spilling the secrets.
Irrelevant, but with the slew of teams and history of houses in other games as well, how is it verifiable that any house has anything like a unique, unused practice regime?
|
Papua New Guinea1059 Posts
On September 13 2012 10:18 Leijona wrote:
I wonder what the sponsors would think if you e-mail'd them about all this shady stuff with this guy being an old scammer and them not allowing Fuzer's lawyer to view the contract xD. Thats ridiculous.
No point in emailing them anyway. They don't have sponsors per-se, only partners that provided them with some equipment.
|
On September 13 2012 10:15 LgNkarmy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:13 Shikyo wrote:
Many people missing the point....
The main issue is them not letting him consult his lawyer about the contract(and not paying back immediately). Everything else, like the things with the house, are secondary. They did let him, But he didn't get the proper verification from his lawyer.
Since you seem to be an expert at ignoring me, I'll try again. Verifying a lawyer (or any kind of legal counsel) is in no way shape or form standard practice. Actually it might be flat out illegal (depending on Fuzers age and his English skills, considering that he SAID that he doesn't feel comfortable signing an english contact before talking to his lawyer you CANNOT sign a binding contract with him until he has that advice or YOU get the contract translated into his mother tongue).
If you have doubts about the validity of someones credentials (VERY uncommon, usually a stalling tactic) you look him up in the register, instead of asking him to provide some kind of documentation (which could easily be faked, would you know how a finnish certificate is supposed to look like?).
To sum it up, their behaviour was unprofessional at best (and fairly idiotic, you don't just let someone move in without clearing up those details). Their behaviour after this mess started was flat out illegal at best (the skype log).
|
Hi, i'm the only player currently in the house that lived here since the beginning of this project and i experienced every ups and downs of this house
I think there is a lot of missunderstanding and jumping to conclusions too fast
The idea of the house is awesome and it is the only place in europe where this gathering of eager, passionate and mostly very high skilled players that want to work together and improve as much as possible together
This house isn't perfect, there were quite some issues at the very beginning, but the management and the players work hand in hand and we try to make this house as good as possible. At this moment the house runs very smooth, there are still things we can improve on of course, but we try to sort everything out step by step.
One of the problems in the very beginning was the lack of communication between management and players, but we had a long meeting about that and we talked about how important the exchange of information between management and players is. The house still did a poor job communicating with the community tho, many people don't have information about most of the things, which were going in the house. But they already started to improve on this and the players will help too.
That's why i will do a live Q&A on my stream tomorrow (13th 22:00 CET): http://twitch.tv/ministryofwin_wilko
I will answer your questions to clarify things up as much as possible, i can't speak about things that are under NDA tho (which is actually very little) and things that would be to personal
Thanks
|
On September 13 2012 10:21 MountainDewJunkie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:19 LgNkarmy wrote:On September 13 2012 10:16 scares wrote:
Karmy are you allowed to answer, if the NDA stops a Pro from taking 5 teammates and coaching them in a house paid by the Team/sponsors? It doesn't stop you from that, It stops you from creating, or help create a company with knowledge that was exclusive from MoW. Say they have a very unique, unused practice regime that NO other team has started using, And when you join onto a new team house they to start up the exact same regime it would be suspicious. As stated before the NDA wouldn't hold up it court, But it was to scare players into not spilling the secrets. Irrelevant, but with the slew of teams and history of houses in other games as well, how is it verifiable that any house has anything like a unique, unused practice regime?
It doesn't. That's the problem, The NDA wouldn't hold up in court because proving something like that is impossible. They did it to scare players with a huge penalty fine behind it. I still choose to follow the NDA because I'm not out to screw anyone.
|
On September 13 2012 10:21 Wilko wrote:Hi, i'm the only player currently in the house that lived here since the beginning of this project and i experienced every ups and downs of this house I think there is a lot of missunderstanding and jumping to conclusions too fast The idea of the house is awesome and it is the only place in europe where this gathering of eager, passionate and mostly very high skilled players that want to work together and improve as much as possible together This house isn't perfect, there were quite some issues at the very beginning, but the management and the players work hand in hand and we try to make this house as good as possible. At this moment the house runs very smooth, there are still things we can improve on of course, but we try to sort everything out step by step. One of the problems in the very beginning was the lack of communication between management and players, but we had a long meeting about that and we talked about how important the exchange of information between management and players is. They house still did a poor job communicating with the community tho, many people don't have information about most of the things, which were going in the house. But they already started to improve on this and the players will help too. That's why i will do a live Q&A on my stream tomorrow (13th 22:00 CET): http://de.twitch.tv/ministryofwin_wilkoI will answer your questions to clarify things up as much as possible, i can't speak about things that are under NDA tho (which is actually very little) and things that would be to personal Thanks
Oh Hi Wilko =]
|
The way I get all this is Ministry of Win doesn't have completely worked out routines regarding everything, but is working things out as they go. Being as they deal mostly with young, inexperienced men, I can understand if they don't approach every situation as it were a strict business deal between two large companies. Dealing with young people like this probably require more leeway to be given. This probably works well in most situations, but every now and then this approach is bound to run into some difficulties. From what I have seen from and about Fuzer here it seems it is not a coincidence this situation has risen with him and not anyone else staying in the MoW.
I am not saying MoW has done nothing wrong here, mistakes have clearly been made and I would be surprised if they would not be stricter with the contract requirement in the future. But I do think it is more in Fuzers interest to have a proper contract before paying than it is in MoWs.
After reading several positive, but balanced, posts from other residents, it is hard to take Fuzers other complaints as little more than bitter aftertaste. And even if there is some truths to them, it is very much a thing between the residents and MoW, especially regarding the streaming.
There isn't much to discuss here really.
|
On September 13 2012 10:15 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 09:53 ragz_gt wrote:On September 13 2012 09:50 FabledIntegral wrote:On September 13 2012 09:43 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:37 Noispaxen wrote:On September 13 2012 09:19 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:15 Noispaxen wrote:On September 13 2012 09:07 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:03 Noispaxen wrote:On September 13 2012 09:01 Leijona wrote:
[quote]
Lol, just stop with the ridiculous 8hours a day streaming thing. Thats funny Did you even read what he wrote? Do you know how annoying it must be to stream for 8 hours straight? I mean, we're not just talking about taking a short break. You're not making any revenue when you take a break from streaming, so streaming 8 hours straight is basically just taking short breaks to eat maybe a small bag of pretzels or something, going to the bathroom, getting a glass of water. 5 hours a day is a bit unreasonable for streaming, especially when you consider the fact that most people don't want to stream every single day. Even if you only take 2 days off, you're still going to have to make up 10 hours over 5 days (7 hours a day!). TLO, the #1 streamer in terms of hours, only had 142.5 hours. It's a ridiculous thing for MoW to want their players to do, and if they're charging that much for them to go there in the first place, they should have just included that amount (or some of it) in the contract instead of forcing them to stream that much. You don't get it, do you? If they stream 8hours of day, it means they have 11days a month to not stream at all! And frankly, when all you do is playing Starcraft all day long, its not troublesome at all. I have streamed myself around 8hours in 1day a few times and it wasn't annoying at all, despite doing it with 20-40viewers avg. I'm sure if I actually had a reasonable number of viewers (like ~100 and more) I would love to do that. And try to understand the fact, that people like Fuzer would never get any money at all from Twitch, cause they would never get a partnership without MoW, so in fact he still was getting more money than the $0 he would normally get. Lol, the whole point is to get better. 1.) People do not get better when they stream their practice. Numerous pro players have said that streaming their practice games hinders their play and does not help them in any way. 2.) 8 hours straight 3 or 4 days in a row? Do you realize how tiring that is? You can stream that maybe one or two times a week, but doing that every week? Even the highest amount of streamers have to take breaks and can't do that. TLO had 142.5 hours, a ridiculous amount and had to take long breaks during his streaming. 3.) If they really want money from their streaming, fine whatever. Why not just include that cost in the contract and allow them to take whatever money they make from streaming? It's not really fair to tell them after the fact that they have to stream 5 hours a day (at least) and then tell them they don't even get to keep all of the money. If you're not even getting adequate amounts of food, why should you be giving them ADDITIONAL money to WORK? You clearly have no idea what you are writing about. 1.) Yes, I can agree with you about this point, it's probably not good to stream your practice, strategies etc. for the competitive reasons, however, that pretty much applies for the real top pros, inventing new strategies etc. 2.) It's not tiring at all... Streaming doesn't equal having a webcam and microphone on and talking 24/7 while playing. All you have to do is having x-split on in the background while you play, if you don't feel like it you don't have to talk, you don't even need to check the chat. Also, they know about it before coming, they aren't getting told after the fact that they don't keep all the money. Please, don't even mention the food because it's just silly point. Fuzer saying they get only 1hot meal a day is just hard to consider serious. Yes, believe it or not, but in Poland we have breakfast, which is usually sandwiches/fruits/cereals, dinner which is the biggest meal of the day and is hot, and then supper which is usually sandwiches again (altough of course you can have some hot stuff like sausages, eggs and what not). 3.) Please, realise that if not for MoW, Fuzer would get literally ZERO money whatsoever from streaming! Check the requirements Twitch.tv actually has before they can give you partnership and share the ad revenue with you. The truth is Fuzer would pretty much never get it and he should be glad that MoW with their partnership actually gives him the opportunity to get some money from it. LOL Ok so you agree with #1, your argument for #2 is that it's "not tiring at all," yet you keep ignoring my point. You can't take a break if you're streaming without losing revenue (no one to run ads), you can't really take a break to go get a meal, and you can't really go to the bathroom without losing revenue. That is indeed tiring. You also can't really just go workout (something ideal to playing and practicing well) if you're streaming. #3, I already acknowledged this, but if he's going to be making money from the streaming, why the fuck would they not just include it in his contract to begin with (maybe 50 euros more) and then just tell him keep the money from streaming. Instead, they're making him stream a shit ton and he basically gets no money from it. Wtf. That's just screwed up and not fair to Fuzer. Also, your whole claim that in Poland you have breakfast is absolute bs. In America, it's common not to eat breakfast for many people. Does that mean everyone doesn't eat breakfast? Karmy already said that the meals was an issue at MoW, so why are you arguing that they weren't? Your entire post just shows how you are blindly defending MoW for stuff that is absolutely unacceptable by today's standards. I don't understand your second point. Then you just lose revenue if you don't run the ads. Whatever. How is that an issue, compared to if you weren't making any revenue regardless if you weren't streaming in the first place? Go to the fucking bathroom and take a "revenue hit" that you suspect would happen.... who cares.... Streaming itself is not an issue. But why would stream be mandatory for people who pays to get better, when streaming have not shown to actually help people getting better? It people want stream, then they can stream, if people practice better not streaming, it should be their choice since they paid to stay there to get better. Because it's part of the damn contract? Honestly...
Exactly, that's WHY he is asking his lawyer to check out the contract.
And Fuzer claim they didn't tell him BEFORE he got there, which MoW or anyone else have not refuted.
|
On September 13 2012 10:23 ragz_gt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:15 FabledIntegral wrote:On September 13 2012 09:53 ragz_gt wrote:On September 13 2012 09:50 FabledIntegral wrote:On September 13 2012 09:43 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:37 Noispaxen wrote:On September 13 2012 09:19 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:15 Noispaxen wrote:On September 13 2012 09:07 MtlGuitarist97 wrote:On September 13 2012 09:03 Noispaxen wrote:
[quote]
Did you even read what he wrote? Do you know how annoying it must be to stream for 8 hours straight? I mean, we're not just talking about taking a short break. You're not making any revenue when you take a break from streaming, so streaming 8 hours straight is basically just taking short breaks to eat maybe a small bag of pretzels or something, going to the bathroom, getting a glass of water. 5 hours a day is a bit unreasonable for streaming, especially when you consider the fact that most people don't want to stream every single day. Even if you only take 2 days off, you're still going to have to make up 10 hours over 5 days (7 hours a day!). TLO, the #1 streamer in terms of hours, only had 142.5 hours. It's a ridiculous thing for MoW to want their players to do, and if they're charging that much for them to go there in the first place, they should have just included that amount (or some of it) in the contract instead of forcing them to stream that much. You don't get it, do you? If they stream 8hours of day, it means they have 11days a month to not stream at all! And frankly, when all you do is playing Starcraft all day long, its not troublesome at all. I have streamed myself around 8hours in 1day a few times and it wasn't annoying at all, despite doing it with 20-40viewers avg. I'm sure if I actually had a reasonable number of viewers (like ~100 and more) I would love to do that. And try to understand the fact, that people like Fuzer would never get any money at all from Twitch, cause they would never get a partnership without MoW, so in fact he still was getting more money than the $0 he would normally get. Lol, the whole point is to get better. 1.) People do not get better when they stream their practice. Numerous pro players have said that streaming their practice games hinders their play and does not help them in any way. 2.) 8 hours straight 3 or 4 days in a row? Do you realize how tiring that is? You can stream that maybe one or two times a week, but doing that every week? Even the highest amount of streamers have to take breaks and can't do that. TLO had 142.5 hours, a ridiculous amount and had to take long breaks during his streaming. 3.) If they really want money from their streaming, fine whatever. Why not just include that cost in the contract and allow them to take whatever money they make from streaming? It's not really fair to tell them after the fact that they have to stream 5 hours a day (at least) and then tell them they don't even get to keep all of the money. If you're not even getting adequate amounts of food, why should you be giving them ADDITIONAL money to WORK? You clearly have no idea what you are writing about. 1.) Yes, I can agree with you about this point, it's probably not good to stream your practice, strategies etc. for the competitive reasons, however, that pretty much applies for the real top pros, inventing new strategies etc. 2.) It's not tiring at all... Streaming doesn't equal having a webcam and microphone on and talking 24/7 while playing. All you have to do is having x-split on in the background while you play, if you don't feel like it you don't have to talk, you don't even need to check the chat. Also, they know about it before coming, they aren't getting told after the fact that they don't keep all the money. Please, don't even mention the food because it's just silly point. Fuzer saying they get only 1hot meal a day is just hard to consider serious. Yes, believe it or not, but in Poland we have breakfast, which is usually sandwiches/fruits/cereals, dinner which is the biggest meal of the day and is hot, and then supper which is usually sandwiches again (altough of course you can have some hot stuff like sausages, eggs and what not). 3.) Please, realise that if not for MoW, Fuzer would get literally ZERO money whatsoever from streaming! Check the requirements Twitch.tv actually has before they can give you partnership and share the ad revenue with you. The truth is Fuzer would pretty much never get it and he should be glad that MoW with their partnership actually gives him the opportunity to get some money from it. LOL Ok so you agree with #1, your argument for #2 is that it's "not tiring at all," yet you keep ignoring my point. You can't take a break if you're streaming without losing revenue (no one to run ads), you can't really take a break to go get a meal, and you can't really go to the bathroom without losing revenue. That is indeed tiring. You also can't really just go workout (something ideal to playing and practicing well) if you're streaming. #3, I already acknowledged this, but if he's going to be making money from the streaming, why the fuck would they not just include it in his contract to begin with (maybe 50 euros more) and then just tell him keep the money from streaming. Instead, they're making him stream a shit ton and he basically gets no money from it. Wtf. That's just screwed up and not fair to Fuzer. Also, your whole claim that in Poland you have breakfast is absolute bs. In America, it's common not to eat breakfast for many people. Does that mean everyone doesn't eat breakfast? Karmy already said that the meals was an issue at MoW, so why are you arguing that they weren't? Your entire post just shows how you are blindly defending MoW for stuff that is absolutely unacceptable by today's standards. I don't understand your second point. Then you just lose revenue if you don't run the ads. Whatever. How is that an issue, compared to if you weren't making any revenue regardless if you weren't streaming in the first place? Go to the fucking bathroom and take a "revenue hit" that you suspect would happen.... who cares.... Streaming itself is not an issue. But why would stream be mandatory for people who pays to get better, when streaming have not shown to actually help people getting better? It people want stream, then they can stream, if people practice better not streaming, it should be their choice since they paid to stay there to get better. Because it's part of the damn contract? Honestly... Exactly, that's WHY he is asking his lawyer to check out the contract. And Fuzer claim they didn't tell him BEFORE he got there, which MoW or anyone else have not refuted.
This is true, When I arrived to MoW there were a few things that I didn't know were happening, I take responsibility not getting my contract before moving but at the same time, There were a few things that popped up when we got there that weren't agreed apon before moving. They were changed in the contract when we discussed it, but at the time it wasn't known before I moved in.
|
On September 13 2012 10:21 Tula wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:15 LgNkarmy wrote:On September 13 2012 10:13 Shikyo wrote:
Many people missing the point....
The main issue is them not letting him consult his lawyer about the contract(and not paying back immediately). Everything else, like the things with the house, are secondary. They did let him, But he didn't get the proper verification from his lawyer. Since you seem to be an expert at ignoring me, I'll try again. Verifying a lawyer (or any kind of legal counsel) is in no way shape or form standard practice. Actually it might be flat out illegal (depending on Fuzers age and his English skills, considering that he SAID that he doesn't feel comfortable signing an english contact before talking to his lawyer you CANNOT sign a binding contract with him until he has that advice or YOU get the contract translated into his mother tongue). If you have doubts about the validity of someones credentials (VERY uncommon, usually a stalling tactic) you look him up in the register, instead of asking him to provide some kind of documentation (which could easily be faked, would you know how a finnish certificate is supposed to look like?). To sum it up, their behaviour was unprofessional at best (and fairly idiotic, you don't just let someone move in without clearing up those details). Their behaviour after this mess started was flat out illegal at best (the skype log).
This is one of the few good posts in the thread. If you want someone to sign a contract, there are laws that you have to abide by.
|
On September 13 2012 10:19 LgNkarmy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 13 2012 10:16 scares wrote:
Karmy are you allowed to answer, if the NDA stops a Pro from taking 5 teammates and coaching them in a house paid by the Team/sponsors? It doesn't stop you from that, It stops you from creating, or help create a company with knowledge that was exclusive from MoW. Say they have a very unique, unused practice regime that NO other team has started using, And when you join onto a new team house they to start up the exact same regime it would be suspicious. As stated before the NDA wouldn't hold up it court, But it was to scare players into not spilling the secrets.
This needs to be put out very publicly i believe especially considering what many small things have been leaked from the practice regime (5 hours customs in mroning f.e. , I believe it was said that the old OGS house had a morning tournament, i consider this similar so one could argue stolen from OGS  ) It would have little to no effect in creating a TEAM house !!!!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
