EPTWhat is key to being a Good Caster - Page 8
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Dontkillme
Korea (South)806 Posts
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Vague
170 Posts
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MetalPanda
Canada1152 Posts
On September 04 2012 00:37 Dontkillme wrote: I seriously don't like threads like this. It feels like we are judging these casters while we get free commentary. No wonder tasteless doesn't come on TL. Too judgmental. The community seriously needs to stop being so judgmental about the casters who were hired by people smarter than us and need to let these casters breathe Dontkillme, you're killing e-Sports. Everything is so new in it and needs constructive criticism. | ||
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TBone-
United States2309 Posts
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Mavvie
Canada923 Posts
Husky's lack of game knowledge pisses me off sometimes. For the last like 100 ZvP's he gets surprised and worked up about "Zerg taking a super fast third!" This has been the metagame for months, yet he still gets worked up about it lol. I much prefer day9's casting. I play Zerg, but after watching him cast a TvZ I feel like I've learned more and could even try out Terran! | ||
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wcr.4fun
Belgium686 Posts
I hate play by play casters, I can see whats happening on the screen myself perfectly fine, thank you. I have eyes. I want to hear strategy and in depth knowledge. Explanations of why pro's are doing things, opinions on what they're doing (I actually like that, if it's not biased). I like humour a lot too, it doesn't even have to be totally 100 percent related to starcraft either. On September 04 2012 00:41 Vague wrote: You shouldn't put Artosis and Tastless in the same category. Tastless is a good sidekick, but he almost never contributes in substantial ways to the casting, Artosis is the guy who has both understanding of the game and is up to speed (at least in comparison to the other casters). can't blame tasteless. He lost his passion because sc2 just isn't as interesting as bw.. | ||
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OptronX
United States84 Posts
I do feel like knowledge is import, but I'd much rather have a caster who sounds like he loves the game; get excited when a big engagement happens, sounds disappointed when one of the player lost a big fight, etc. That's what I love. | ||
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mememolly
4765 Posts
progamers make the best casters, idra and Grubby for example, could listen to those dudes all day, I'm not interested in the entertainment aspect of casting, if I wanted to hear some comedy I could go watch a Bill Hicks dvd, I know you have to make it entertaining or whatever but I find learning about the game and gaining insight entertaining, but maybe I'm in the minority. I love when a progamer streams his own analysis of a tourney, more progamers should do this imo. It seems like there is a growing culture of fame hungry casters and that it's easier to "make it" as a personality and a caster now than it is to be good at the game and that people are choosing this route over playing and why shouldn't they if the money and over avenues it opens up are more beneficial and vast than being a progamer, there were more casters at a recent MLG than a players, and it's always kind of sad when tourneys make a huge deal out of who is casting but not about the players. Also, Good observer and a progamer casting from his bedroom > 10 big name youtube celebrity king of the web casters and a bad obs there are good hype casters out there, like DJjWheat but there are too many who live off the play by play tag when in reality they are just plain bad at casting | ||
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Goldfish
2230 Posts
Also here's Moletrap and Klazart casting that infamous MSL Flash vs Jaedong Finals: (Also Moletrap's thought on Jaedong given the win at around 24 minutes and 30 seconds. Basically he understands and makes the point it would have been unfair to Jaedong too if they did a rematch [in any case, it's a lose lose all around as it's hard to make the right calls].) As you can see in the video (they start talking about the game instead of the players a minute in), Moletrap is much better in BW than in SC2 (especially with co casting). Moletrap was good in BW. He knew all the players, he knew most of the strategies, he basically knew most of the stuff needed to cast BW. It's not what Moletrap lacks but what he lost from BW to SC2. I hope people realize this and becomes a bit more supportive of him in SC2. He was much better in BW than in SC2. Moletrap was one of the most beloved casters in BW (in fact, there's a reason there's an SC2 map named after him >.>). There were haters (but there are haters for everyone, even Tasteless and Artosis has the occasional hater) but there were really the minority. Anyway, as you can see in the video, Moletrap was great in BW and great at cocasting. Also, he definitely took in feedback as well. | ||
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NOOBALOPSE
Canada802 Posts
On September 03 2012 17:13 Liquid`Ret wrote: I have been watching starcraft and starcraft 2 for an extremely long time and I almost feel like the casting is getting worse and worse across the board. There are a few exceptions like Apollo, Rotterdam/MrBitter, Artosis (although he was much better a year ago) but with the other ones you can tell they almost never play the game anymore or never have played to begin with. Starcraft is a beautiful game. There is a very large group of players who have great mechanics and practice a lot, so their builds are very polished and they can all beat each other on any given day. Still some players do better than others, there is a huge mental aspect to the game and slight changes in builds or playstyles that can make all the difference and this is what makes starcraft matches so fun to watch. . Unfortunately, most casters are not very good at all at recognizing patterns or changes in the metagame, or builds. Infact there are so many occasions where casters who are newbies at the game, judge players and berate them for their mistakes, while they actually don't have a clue what is going on. Of course mistakes are much easier to point out than those little things players change in their play or the mind games that are going on at the top level. But these are the things that make starcraft a brilliant game to watch and follow. I feel like if we had professional casters who actually put the time and effort into delivering the best performance possible, the audience would come much closer to be able to experience starcraft in the same way that progamers experience it. With all the little nuances, mind games, and reasons why someone is doing what they're doing being analyzed and clearly explained. When I listen to a cast and would be unable to see the screen, I would feel like sc2 is a random slugfest with 2 guys just throwing units at each other. Every game feels the same, and one guy wins at the end. This actually makes Starcraft much less appealing to new people or people who are actually looking for depth, not cheap entertainment. Of course this is exaggerated, but it's still sad to me that there is so little actual skill and knowledge amongst casters. I really hope that eventually (sooner the better) we can go to a model where there is one person doing play by plays and coloring the cast, and one progamer or ex-progamer (who still keeps up his skill and knowledge of all the recent trends) doing analytical casting. We saw some of this when Grubby was casting with apollo/kalearis and TLO/apollo at assembly (and these guys have barely practiced casting). The current casters are actually not helping Starcraft 2 grow in my opinion, they just live off their initial fame and because of how e-sports works twitter followers and popularity is more important than quality, substance. I believe Starcraft 2 is a good enough game to keep people interested, as long as the skill on the screen is translated and well delivered to the audience. p.s sorry kinda off-topic, but felt like writing my opinion Best post in the entire thread. On-topic: I also feel that Wolf doesn't really have a passion for StarCrafr, or at least he doesn't voice it. | ||
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stew_
Canada239 Posts
Most of the casters I watch seem like they do not even play. | ||
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KingLumps
74 Posts
Also I hate husky and every other caster that start shouting and yelling when a battle happens, for gods sakes we wanna pay attention to the battle and how they control not how close you get to peeing your pants out of excitement from 5 lings vs 2 marines... Another thing I'd like to say is that casters are really only helpful for lower players, better players can understand the decisions of a pro when watching a game 9/10 (save gsl cuz that shit is always fresh and intense.) at least to the degree that the caster understand pro decisions. | ||
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Oreo7
United States1647 Posts
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ProxyTerran
44 Posts
A perfect caster would be Artosis with TB-Voice. Or better a Duo like Artosis + TB (or Husky) | ||
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Forikorder
Canada8840 Posts
they need to be able to fill dead time in a way taht doesnt seem like there ranting but is entertaining but not so entertaining that it takes away from the game and they cant fill time in such a way that they have to keep talking after action starts up again they have to sell themselves in a way that it doesnt actually seem like there selling themselves they need to be respectful to both players and highlight why someone win not why someone lost but still have the balls to call big mistakes thats what i think you need to do to be the perfect caster | ||
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Sylverin
United States480 Posts
On September 03 2012 17:13 Liquid`Ret wrote: I have been watching starcraft and starcraft 2 for an extremely long time and I almost feel like the casting is getting worse and worse across the board. There are a few exceptions like Apollo, Rotterdam/MrBitter, Artosis (although he was much better a year ago) but with the other ones you can tell they almost never play the game anymore or never have played to begin with. Starcraft is a beautiful game. There is a very large group of players who have great mechanics and practice a lot, so their builds are very polished and they can all beat each other on any given day. Still some players do better than others, there is a huge mental aspect to the game and slight changes in builds or playstyles that can make all the difference and this is what makes starcraft matches so fun to watch. . Unfortunately, most casters are not very good at all at recognizing patterns or changes in the metagame, or builds. Infact there are so many occasions where casters who are newbies at the game, judge players and berate them for their mistakes, while they actually don't have a clue what is going on. Of course mistakes are much easier to point out than those little things players change in their play or the mind games that are going on at the top level. But these are the things that make starcraft a brilliant game to watch and follow. I feel like if we had professional casters who actually put the time and effort into delivering the best performance possible, the audience would come much closer to be able to experience starcraft in the same way that progamers experience it. With all the little nuances, mind games, and reasons why someone is doing what they're doing being analyzed and clearly explained. When I listen to a cast and would be unable to see the screen, I would feel like sc2 is a random slugfest with 2 guys just throwing units at each other. Every game feels the same, and one guy wins at the end. This actually makes Starcraft much less appealing to new people or people who are actually looking for depth, not cheap entertainment. Of course this is exaggerated, but it's still sad to me that there is so little actual skill and knowledge amongst casters. I really hope that eventually (sooner the better) we can go to a model where there is one person doing play by plays and coloring the cast, and one progamer or ex-progamer (who still keeps up his skill and knowledge of all the recent trends) doing analytical casting. We saw some of this when Grubby was casting with apollo/kalearis and TLO/apollo at assembly (and these guys have barely practiced casting). The current casters are actually not helping Starcraft 2 grow in my opinion, they just live off their initial fame and because of how e-sports works twitter followers and popularity is more important than quality, substance. I believe Starcraft 2 is a good enough game to keep people interested, as long as the skill on the screen is translated and well delivered to the audience. p.s sorry kinda off-topic, but felt like writing my opinion Slam dunked, QFT. | ||
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Disarm22
United States151 Posts
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InsaniaK
Sweden120 Posts
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Warpath
Canada1242 Posts
If I'm watching a big tournament and i want everything, I'll look for Apollo or Tastosis. If I want to sit back and have some fun watching some games I hit up SamSC2 (which is great, he has genuine enthusiasm without resorting to the yelling) From an analysis standpoint, Ret's post made me realize that, yeah, the casters rarely attempt to read into the mind of the players and explain what he is trying to do, beyond super basic strategy. After a tournament game is over and the player gets interviewed, if he gets asked 'why' for certain scenarios the answer is not 'i wanted to kill his third' its something more in-depth like 'if i attacked his third, he would have to react in this way so i was preparing for that to win the game.' (as an over-simplified example) It does make me miss the live translations we used to watch by in BW, we would get this often from casters. I was extremely happy in the TSL4 when (i cant remember the players tt) a player blocked the natural expo from the zerg on metropolis, the zerg took the third base location and added gas Apollo, well in advance predicted a nydus attack, to see the nydus go down after, the zerg player knew it, the caster knew it, and the audience knew it. (it was a shame that the casters didnt see the nydus get scouted) I cant wait till we see more forward knowledge like this. | ||
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itsMAHVELbaybee
292 Posts
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