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As emotionally invested as people are on this topic, TL rules still apply. That includes flaming and ad hominem attacks. |
On August 31 2012 08:29 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:28 Leth0 wrote:On August 31 2012 08:21 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:16 Leth0 wrote:On August 31 2012 08:13 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:10 Kaguro wrote:On August 31 2012 08:04 Conti wrote:On August 31 2012 07:55 Kranzor wrote:On August 31 2012 07:48 Conti wrote:On August 31 2012 07:18 Leth0 wrote:
[quote]
Let's try and clarify this then.
Situation A.
Share some nudes with a girl. You could care a less about her , or her feelings so you show the pics to your friends and laugh about how ugly you think she is like the immature jackass you are.
-Yea I'm sure this happens a lot, because their are a lot stupid shits out there who are more worried about some type of boasting then showing any amount of respect to another person.
Situation B
Share some nudes with a girl. You care about her and her feelings, You would never betray her trust by doing something like showing her naked body to your friends for whatever reason.
-Yea not a lot of people like this around.
So you're right. I'm sure it does happen a lot. What makes this more amusing is that the dipshit from situation A screws himself over when his "private" conversation becomes not so private.
"Oh you don't understand, I was being an immature prick behind closed doors" Nice, but nobody cares. You show zero respect for someone and take it farther by actually taking the time out to ridicule them. Then you act surprised when that shit comes back to bite you in the ass? Come on. What kind of stupid prick puts himself in that situation then tries to claim the moral highground, like he should be put on some pedestal.
Respect isn't just a "some of the time" kind of thing. It's not like makeup you put on before going out for the night, or something you try to do when your at MLG. It's just common fucking decent respect for people. This is such an obvious lesson to be taken away from this, but I severely doubt a person as narcissistic as Destiny will ever learn that lesson, no matter how hard it slaps him in the face. This. And to all those dudes that openly admit to having done the same thing as Destiny: Grow the fuck up. Seriously. If you put me in Situation A right now meaning I got a nude pic from someone I pretty much dont care about and my friends do not know that person I will show them that picture most certainly and have no moral regrets. Shame on me I guess, but I'm pretty sure most people would do exacly the same. And even most of the moralfags would probably do it if they are in that situation. If they know her and she might get in trouble for that it might be another story. Then, just like Destiny, you deserve all the possible negative consequences you might earn from your actions. Also.. "moralfags"? I don't even.. He probably is 15~17 and browses 4chan therefore "fag" is a part of every word now... I hate that particular word, but the people it is meant to denote, yeah they're pious idiots half of the time. Then just exactly what is a "Moralfag"? I would imagine it is a pejorative term for people who go on the likes of reddit and demand action over someone for their perceived moral failings, often (in my view) out of proportion with the original offence. In essence a proportion of the people who mailed sponsors in this case, off whatever that subreddit was. They don't actually care, they just want to be seen to be a good person and bask in the reflected glory of their 'activism' Ah ok, so "moralfag" is the technical definition for one of the people who emailed ROOT sponsors then. Pretty specific definition there. It's a fucking example, use your brain it's pretty clear exactly what I'm referring to here.
No it's not really. You see here's what I imagine it is.
Some stupid word a really angry kid comes up with to vent frustration.
Pretty simple I know, but I think I nailed it.
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On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment.
Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants.
Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired.
The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all.
These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened. But controversies and debates still lingers
In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues.
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On August 31 2012 08:29 ch33psh33p wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:27 Redox wrote:On August 31 2012 08:19 TurtPonySwag wrote:
Anyone who says that Destiny is a bad person for doing what he did and that they would have never done anything like that needs to find the nearest bridge and jump. So, if I decline to sleep with 15 year old girls and brag about it afterwards I have to jump from a bridge? Just strange what kind of opinions can be found here. Hey look, taking a quote of context and then using logical fallacies to put words in his mouth. You really think you're taking the high road here?
What? I literally think that Destiny is a immoral person because of that. And I dont think it is normal to behave like that nor do I behave myself like that.I think I am being absolutely straight forward here.
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:31 Leth0 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:29 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:28 Leth0 wrote:On August 31 2012 08:21 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:16 Leth0 wrote:On August 31 2012 08:13 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:10 Kaguro wrote:On August 31 2012 08:04 Conti wrote:On August 31 2012 07:55 Kranzor wrote:On August 31 2012 07:48 Conti wrote:
[quote]
This.
And to all those dudes that openly admit to having done the same thing as Destiny: Grow the fuck up. Seriously. If you put me in Situation A right now meaning I got a nude pic from someone I pretty much dont care about and my friends do not know that person I will show them that picture most certainly and have no moral regrets. Shame on me I guess, but I'm pretty sure most people would do exacly the same. And even most of the moralfags would probably do it if they are in that situation. If they know her and she might get in trouble for that it might be another story. Then, just like Destiny, you deserve all the possible negative consequences you might earn from your actions. Also.. "moralfags"? I don't even.. He probably is 15~17 and browses 4chan therefore "fag" is a part of every word now... I hate that particular word, but the people it is meant to denote, yeah they're pious idiots half of the time. Then just exactly what is a "Moralfag"? I would imagine it is a pejorative term for people who go on the likes of reddit and demand action over someone for their perceived moral failings, often (in my view) out of proportion with the original offence. In essence a proportion of the people who mailed sponsors in this case, off whatever that subreddit was. They don't actually care, they just want to be seen to be a good person and bask in the reflected glory of their 'activism' Ah ok, so "moralfag" is the technical definition for one of the people who emailed ROOT sponsors then. Pretty specific definition there. It's a fucking example, use your brain it's pretty clear exactly what I'm referring to here. No it's not really. You see here's what I imagine it is. Some stupid word a really angry kid comes up with to vent frustration. Pretty simple I know, but I think I nailed it.
Ah well, thought I made it pretty clear. I don't like the 'term' and the suffix 'fag' being added for no apparent reason, but the kind of people it describes are to me quite objectionable folks. The worst kind of internet 'activists'. But agree to disagree I guess
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I'm kind of amazed at how many people think sharing nude pictures isn't that big a deal. Of course her response wasn't a whole lot better, but her reaction isn't all that relevant in how this reflects on Destiny, which is pretty poorly. You don't exactly need to be part of some moral elite to have the discretion to not go around doing ridiculously insensitive things.
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On August 31 2012 08:33 iky43210 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment. Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants. Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired. The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all. These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened at all. In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues.
If there had been a chat log of Kim Kardashian published with the same content as Destiny's, she would probably be done for. A sex tape doesnt hurt anyone. The posting of the penis alone would have not been that bad either. it is the chat log that broke the camels back.
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687 Posts
Sad day. Another win for the whiney fans that think they have the right to controll players
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On August 31 2012 08:12 Radin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:01 GiftPflanZe wrote:On August 31 2012 07:55 Radin wrote:
What Destiny and his friends talk about and do in private is their own damn business. It's unfortunate that many of you are ready to lynch him about sharing a nude picture with his friends. Get off your high horses - I'm certain there are things you do in private that people would look down on you for as well.
Bottom line is that this chick was incredibly out of line hacking his twitter and posting a picture of his dick to ~37k people. That's beyond unforgivable. Thats beyond unforgivable?I fully support the move from the girl,deserves him right. Well, that tells me a lot about your maturity. Supporting someone who goes all-out with vigilante revenge makes you no better than that person. Someone who is actually mature would have pursued another means of addressing this situation, without completely sabotaging him. For example, a letter to the community voicing her displeasure would have been a much better approach than HACKING his private twitter and impersonating him. I'm not saying what Destiny did was "right" or "good," in fact I think it was very stupid. However you feel about it, though, it took place in a private conversation with his friends. It's absolutely none of your business, and you should think twice about judging him for it..
No, this is between her and Destiny. There's no reason at all to involve the community in any way, that's the point.
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:33 iky43210 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment. Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants. Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired. The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all. These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened. But controversies and debates still lingers In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues.
At least one of the sponsors claimed to support Destiny and his stream persona and what it brought to their brand in terms of exposure.
For every Asian Idol, there's a footballer who is caught with a prostitute for next to no censure outside of having to make a faux apology. Probably because the industry is big enough with enough money behind it that they don't have to pursue more stringent actions.
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Destiny deserve what she did to him.
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On August 31 2012 08:24 rd wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:19 Defacer wrote:
I can't believe the amount of people that are still making excuses for Destiny ...
Did the girl respond unfairly? Yup. But guess what ... if your modus operandi includes talking shit and gossiping behind people's backs, actively trolling and antagonizing people, and not talking personal responsibility for your decisions and actions, guess what! sometimes it bites you in the ass.
All you guys that are apologizing for Destiny are the immature ones. Destiny is a big boy now that can do and say whatever he wants. If that includes taking pictures of his dick and shit-talking a girl, so be it.
But why the hell should anyone feel sorry for a guy who lives and dies by acting like a jackass?
So what does any of that have to do with SC2 again?
The best AND worse part of the SC2 community is the passion and support of its fans. I'm sure it's part of the pitch teams make to sponsors.
We aren't just a captive audience. We are engaged.
We're smart, analytical, and supportive ... but also opinionated, analytical and judgemental. We're the type of fans that actually sit up and notice when a team gets a new player, a new team forms ... and when a team gets a new sponsor. We actually celebrate it.
I can't name a corporate sponsor from the Olympics, but I can tell you that EG is sponsored by RaidCall, Kingston HyperX, Jinx Clothing, Monster Energy Drink and Intel without having to google it.
That passion cuts both ways. While we'll prop up a product we believe in, even if it's not ready for primetime (NASL, early MLG) we will also rip into anyone or anything that makes the sport look bad.
Honestly, if players can't handle having a community as active and OCD as ours, maybe they should consider playing a more boring game no one gives two-shits about, or doing a job that doesn't need corporate sponsorship to sustain itself.
It's not fair that players are scrutinized as much as they are, but then again, no one is forcing Destiny to play SC2 for a living. I'm sure he could get a job at McDonald's and no one would care about his personal affairs.
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On August 31 2012 08:37 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:33 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment. Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants. Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired. The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all. These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened. But controversies and debates still lingers In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues. At least one of the sponsors claimed to support Destiny and his stream persona and what it brought to their brand in terms of exposure. For every Asian Idol, there's a footballer who is caught with a prostitute for next to no censure outside of having to make a faux apology. Probably because the industry is big enough with enough money behind it that they don't have to pursue more stringent actions.
the mexico national soccer team got banned for 6 months for partying with prostitutes. The money isn't the case here, but expectations of the sponsors, the league itself, and the people they are marketing to.
So if one sponsors support Destiny, then Destiny can go with them. Now he has no fear of being fired! But don't expect people to think anything less of him
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:38 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:24 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 08:19 Defacer wrote:
I can't believe the amount of people that are still making excuses for Destiny ...
Did the girl respond unfairly? Yup. But guess what ... if your modus operandi includes talking shit and gossiping behind people's backs, actively trolling and antagonizing people, and not talking personal responsibility for your decisions and actions, guess what! sometimes it bites you in the ass.
All you guys that are apologizing for Destiny are the immature ones. Destiny is a big boy now that can do and say whatever he wants. If that includes taking pictures of his dick and shit-talking a girl, so be it.
But why the hell should anyone feel sorry for a guy who lives and dies by acting like a jackass?
So what does any of that have to do with SC2 again? The best AND worse part of the SC2 community is the passion and support of its fans. I'm sure it's part of the pitch teams make to sponsors. We aren't just a captive audience. We are engaged.We're smart, analytical, and supportive ... but also opinionated, analytical and judgemental. We're the type of fans that actually sit up and notice when a team gets a new player, a new team forms ... and when a team gets a new sponsor. We actually celebrate it. I can't name a corporate sponsor from the Olympics, but I can tell you that EG is sponsored by RaidCall, Kingston HyperX, Jinx Clothing and Intel without having to google it. That passion cuts both ways. While we'll prop up a product we believe in, even if it's not ready for primetime (NASL, early MLG) we will also rip into anyone or anything that makes the sport look bad. Honestly, if players can't handle having a community as active and OCD as ours, maybe they should consider playing a more boring game no one gives two-shits about, or doing a job that doesn't need corporate sponsorship to sustain itself. It's not fair that players are scrutinized as much as they are, but then again, no one is forcing Destiny to play SC2 for a living. I'm sure he could get a job at McDonald's and no one would care about his personal affairs.
Yeah you raise an interesting point. That said I feel we're a big part of the problem. It's not having a set of standards that we expect enforced, it's the unequal application of these pretty arbitrary standards to people liked and disliked by the community. Just look at a few of the big dramas we've had, and some we have not had.
Orb - Fired from EG for use of a racist epithet.
Idra - Until recently tolerated by EG despite frequent use of many derogatory terms, has toned that down to his credit.
Destiny - Had his stream removed from the featured list for a while for a racial epithet.
Stephano - Tweeted to HasuObs a jokey comment about 'Having burned any Jews lately?'. Removed Tweet, no further action made by the community.
Until we actually mature to a stage where we have a set of standards that are universally enforced, these 'witchunts' appear to me to be pretty arbitrary in basis and harmful for the community as a whole.
I'm on the 'more censorship = bad' side of the debate, but to be honest I'd be fine with a more moderated scene if this was done consistently instead of on a case-by-case basis based upon who is liked/disliked.
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
Nope, he didn't do anything with tact and got pretty flustered but I'd rather see that than an insincere 'oh I'm so sorry.' Don't really think of it as cyberbullying at all
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On August 31 2012 08:37 Wombat_NI wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:33 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment. Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants. Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired. The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all. These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened. But controversies and debates still lingers In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues. At least one of the sponsors claimed to support Destiny and his stream persona and what it brought to their brand in terms of exposure. For every Asian Idol, there's a footballer who is caught with a prostitute for next to no censure outside of having to make a faux apology. Probably because the industry is big enough with enough money behind it that they don't have to pursue more stringent actions.
Yes, with all of that money, they still have to make a public apology. Compare this with ROOTFayth's responses on this very thread.
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:47 KillingVector wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:37 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 08:33 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:54 Wombat_NI wrote:On August 31 2012 07:53 rd wrote:On August 31 2012 07:44 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 07:23 Ozcollo wrote:On August 31 2012 06:59 iky43210 wrote:On August 31 2012 06:54 Mutation wrote:
Ok, so what has Destiny done to upset the sponsors? well, lets see. 1) A dick pics for the world to see. 2) immature talks and blatant childish act / disrespectful of others privacy 3) overreacting response on public note. It doesn't matter if the conversation was private or public, or that the leak of the fact that he send dicks to random fangirl was not his intention, but the sponsors and team images have been as a result. Fairly good reasons to be pissed about. The whys and hows don't really matter 1) A woman used an email password to reset his skype/twitter/facebook passwords and take control of the accounts. She then uses them to circulate explicit photographs and private conversations. That's borderline stalker behavior and lead to events that were out of his control. 2) I'm sure you've NEVER had private conversations about someone when they weren't present. I'm sure that if you did, you went to them and told them right away. Although I doubt you'll be able to read this from all the up on that high horse. 3) He just had his dick posted for the entire world to see after having all control removed from tools he uses to help make a living. He was also making decent progress at a tournament he wanted to succeed at but had to forfeit because of events out of his control. He's had to deal with a large population of illiterate people who had knee-jerk reactions and accused him of distributing child pornography. Not to mention people completely trashing his character and imposing their morals on him behind a veil of anonymity. Not to mention trolls who have absolutely no idea what Starcraft 2 or the context of events mailing sponsors. His threat to contact her place of work/school was lame, but otherwise he had the reaction of a lot of normal people and it's justified to me. The whys and hows should absolutely matter in this incident. Like I've told you before, believe it or not, in a lot of groups of close friends, the sharing of photos in private like that is the norm. The absolute worst part of this entire situation is that if the roles were reversed and Steven was the one that made unauthorized access to a woman's accounts and made her photographs public, there would be VERY few of you that would actually stand up for him. It's absolutely insane the number of people in this thread and on Reddit that believe she was justified in how she handled the situation (This isn't directed at you, I can't remember your thoughts on this subject, sorry). missed the point. whys and hows barely matters to sponsors and teams I'm sure alot of group of friends are also crack racists jokes in their small circle, doesn't mean it won't be hugely frown upon if some celebrities/stars/employee did it and got caught this is not the first time, in fact its incredibly common, for players or even average day employees to be fired or penalized for these kind of behavior.Anyway, disregarding sponsors, the line between private and public no longer exists once its out there. Just because you're a jackass in discrete, doesn't mean people will tolerate it once its blown \ Lol? What? No it's not. Maybe celebrities, but they don't get fired or penalized. They just get more publicity. And it's almost as if to imply that it's even right that hundreds of upset posters e-mailing sponsors over any trivial bullshit drama is justifiable and okay. Kim Kardashian has a sex tape leaked, makes more money. Destiny gets a picture of his dick leaked, gets fired from his team. In trying to 'legitimise' E-sports we really seem to be trying to uphold standards that don't even apply in other industries, especially entertainment. Different scenarios. Unless the sponsors behind Roots team wants those kind of personality, then he can go do whatever the fuck he wants. Its not that complicated. The sponsors behind root wants professionalism. The viewers don't tolerate these kind of issues, so destiny gets fired. The sponsors behind Kim Kardashian don't give a fuck, and I'm sure their viewers don't either (cause they're selling sex anyway). In fact, given the fame they don't need sponsors at all. These kind of morale standards apply to the entertainment industry all the time? In many Asia idol groups, any sex scandals would get the team disbanded. In some sports, harassment or inappropriate behavior gets fined or barred from playing for the seasons. In Sports, there's plenty of controversies that are no different from the drama sc2 has spurred hat ends with people getting fired, penalized, or nothing happened. But controversies and debates still lingers In the end, it is still the team and sponsors decisions. If Destiny can't handle appropriate behaviors, he can go look for sponsors or teams that tolerate those issues. At least one of the sponsors claimed to support Destiny and his stream persona and what it brought to their brand in terms of exposure. For every Asian Idol, there's a footballer who is caught with a prostitute for next to no censure outside of having to make a faux apology. Probably because the industry is big enough with enough money behind it that they don't have to pursue more stringent actions. Yes, with all of that money, they still have to make a public apology. Compare this with ROOTFayth's responses on this very thread.
Did anybody believe that Tiger Woods was actually remorseful? I'm the kind of guy who thinks that an action without actual intent behind it isn't really worth making but I may be atypical in this regard.
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On August 31 2012 08:46 Wombat_NI wrote:Nope, he didn't do anything with tact and got pretty flustered but I'd rather see that than an insincere 'oh I'm so sorry.' Don't really think of it as cyberbullying at all
If it was a matter of him being "flustered" then I would expect that he would have apologized after sleeping on it. Last I checked, he didn't.
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You cant be serious? What the fuck is the matter with you guys o0...
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Northern Ireland25694 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:48 KillingVector wrote:Show nested quote +On August 31 2012 08:46 Wombat_NI wrote:Nope, he didn't do anything with tact and got pretty flustered but I'd rather see that than an insincere 'oh I'm so sorry.' Don't really think of it as cyberbullying at all If it was a matter of him being "flustered" then I would expect that he would have apologized after sleeping on it. Last I checked, he didn't.
He'd be apologising for his wording or his tone, I don't expect him to change his actual underlying opinion on the matter.
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EPT
