EPTHeart of the Swarm TvP Battle Report! - Page 66
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Lorch
Germany3701 Posts
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Cabinet Sanchez
Australia1097 Posts
On August 15 2012 17:25 Snowbear wrote: Please take a look at a starcraft 2 WOL battle report: It's the same boring 1a as in the HOTS TvP battle report. Now ask yourself: is sc2 now played like in the battle report? No, it isn't. I understand that it looks so damn boring, especially the warhound. But let's wait. Blizzard is actually listening more to us then we think. I know they made some bad decisions, but their goal is still to create an esports title. The *actual units* seem generally,.. well 'dumb' though and several of the changes are going to limit play (like a 13 range, powerful canon on the Nexus) | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10910 Posts
Since early beta people were bitching about Marauder/Roach/Colossus/Corruptor/.../... and we were right when you look at the current game. The only interesting race is Terran. Now what does Hots add? More of the same shit with WAY too "purpose-built" units, it even seems to try to make Terran more boring.... I sometimes think about playing SC/BW or WC3 again... Hell, i even install Supreme Commander from time to time.... I never seriously feel the urge to play SC2 again. | ||
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wcr.4fun
Belgium686 Posts
On August 15 2012 16:52 Snowbear wrote: The only reason why so many people quit starcraft 2 is because it's too hard to be good for them. Meanwhile there is League of Legends, where it is hard to NOT be good. Starcraft 2 is a game you play alone, so if you lose it's YOUR mistake. In league of legends it's the mistake of your teammates  .Another note is that starcraft 2 is watchable for people that don't know the game. Meanwhile League of Legends is only watchable if you know the game. A very good esport title, isn't it? Too bad 80 percent of the player base is diamond or lower... If you enjoy the game you play it, you don't quit a game because it's too hard. Tons of casuals are always saying how they 'enjoy' sc2 at the low level because they can do all sort of 'fun' stuff. Sc2 is miles easier than BW to get into. People are enjoying league of legends, that's why they play it. People aren't enjoying sc2, that's why they're quitting. | ||
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Gosi
Sweden9072 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:24 Velr wrote: The problem is that even plenty of hardcre players aren't excited for HOTS anymore. Since early beta people were bitching about Marauder/Roach/Colossus/Corruptor/.../... and we were right when you look at the current game. The only interesting race is Terran. Now what does Hots add? More of the same shit with WAY too "purpose-built" units, it even seems to try to make Terran more boring.... I sometimes think about playing SC/BW or WC3 again... Hell, i even install Supreme Commander from time to time.... I never seriously feel the urge to play SC2 again. Yeah I'm like that too. I can play alot of sc2 one day but the next day there just isn't anything that makes me wanna play again like how it was with BW. So I log on iCCup or DotA/LoL and play some games here and there instead. It's the competition that is fun when I play sc2, not the actual game unfortunately. :< | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12042 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:27 wcr.4fun wrote: Too bad 80 percent of the player base is diamond or lower... If you enjoy the game you play it, you don't quit a game because it's too hard. Tons of casuals are always saying how they 'enjoy' sc2 at the low level because they can do all sort of 'fun' stuff. Sc2 is miles easier than BW to get into. People are enjoying league of legends, that's why they play it. People aren't enjoying sc2, that's why they're quitting. The only reason why most people find hard BW to get into is it's decade old UI that holds you back with really silly design decisions. I played Brood War for years before SC2 so I know what I'm talking about, but you can't bring that sort of thing into the discussion. The UI is harder to conquer in BW than the actual game. Let me put this into context for everyone here. Were you around when Brood War was announced? If you actually look at the units they first announced, until we saw them in game they looked like boring a move units as well. (These are views for the general people before Broodwar was released) Valkyrie/Corsair - Oh, dumb a move anti air units with splash to make the game easy DT - Invisible Unit that does ridiculous damage? Boring. Dark Archon - Interesting, but I doubt it'd ever get used. Medic - Auto heal? Just a move it with your marines then. Lurker - Oh you just burrow it and it kills stuff automatically. Boring. Devourer - What's even the point of this unit? Pointless and boring, a move friendly. Don't get me wrong, Broodwar was a fantastic game, but at release it looked just as boring unit wise. Give the game a damned chance before you write it off. It's not even in beta yet. This is coming from a massive Broodwar and Starcraft 2 fan. | ||
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Naphal
Germany2099 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:13 Bagi wrote: Why do you think copying BW would be any more successful? Its not a matter of game flow and how certain mechanics work differently in BW and SC2. Introducing muta stacking and more positional mech play isn't going to make the casuals flock to this game. BW was never popular with casuals outside Korea, and even there it was just a huge coincidence. Its about a casual game vs a hardcore one. MOBAs are popular for the same reason a game like WoW is popular, its easy and rewarding even for the most casual players. about the rewarding part, i know it is purely cosmetic, but why are about 35% of the players in bronzeleague? would not 20% look better? another 20% for silver/gold/plat then 19%dia and 1% master? dunno just wondering... | ||
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Dustin_Butthead
36 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:24 Velr wrote: The problem is that even plenty of hardcre players aren't excited for HOTS anymore. Since early beta people were bitching about Marauder/Roach/Colossus/Corruptor/.../... and we were right when you look at the current game. The only interesting race is Terran. Now what does Hots add? More of the same shit with WAY too "purpose-built" units, it even seems to try to make Terran more boring.... I sometimes think about playing SC/BW or WC3 again... Hell, i even install Supreme Commander from time to time.... I never seriously feel the urge to play SC2 again. Good point. I mean Diablo3 got good sales off the coattails of D2 but people will be more skeptical if they ever make a D4. I think it's already true for HoTS. The rose colored glasses have come off for many. | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:13 Bagi wrote: Why do you think copying BW would be any more successful? Its not a matter of game flow and how certain mechanics work differently in BW and SC2. Introducing muta stacking and more positional mech play isn't going to make the casuals flock to this game. BW was never popular with casuals outside Korea, and even there it was just a huge coincidence. Its about a casual game vs a hardcore one. MOBAs are popular for the same reason a game like WoW is popular, its easy and rewarding even for the most casual players. Speak for yourself. I am a casual BW player, I never use mutastack, never do timing attacks and I don't know basic BOs, but still, I enjoy playing it with my friends. The only problem we got is playing through god awful garena. Some of my friends don't even know who Flash or JD are. But they love sc bw. Also I don't understand why some people against of making sc2 same as BW. Is it some sort of rule that a sequel should be entirely different? I want BW with better graphics and new campaign. I don't want changes for sake of changes. | ||
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Garmer
1286 Posts
On August 15 2012 17:28 Snowbear wrote: Starcraft 2 in teamgames isn't as fun as League of Legends. Face it dude, LoL is an easy game, and people play it because they lack the competitive spirit that sc2 requires. Starcraft 2 is a hard game. 99% of people can't take losses. So they play LoL, where their losses are not because of them, but because of their teammates. You mean something like the baneling? Or the nuke? Or the collossus? Or the archon? Or the high templar? Or the infestor? Or the hellion? 1)yeah they don't play because it's stressfull and all those things, but not because they feel alone(i'm speaking about team game obviously) 2)all those units you mentioned have a joke aoe, come on, hellion/archon really? lol i have written SERIOUS aoe damage, like reaver, spider mine that blow with one shoot 5+ units(not only the weakest one) for me there are two reason why SC2 is not popular anymore boring gameplay too difficult/stressful (for casual players, sadly they are the majority) | ||
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Rabiator
Germany3948 Posts
On August 15 2012 17:25 Snowbear wrote: Please take a look at a starcraft 2 WOL battle report: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaa8I6K1Z1Y It's the same boring 1a as in the HOTS TvP battle report. Now ask yourself: is sc2 now played like in the battle report? No, it isn't. I understand that it looks so damn boring, especially the warhound. But let's wait. Blizzard is actually listening more to us then we think. I know they made some bad decisions, but their goal is still to create an esports title. SADLY the new battle reports are the same "stupid style for dummies" as the WoL ones. You COULD make battle reports actually interesting by not having stupid players play each side AS SHOWN BY BLIZZARD THEMSELVES at Blizzcon 2008: Sonkie vs Yellow 2008 Those games are actually interesting, but Blizzard screwed up by cancelling Blizzcon this year, else they could have done something similar. So either make battle reports for six-year-olds or make them really competitive-ish with people who know how to use their units and defend themselves. Blizzard chose the wrong one ... | ||
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
On August 15 2012 18:46 Naphal wrote: about the rewarding part, i know it is purely cosmetic, but why are about 35% of the players in bronzeleague? would not 20% look better? another 20% for silver/gold/plat then 19%dia and 1% master? dunno just wondering... The division is 20% bronze, 20% silver, 20% gold, 20% platinum, 18% diamond, 2% master of active players. The reason 35% of the people are in bronze is because they are inactive, thus do not count towards the 20% in their league. There simply are more inactive people that are bronze league than inactive people that are silver or higher. | ||
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Radison
Poland44 Posts
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Talack
Canada2742 Posts
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CuSToM
United States1478 Posts
"wow the terran has impeccable macro! look at him as he sits on 3k minerals at 160 supply, impeccable!" | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12042 Posts
On August 15 2012 19:35 CuSToM wrote: how can anybody take Day9 seriously after this? "wow the terran has impeccable macro! look at him as he sits on 3k minerals at 160 supply, impeccable!" He had very low gas. If you've ever played mech you'll realise on 3 base unless you waste a load of money into more command centers straight away you'll be building a high mineral bank already. That early on in the game it's not worth getting a lot of hellions as you need your factories to be producing tanks and thors in TvP. It's not until you get your fourth base you can start adding and flooding with factories for hellions. | ||
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NATO
United States459 Posts
On August 15 2012 19:36 Qikz wrote: He had very low gas. If you've ever played mech you'll realise on 3 base unless you waste a load of money into more command centers straight away you'll be building a high mineral bank already. That early on in the game it's not worth getting a lot of hellions as you need your factories to be producing tanks and thors in TvP. It's not until you get your fourth base you can start adding and flooding with factories for hellions. Exactly. That's like making fun of a max zerg for having 3000 minerals and 200/200 army. They don't want to waste supply on lings! | ||
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Unibrow88
Germany39 Posts
I don't get it. This is just to give us a basic idea about the new units/features and its not "THIS IS HOW HOTS IS GOING TO BE - NO CHANGES!" I really looking forward to HotS. The Warhound should eliminate these 40min Stalemate TvTs and make the Terran Race a little bit easier like Zerg and Protoss. Protoss and Zerg have so much more A-Move friendly units (Ultra/Ling/Zealot) - with Terran you have to micro way more and its fine that HotS tries to fix it. | ||
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Dragar
United Kingdom971 Posts
On August 15 2012 20:06 NATO wrote: Exactly. That's like making fun of a max zerg for having 3000 minerals and 200/200 army. They don't want to waste supply on lings! It's not the same. The good zerg players use their mineral stockpile - more bases (for more gas), walls of spines, macro hatches, or throwaway ling attacks. And if they are maxed, a zerg wants a mineral stockpile for a ling/roach remax after a huge engagement. It's just poor macro from the Terran - he could have thrown down a few barracks and used them as spotters in airspace, for instance. Not a bad idea given oracles or warp prisms are about! Or used 40 marines to take another base early for more gas, and then thrown them away, resulting in a 200/200 mech army a lot quicker. So yeah, 3000 minerals is poor play, mech or not. | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12042 Posts
On August 15 2012 20:19 Dragar wrote: It's not the same. The good zerg players use their mineral stockpile - more bases (for more gas), walls of spines, macro hatches, or throwaway ling attacks. And if they are maxed, a zerg wants a mineral stockpile for a ling/roach remax after a huge engagement. It's just poor macro from the Terran - he could have thrown down a few barracks and used them as spotters in airspace, for instance. Not a bad idea given oracles or warp prisms are about! Or used 40 marines to take another base early for more gas, and then thrown them away, resulting in a 200/200 mech army a lot quicker. So yeah, 3000 minerals is poor play, mech or not. Have you played Mech in TvP in SC2 yet? There's plenty of people who do and plenty of people who would disagree with what you just said. You don't need spotting barracks as the sensor tower exists. You can use barracks walls but they're not as useful against protoss as they are against zerg as immortals just rip through them, turrets are good, but there's no need for massive turret rings at that point in the game and you can't race for bases like zerg can. You have to slow push to your bases and having 40 unupgraded marines won't make that any faster. Also, that map was pretty awful for mech defense wise. | ||
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