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Orb Dismissed from Evil Geniuses Broadcasts - Page 22

Forum Index > SC2 General
3626 CommentsPost a Reply
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Alex is verbose, and you owe it to yourself (and the rest of us) to read the statement in its entirety. Remember, when making comments/claims to provide proper evidence, facts etc. Arguments based on incorrect assumptions, facts and straw men, will be dealt with swiftly. If in doubt, PM a mod or ask IRC. Do NOT spread misinformation, when in doubt, check your sources.

In short, be smart.

Alex comments on Idra:


Orbs Statement: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038

Personal attacks against other posters in this thread will be met with a ban -- 14:20 KST
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5553 Posts
March 09 2012 04:28 GMT
#421
On March 09 2012 13:26 MVTaylor wrote:
http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/jjq28/racist_and_homophobic_thats_what_orb_is/

Looks like no one gave a shit then. So what has happened?

I think that's the reaction we should always have as a community. People want to make things a big deal so there's drama in the community.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
Lotar
Profile Joined September 2010
132 Posts
March 09 2012 04:28 GMT
#422
On March 09 2012 13:10 Angelbelow wrote:
I just hope whoever decided to message the sponsors of EG actually did it because they were genuinely offended by Orbs comments


Hahaha, I know you're kidding. We both know they did it to see if they could get someone fired, and they won.

User was warned for this post
Mafs
Profile Joined January 2011
Canada458 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-09 04:33:01
March 09 2012 04:28 GMT
#423
No one in our culture used "faggot" or "nigger" they way they are meant to be used. "Nigger" no longer refers to black people. It's just an insult that is meant to represent someone who is a obnoxious asshole who thinks he isn't. "Faggot" represents someone who is just as annoying as a "Nigger" but doesn't care if he is or isn't an asshole.

People who keep trying to bring racism back to words that used to used as slurs against groups, when in the context used it doesn't even mention anyone who is gay or black. The only people are are truly racists are those that use those words in they way racists used them 50 years ago. Language changes, and if you can't accept that then you are a idiot. Because then faggot isn't a slur for gay people, its a bundle of sticks
SeventhPride
Profile Joined February 2012
712 Posts
March 09 2012 04:28 GMT
#424
Coming from Singapore, I have been living in a society where people live peacefully together no matter what race you are and we are very tolerant of each other and we can be jailed for saying anything racially offensive. I was shocked when I found out about racism about 10 years ago when I visited the states where people called me a chink and talk about my eyes. So I am really happy that us as a starcraft community is taking steps to ensure racism is not gonna happen here. Good job sir! Though I must say orb really sounds sorry and he really does sound like he doesn't mean it
binkman
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia40 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#425
As has been said many times already this thread, its not JUST about the language orb used, it is about his reaction after the fact.

We all make mistakes, best to wear the the consequences and move on - not lie about them and try to cover them up. Particularly not when that involves lying to your new employer.

I like orbs casting and his stream, and I dont think hes a racist, but he handled this badly and is paying the price. Hopefully this isn't the end of his casting 'career' and he can take this in his stride and continue doing what he loves.

As for comparisons to Idra/Huk/other eg players who have said racist/homophobic things, what we don't see is these people lying about their actions.
Zzoram
Profile Joined February 2008
Canada7115 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#426
On March 09 2012 13:27 13_Doomblaze_37 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2012 13:15 EcksperT wrote:
I don't know what exactly caused the outrage... but I do not think it had anything to do with the community's "core values." Look no further than Destiny defending the fact that he says "nigger" and those who championed him for that or no one caring when HuK said it on twitter to his tens of thousands of followers. This is not a proud day. There was no comcomitance of morals amongst Starcraft Players. I believe this incident was nothing more than people creating drama for the sake of drama.



This is an insightful post.

Do you guys remember the SotG where Destiny and InControl spent 2 hours talking about how the term "nigger" became a generic insult? That was met with some controversy, but the fact is that nigger doesn't mean what it used to. Stop treating it like it does It's what people say when they rage, not when they want to insult a black guy. Same with faggot. Treating orb this way this just reinforces the stigma associated with the words, when it shouldn't even exist anymore.

Orb lied. that should be the reason why you fired him, not because hes been calling people niggers and faggots since the beta. You lost a passionate caster today EG, and while you gained some fans, you lost quite a few as well.

I'm not mad a EG, I understand that they needed to do this from a business standpoint to appease the masses. I find it hard to believe that nobody from EG had ever tuned into one of orbs streams before where he swears, because its rather frequent. Rather, I think that nobody from EG cared.

I'm mad at the starcraft and reddit community. Nobody gives a fuck if orb calls someone a nigger on the stream. If they do, they why does destiny have free reign to do it whenever he wants to? Nobody gives a fuck if orb calls someone a faggot on his stream. If they do, then why does Idra have free reign to do it whenever he wants to? You guys helped ruin someone's life today, I hope you're happy with it.


Destiny shouldn't be allowed to do what he does publicly without consequences. The fact that he has been able to get away with it is shameful.
knOxStarcraft
Profile Joined March 2012
Canada422 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#427
Listen people, if Alex Garfield wants people to believe he cares about the use of derogatory language enough to fire someone he HAS to fire IdrA ASAP. This ofc won't happen and that's because him firing orb is ALL about business and protecting EG. Orb's dream has been crushed because people made a big deal of what he said a couple of times in a LADDER game. If people hadn't made it such a big deal orb wouldn't have lied to EG and he would have gotten a slap on the wrist for his actions.

This community is NO BETTER than the other gaming communities. This community is simply bad for different reasons.

It is a sad day for e-sports.
theBullFrog
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States515 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#428
I love eg and all they do. Props to alex.


Btw.. anyone else read it in his voice?(from interviews)
thebullfrog
Cifer
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom69 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#429
On March 09 2012 12:42 ottersareneat wrote:

Now, moving on to points more relevant to the happenings of the past several days, let me be clear: it is my personal opinion that n----- is the ugliest, most repulsive word in the American-English vocabulary. I have never said it, typed it, or written it. If it's used in my presence, I immediately speak up and demand that it not be used again in my presence, regardless of context or circumstances (and for the record, I am equally sensitive about who can and can't say n---a, but that's a different discussion entirely). There are many valid reasons to find the word n----- offensive and repulsive, but for me, the overarching reason is that there is no other word that so efficiently and effectively captures such extreme human injustice and inequality. There is an inherent power dynamic/discrepancy contained within the act of saying the word n-----, and its use sets its subject apart from its object to a greater extent than any other word we have is able to. As such, if you prescribe to my contemporary definition of racism outlined above, there is no more racist word in existence than n-----. By its very nature, it is the essence of absolute racism, in its most extreme form, encapsulated in a noun. In my opinion, with few exceptions, it doesn't matter who says it, to whom, in what context. It's a racist word. If it has a subject and an object, I find its use to be inexcusable - again, with very few exceptions.


Writing n----- or saying "the n word" still conveys the meaning of the word so to the listener or reader, so it doesn't matter if you did or did not type it, you conveyed the meaning of the word and in that regard can you consider that as being a racist act since the context does not matter? Unless you believe the physical act of pronouncing those set of syllables or pressing the buttons that make up the word itself is racist that is, then that's a completely different issue.

Also, just because you associate a deep historical stigma to the word does not mean that the nature of the word encapsulates the essence of racism. Definitions change, and context does matter, and the greatest evidence towards that is that the word is a derivative of the word meaning a person of black ancestry (something quite void of racism without context).

I'm not defending orb nor do i know what he said or meant. However, I hate when people push their definitions and use of language on other people. I think hypersensitivity towards such things in itself goes more towards promoting racism as it is a constant reminder of how people used once used to word in such a repulsive and offensive manner.

ninjamyst
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1903 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#430
people say nigger all the time. no big deal. drama queens everywhere.
LeoA
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada108 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#431
I'm not super sure that I agree with Alex on this.

I totally understand and see where he is coming from, but I think that words only get whatever power people give to them. I dont think that the n word is a particularly attractive one, but I also think that we should not, as a community, hound on, and for lack of a better word, persecute one prominent person to make a statement.

I feel like this punishment is quite harsh for something that was said when -orb wasn't even representing EG. I think that both orb and Alex should write a statement regarding the incidents, and that orb should be allowed to clean up his act, immediately.

Maybe he should've been given another chance, and then forced to leave if he fucked up again
Before you say anything, remember...I bite.
NuclearJudas
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
6546 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#432
I'm a bit disappointed actually. He blurted out something in a moment of rage, when not representing anyone but himself. Surely if EG did their research before hiring him, they'd find out that Orb used to rage on ladder while streaming (I remember an early episode of SOTG when someone said something along the lines of him watching Orb streaming and was being amused by the rage). I'd hoped he could be forgiven for something as small (<-debatable) as this. Perhaps be given a fine and a stern warning?


That said, naturally I'm against racism, and don't want to see it get used in eSports whatsoever.
Life is like Tetris. Your errors pile up but your accomplishments disappear. - Robert Ohlén | http://railroaddiary.wordpress.com/ - My words about stuff.
magnaflow
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada1521 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#433
On March 09 2012 13:19 XRaDiiX wrote:
I've gained alot of respect for EG after reading this.

I will give a shout out to Steel-series i bought a sensei a month ago because they sponsor EG.



See, this is why Orb was fired.
ExoTau
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada67 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#434

I agree with the decision and the statement. My question is what happens if reddit starts digging the NUMEROUS f----t I saw on Idra's stream?
Takezou
Profile Joined October 2010
United States320 Posts
March 09 2012 04:29 GMT
#435
On March 09 2012 13:24 Sprouter wrote:
This community is full of hypocrites. I hope you are all happy ruining a guy's dream for something really silly.


Don't know how people blame anyone other than Orb. The community did not make Orb say/act the way he did.

I do feel bad that someone has to suffer but it is because of his own stupidity.
taintmachine
Profile Joined May 2010
United States431 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-09 04:33:30
March 09 2012 04:30 GMT
#436
On March 09 2012 13:27 oogieogie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2012 13:24 taintmachine wrote:
On March 09 2012 13:17 ZenithM wrote:
On March 09 2012 13:13 Luepert wrote:
Idra calls people faggots while officailly representing EG
Idra gets the largest fanbase in all of starcraft 2
Idra gets paid lots of money by EG.

Orb calls people niggers while on his own personal time
Orb has few fans
Orb gets fired by EG.


The thing is, it's not advisable to trash talk and insult some dudes on the Internet, regardless of what certain other people seem to be allowed to say.
Can't you just take your fucking loss and shut the fuck up without BM'ing?


two wrongs don't make a right, but eg has had people saying homophobic comments in the public eye from the start of their involvement with sc2. i apparently have low standards for what people say, since i mostly do not care about any namecalling. however, the hypocrisy here is very funny, and if EG was going to try to make a statement about being socially aware and considerate, then they should have focused on their big names calling people faggots before their little names started calling people niggers.



He has.


then the focus amounted to no real action as far as the community is concerned (this is a community issue now, eg has made it so with its post), and the difference between calling someone a faggot and calling someone a nigger is arbitrarily set to being enormous, which one can only assume is what EG thinks since idra is still employed and orb is not.

or maybe it's just that the term nigger gets more negative attention from the community/sponsors and all that talk about society was actually bullshit as the cost of keeping orb is simply not worth the money
Thorantham
Profile Joined September 2010
United States221 Posts
March 09 2012 04:30 GMT
#437
I think the final decision by EG was the right one but we should all expect the same for everyone on EG going forward, including players like incontrol and idra. Alex has set a precedent, not just for these terms but for professionalism and offensive comments - will he be so stand-up when it's someone else....?

Gat5by
Profile Joined March 2012
United States1 Post
March 09 2012 04:30 GMT
#438
I just don't get it. I would have to go out of my way to make comments like that. Why do they come so easily to some people? He has a history of this behavior...will he really stop?
eviltomahawk
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States11135 Posts
March 09 2012 04:30 GMT
#439
Wow, that mod disclaimer at the top is changing fast.

Anyways, I'm actually surprised that there wasn't much mention of Orb's botched cover-up of the situation, which seemed to be the bulk of the fuel for this outrage.

I'm kinda sad that I won't see more of Orb casting with EG, since I really enjoyed his casting in the Korean Weekly.
ㅇㅅㅌㅅ
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 09 2012 04:30 GMT
#440
On March 09 2012 13:27 oogieogie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2012 13:24 taintmachine wrote:
On March 09 2012 13:17 ZenithM wrote:
On March 09 2012 13:13 Luepert wrote:
Idra calls people faggots while officailly representing EG
Idra gets the largest fanbase in all of starcraft 2
Idra gets paid lots of money by EG.

Orb calls people niggers while on his own personal time
Orb has few fans
Orb gets fired by EG.


The thing is, it's not advisable to trash talk and insult some dudes on the Internet, regardless of what certain other people seem to be allowed to say.
Can't you just take your fucking loss and shut the fuck up without BM'ing?


two wrongs don't make a right, but eg has had people saying homophobic comments in the public eye from the start of their involvement with sc2. i apparently have low standards for what people say, since i mostly do not care about any namecalling. however, the hypocrisy here is very funny, and if EG was going to try to make a statement about being socially aware and considerate, then they should have focused on their big names calling people faggots before their little names started calling people niggers.

https://twitter.com/#!/beesinyoface/status/177963959431872512

He has.


Alex is good like that. Also, Idra never lied about what he said and never claimed it was anything more that what it was. I'm sure there have been some choice discussions between Alex and Greg.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
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