EPTMLG Winter Arena to be PPV - Page 149
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Criticism is allowed. Undue flaming is not. Take a second to think your post through before you submit. Bans will be handed out. Should go without saying, but don't link restreams here either. | ||
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Grovbolle
Denmark3815 Posts
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:16 Grovbolle wrote: Just a question, why do you want their balance sheets? Wouldn't the annual earnings report be more suitable? I'd like to see a financial breakdown: revenue, expense, investment, comparisons from event to event of what they changed and how it affected revenue. Something really seems off. | ||
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Witten
United States2094 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:12 AmericanUmlaut wrote: That tweet was the last straw. Basically, "we sold you guys this thing and then we realized we hadn't charged you enough, so we renamed half of it so we can sell it to you again." That's just utterly disrespectful. If gold membership had simply been $80 or thereabouts from the start, I honestly would have paid for it without complaint; MLG weekends have been a really cool thing for my family. My wife's and my friends come over, we drink beers, we play games inbetween matches, it's a sweet deal. And I can certainly afford it. But this is simply bait and switch. It's unethical to treat people this way who paid for a gold membership and excuse it by alternatingly claiming that we gold members are still getting what we paid for (as Sundance argued to me on Twitter) and that someone in his organization screwed up and included too much for too little in the gold package, so they're just taking it away from us. I understand that these events have to generate more revenue to turn a profit, and I'm more than happy to put up my dollars (well, Euro) to support them, but I don't appreciate doing so only to have the organizations I support turn around and treat me like a shmuck. MLG has managed to piss away a lot of the good will it had with me up to this point by doing this, and I won't be giving them any more of my money. I pay not only to support E-Sports as a whole, but to support those organizations that treat us with the respect that I associate with the SC2 community, and is one of the biggest reasons that I'm part of the community in the first place. This post made me really sad  . Does MLG not think they're completely screwing over all gold members by doing this. Technically of course, it didn't say it included MLG Pro Circuit ARENA events, but no one really knew they existed at all until recently. It was pretty clear to people purchasing gold that they were getting all MLG Pro Circuit content, but changing the name from MLG Pro Circuit Championship to MLG Pro Circuit ARENA makes it ok to charge almost the original Gold price for it?Such bullshit. | ||
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Aserrin
Uruguay231 Posts
The better players are in MLG, yet not the best of the best (considering MMA didn't qualify and MC/DRG may drop their slots if they advance in GSL), so that's a point for them. But I don't think it'll be enough. People want to watch Starcraft and will have enough with Assembly. Besides the fact that they're extremely disrespectful to their clients with this Championship/Arena move. | ||
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frozenrb
Poland389 Posts
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Witten
United States2094 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:16 Grovbolle wrote: Just a question, why do you want their balance sheets? Wouldn't the annual earnings report be more suitable? Not everyone here is an accounting/finance major (I am, or was at least), but I think it's pretty obvious in the context what they want. Arguing over which specific financial statement they want is really just a waste of time tbh. | ||
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Grovbolle
Denmark3815 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:19 Witten wrote: Not everyone here is an accounting/finance major (I am, or was at least), but I think it's pretty obvious in the context what they want. Arguing over which specific financial statement they want is really just a waste of time tbh. "Just a question" | ||
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tubs
764 Posts
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ceaRshaf
Romania4926 Posts
So instead for this industry to grow slowly they all tried it express and now they are blaming the community for not paying stuff as they should. Lol? | ||
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Witten
United States2094 Posts
Sorry if that sounded rude I wasn't trying to snap at you or anything it's just a few people have asked for specific financial document clarification. | ||
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nt-rAven
Canada405 Posts
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iky43210
United States2099 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:13 wklbishop wrote: Extremely insightful post right here. I know a lot of people are using the argument of why are tournaments popping up throughout 2011 as an symptom of its success and profitability, but people need to wait 5 years before making any judgement about SC2's ability to profit; because when people begin to invest it's not when the market is already turning a profit, but when people think there's potential to turn a profit. That said, I really think investing in Esports in the first place is an insane gamble. It could potentially pay off, but IMO the risks outweigh much of any potential profits. Lots of other less risky ventures to invest in that have just the same potential profits. but so far in this thread there's not a single credible source that shows competitive sc2 is not profitable. I don't see how people can say for certainty when they have no information outside of speculation | ||
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Thombur
95 Posts
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bonifaceviii
Canada2890 Posts
These people have already proven their willingness to pay for content, and Sundance says "welp, you didn't pay enough so pay again or no arena for you!" You don't take a set of customers with goodwill toward your organization and then shit on them because they were stupid enough to give you money. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10947 Posts
Tons of money got invested. The fans just weren't there. It's gone bankrupt. Now the new league is small but afaik sustainable. Growing stuff with a Sledge-Hammer just won't work. | ||
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Grovbolle
Denmark3815 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:21 Witten wrote: Sorry if that sounded rude I wasn't trying to snap at you or anything it's just a few people have asked for specific financial document clarification. It's okay, I have done some accounting, mostly in Danish, so I got confused as to what was actually what and what they really wanted to see. | ||
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drgoats
United States310 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:09 m4inbrain wrote: It is, it is. But sometimes its the smarter decision in the long run. Easy as that. It.. Well, i dont know the english word (amortisieren in german), it will "pay off" in the long run. Now theyre paying for a big office for about how many years? And didnt do good. It wont get cheaper. edit: but maybe i miss something, feel free to explain to me why an office in NYC is so important for MLG(!). And i mean that, could be that im missing something. They probably moved into their NYC offices well before they grew to this size so at the time it probably wasn't a thought in their mind that they would have this type of predicament. In all actuality, they probably chose NYC because there were more employees located near their than anywhere else. They could have chosen a suburb of NYC but to actually have an office is a lot more convenient especially when flying in clients and the such and making commutes for employees more reasonable. When MLG is trying to find a client it is a lot more impressive to have that meeting in MLG's office rather than in an office that is hidden in some office park on Long Island. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:13 wklbishop wrote: Extremely insightful post right here. I know a lot of people are using the argument of why are tournaments popping up throughout 2011 as an symptom of its success and profitability, but people need to wait 5 years before making any judgement about SC2's ability to profit; because when people begin to invest it's not when the market is already turning a profit, but when people think there's potential to turn a profit. That said, I really think investing in Esports in the first place is an insane gamble. It could potentially pay off, but IMO the risks outweigh much of any potential profits. Lots of other less risky ventures to invest in that have just the same potential profits. Indeed, but then you look at some of their expenses and I have a hard time feeling sorry for them. They're throwing away A LOT of money. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10947 Posts
If you want to host serious SC2.. Your fucked if your US based. Your few top players are in Korea and whos left for the most part can't compete with europe, let alone Korea. So you either have to bring SERIOUS pricemoney to get the top dogs from all over the world to the US.. Or you will have mediocre player fields (like MLG's before they "forced" quality by inviting Koreans and granting Code A/S Slots). | ||
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wklbishop
United States1286 Posts
On February 15 2012 06:05 iky43210 wrote: I have reedited my posts that you quoted for some other opinions. I am simply basing my reasoning why I believe they're making money on the fact that its still alive after 10 years. If it can sustain itself for 10 years with less viewers, I don't see how having drastically more now due to sc2 would do the opposite. your entire assumption of enough investments to pay off the debt each year for 10+ years is both illogical and improbable. Just because you know a few "esport people" that are doing in the red doesn't mean all of them are. Hmm, the problem with your line of logic is that business will continue to run as long as they are making more money than their variable costs. GM is a good example that has run in the red for years. If you're operating at a loss, sometimes it's better to keep going because suddenly shutting down will put you at a even bigger loss due to fixed costs from long contracts and year-old equipment. It's like you bought this piece of sound equipment 10 years ago that will only work for 10 years for $1000, but you're only going to get $900 worth of value out of it, you might as well operate despite the fixed costs making it not profitable because at least it'll help minimize the losses. EDIT: Also, don't forget the equation. Assets= SE + Liabilities The guy who posted the SEC filings showed mostly SE so that's actually a good explanation as to why they're still running. Equity is FAR different from liabilities as people are suggesting. | ||
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