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Schnullerbacke13
Germany1199 Posts
One could introduce some more ground types, not just high/low ground. It would be interesting having terrain which slows down your units or kind of 'highways' which speed up or let the range of ranged units get cut in the forrest. Currently the only deciding difference inbetween maps is the distance between spawning points, position of expansions and chokes. It would be quite interesting if different maps favour different tech paths. | ||
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TheSubtleArt
Canada2527 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:40 Treziel wrote: All you guys who want the game harder, why aren't you winning roughly 50% of your games against all the other people who have hit this entirely fictional skill cap? Why are there any players better than you? The fact that any players can dominate the scene, the fact that Koreans dominate foreigners, should tell you that we have not hit a skill cap and are nowhere near hitting one. Every time one of these threads about a skill cap appears, all you have is a bunch of master-level players whining because they think they lose too many games because of luck. In actual fact, they are losing because they are actually not pro gamers, and will never be pro gamers, but like to think that they are as good the pro's but are just a bit 'unlucky'. Come back and whine about a low skill cap when you can win roughly 50% of your games against a player like MVP. Or even just a mid-tier foreigner pro. Show me some top professional players who want the game harder because they think it is too easy. Because there's a difference between playing casually and playing the game professionally all day in a dedicated team house? No1 is claiming the skill cap is low enough for masters players to take games off MVP lol seriously this is one of the most retarded posts I've ever read. User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Jakkerr
Netherlands2549 Posts
BW is hard because the UI/control groups etc are terribly broken, which isn't too strange since the game is over 10 years old. We should be happy with the state SCII is in now. A hard game doesn't make it a good game and surely doesn't give it a big fanbase. Most people won't bother with a game that's too hard to be played properly on a casual level which at the end doesn't make the game a good E-sports game cuz it won't have people watching it :p | ||
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Tppz!
Germany1449 Posts
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Neurosis
United States893 Posts
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Treziel
United Kingdom123 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:42 bbm wrote: And it took two years between BW being released and BoxeR's dominance (I think, not too hot on bw history). Your point? He is talking rubbish anyway, look at Flash's record in TLPD: Record: 472 wins - 189 losses (71.41%). MVP's record in SC 2 for comparison: Record: 150 wins - 70 losses (68.18%) . Achieving a winrate of around 70% vs the best of the best in either game is amazing, some people here seem to think that people regularly win 90%+ of their matches or that there are players in BW who are literally unbeatable. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:46 Jakkerr wrote: No SC2 shouldn't be harder, unless you want the game to die off course. BW is hard because the UI/control groups etc are terribly broken, which isn't too strange since the game is over 10 years old. We should be happy with the state SCII is in now. A hard game doesn't make it a good game and surely doesn't give it a big fanbase. Most people won't bother with a game that's too hard to be played properly on a casual level which at the end doesn't make the game a good E-sports game cuz it won't have people watching it :p But being harder is what makes it worth watching it. It's not like you can ever really compete with LoL when it comes to casual-ness and lack of mechanical difficulty, and therefore popularity as well. If that's really the direction a game needs to go in order to become "esports", then maybe esports isn't such a good idea in the first place. Why trade a good game for popularity and big audience? Not really worth it imo. | ||
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
The first would remove most of the complaints of better players losing since coinflippy cheeses and rushes would be easier to deal with. The second would bring more skill elements into the lategame and just make the game more enjoyable to watch. | ||
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Noobity
United States871 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:40 DeepBlu2 wrote: [ Although SC2 may be focused more in different areas than its predecessor, and less in mechanics, it doesn't mean that SC2 is just as hard. SC2 requires different skills, but if you added it all together, BW still requires a higher physical capability in the form of APM and stronger mental capability. I feel like Blizzard removing some of the difficulty of the game lowered the skill ceiling but didn't make the game more fun. I'd like to see this "added it all together" in some form of provable math. I'm not saying that you're wrong, exactly, but that until I see some uncontestable proof that BW is considerably harder as a whole than SC2, then I'm not buying it. Mind you I completely understand and accept that this would be arguably suggestive proof, as some things are just harder than other things for different people. | ||
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Cereb
Denmark3388 Posts
You could just say "Hey wouldn't it be cool if there were more units you could do more micro stuff with" and then we would say "yes" And then someone would point to HoTS and say "It looks like it's already coming" And then we'd be like "Oh that's right! I guess we won't have to make threads about it and compare WoL to a game from the previous millenium all the time." And you'd be like "Oh right! What was I thinking?" And they lived happily ever after...  | ||
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Epoch
Canada257 Posts
With better design, rather then making the design worse. The game will naturally gain more depth. Thing's that can improve are the units and the way they interact with each other, as talked about in those great "Philosophy of Design" threads. | ||
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Treziel
United Kingdom123 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:45 TheSubtleArt wrote: Yes the game should be more difficult but Blizzard will never make that happen. Because there's a difference between playing casually and playing the game professionally all day in a dedicated team house? No1 is claiming the skill cap is low enough for masters players to take games off MVP lol seriously this is one of the most retarded posts I've ever read. Your total failure to understand logic astounds me. Compare all the top players playing in team houses right now. Are they all the same? Do they all win roughly 50% of their games against each other? No. There are some very good players who win roughly 70% of their games, and there are some terrible players who win 30% (or less). These people are all practicing, in the same environment, they are all pro. If the skill cap was so low, you'd expect them all to be roughly the same, and take 50% of the games of each other, and it would be very very rare for people to win successive tournaments. That isn't true. Perhaps you could provide some proof of this skill cap being hit? Or find some top professional players who think the skill cap is too low, or that the game is too easy? | ||
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paradoxOO9
United Kingdom1123 Posts
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Adtor
Canada82 Posts
I am litterally playing against the UI 90% the time because I can't make my units do simple actions I asked them to do. Is this what pro-BW players mean by skills? Compensating for the bad UI/Mechanics? It's like riding a bicycle with a crooked handle, a flat tire and a jumping chain. The simplicity of SC2's new UI made the game more accessible. Like anyone can play soccer because it's a net and a ball and simple rules. But if you are taling about units design, I can't say I played BW seriously enough to have a decent opinion of SC2 vs SC:BW. Yes, SC2 has alot of Rock-Paper-Scissor elements in term of units but it only makes scouting and unit composition decisions even more important. I think we just need to give some time to the game, pros are just starting to find great strategies and style. | ||
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Gheed
United States972 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:11 Blazinghand wrote: The hardness of the game is all that matters to me. Yes, oh, yes.... I want this game to be hard. All I want to be able to feel its hardness. I wish to sense it as I grasp my mouse and feel its sinewy cord and its coarse texture pads. I need to know it's hard as I gently brush my fingertips across my slick black keyboard. I yearn to press against the hardness of the high skill ceiling as I ladder. I love to feel it pushing me down. I need to feel the hardness inside me as I become hard like the game, as it hardens me and makes me a better gamer. I want to feel the hardness pound away at me and make me gosu. I like it hard. Post of the week | ||
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howLiN
Portugal1676 Posts
On January 23 2012 21:12 DeepBlu2 wrote: Adding things like automine and smartcast significantly lower the skillcap, yet don't make the game more fun, so I can't understand why they would add it. There is absolutely nothing that can justify not making the workers go mine by themselves. It's an unnecessary inconvenience that artificially raises the difficulty of the game due to the game code being shitty. I can agree with you on smartcast though, not having smartcast actually involves skill in unit positioning and actual micro. | ||
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Sated
England4983 Posts
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robih
Austria1086 Posts
BW was harder cause it had SHITTY UI so you want SC2 to get a UI as SHITTY as that of a 14 year old game?? srsly... User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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atuor
United States82 Posts
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Tchado
Jordan1831 Posts
LOL ! Post of the Month ! | ||
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