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The Shield Buff in Numbers - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
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KAmaKAsa
Profile Joined July 2011
Finland210 Posts
October 26 2011 17:21 GMT
#41
this is actually pretty big, now you can fit upgrades even more easily to your builds... terrans and zergs pretty fucking much have to go double evo or ebay. I don´t see the point in this... why should toss have cheaper upgrades than zerg and terran?
dignity
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada908 Posts
October 26 2011 17:24 GMT
#42
On October 27 2011 02:21 KAmaKAsa wrote:
this is actually pretty big, now you can fit upgrades even more easily to your builds... terrans and zergs pretty fucking much have to go double evo or ebay. I don´t see the point in this... why should toss have cheaper upgrades than zerg and terran?


I thought we already established that protoss units costed more than the other 2 races? If you want to trade unit cost for more costly upgrades I think every toss in the world would rather take that.
flowSthead
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
1065 Posts
October 26 2011 17:26 GMT
#43
On October 27 2011 02:21 KAmaKAsa wrote:
this is actually pretty big, now you can fit upgrades even more easily to your builds... terrans and zergs pretty fucking much have to go double evo or ebay. I don´t see the point in this... why should toss have cheaper upgrades than zerg and terran?


It still costs 300 minerals to build two forges, and the cost saved on 2/2 is 50/50, so yes you can fit it in more easily, but it's not game breaking. Did you read the OP at all?
"You can be creative but I will crush it under the iron fist of my conservative play." - Liquid`Tyler █ MVP ■ MC ■ Boxer ■ Grubby █
KevinIX
Profile Joined October 2009
United States2472 Posts
October 26 2011 17:28 GMT
#44
Changing the Blue Flame Upgrade Icon made the Hellion so overpowered, I hate to think what decreasing upgrade costs by 50 minerals is about to do.
Liquid FIGHTING!!!
stokes17
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1411 Posts
October 26 2011 17:29 GMT
#45
On October 27 2011 02:06 avilo wrote:
You get the upgrades faster than you previously would...that's what the huge deal is.


Explain this to me....

If i build my 2 forges at the same time in 1.4.2 as i did in 1.4.1 (which i will because forge cost wasn't changed)

and i start my 1/1 as soon as my forges finish
and i start my 2/2 as soon as my 1/1 finishes

How in the world will i get my upgrades faster?
wDDelete
Profile Joined March 2011
103 Posts
October 26 2011 17:29 GMT
#46
On October 27 2011 02:21 KAmaKAsa wrote:
this is actually pretty big, now you can fit upgrades even more easily to your builds... terrans and zergs pretty fucking much have to go double evo or ebay. I don´t see the point in this... why should toss have cheaper upgrades than zerg and terran?


Stop crying you'll still get your 3-3 marauders way before we max our upgrades. We pour so much gas into the sentry its not even funny, so gimme a break. These changes make sense and maybe we'll finally see some evenly upgraded armies fight during the mid late game!
Jerubaal
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States7684 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 17:47:30
October 26 2011 17:39 GMT
#47
On October 27 2011 02:29 stokes17 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2011 02:06 avilo wrote:
You get the upgrades faster than you previously would...that's what the huge deal is.


Explain this to me....

If i build my 2 forges at the same time in 1.4.2 as i did in 1.4.1 (which i will because forge cost wasn't changed)

and i start my 1/1 as soon as my forges finish
and i start my 2/2 as soon as my 1/1 finishes

How in the world will i get my upgrades faster?


You will get your 12th stalker out faster. Duh.

Oh and I'm not sure if the OP had this info, but according to my calculations, it takes ~14 seconds (game time?) to mine 50 gas off of 2 geysers and ~9.3 seconds off of 3.

EDIT: I thought I was going to be a smarty pants and make a cute little chart of how much time these cost reductions would 'save' you, but then I realized that the only Level 1 Upgrade that was reduced was shield. Who gets shield first? You're going to be on at least 4 geysers by the time you start Ground Level 2. The time saved will be mere seconds.
I'm not stupid, a marauder just shot my brain.
Logros
Profile Joined September 2010
Netherlands9913 Posts
October 26 2011 17:40 GMT
#48
On October 27 2011 02:29 stokes17 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2011 02:06 avilo wrote:
You get the upgrades faster than you previously would...that's what the huge deal is.


Explain this to me....

If i build my 2 forges at the same time in 1.4.2 as i did in 1.4.1 (which i will because forge cost wasn't changed)

and i start my 1/1 as soon as my forges finish
and i start my 2/2 as soon as my 1/1 finishes

How in the world will i get my upgrades faster?

I was just about to make the exact same post. Your upgrades do not come any faster you're just gonna have a little bit extra resources.
dignity
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada908 Posts
October 26 2011 17:42 GMT
#49
People will always complain, even when you give them all the evidence that they are wrongly complaining.
Talack
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada2742 Posts
October 26 2011 17:44 GMT
#50
They added one range to the immortal and made the 1-1-1 build much weaker. So even little changes like taking some resources off upgrades could have huge consequences. If anything I think this just makes protoss-all-in timing attacks that much stronger which is not what the game or the race needed.

WTB long-term solutions ><
Halcyondaze
Profile Joined January 2011
United States509 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 17:45:45
October 26 2011 17:45 GMT
#51
On October 27 2011 02:29 stokes17 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2011 02:06 avilo wrote:
You get the upgrades faster than you previously would...that's what the huge deal is.


Explain this to me....

If i build my 2 forges at the same time in 1.4.2 as i did in 1.4.1 (which i will because forge cost wasn't changed)

and i start my 1/1 as soon as my forges finish
and i start my 2/2 as soon as my 1/1 finishes

How in the world will i get my upgrades faster?


This is a little something I like to call Logic. Rarely used or seen, but when it is, it blows my fucking mind
dignity
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada908 Posts
October 26 2011 17:45 GMT
#52
This patch allows you to switch one zealot for one stalker.

This must make protoss timing attacks gamebreaking.
stokes17
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1411 Posts
October 26 2011 17:50 GMT
#53
On October 27 2011 02:44 Talack wrote:
They added one range to the immortal and made the 1-1-1 build much weaker. So even little changes like taking some resources off upgrades could have huge consequences. If anything I think this just makes protoss-all-in timing attacks that much stronger which is not what the game or the race needed.

WTB long-term solutions ><


everyone will agree that one range is A HUGE BUFF (see roach, archon, void ray in beta, and now immortal)

But how is 50/50 at 2/2 and 150/150 at 3/3 anywhere remotely as huge? What possible HUGE consequences could occur from having 50/50 more resources available for a 2/2 timing attack?

Yes a Protoss 2/2 allin timing attack (which actually rarely happens... usually 2/2 is used to secure a 3rd because attacking a terren in a defensive position is usually a bad call) will have 50/50 more resources to be allocated to econ/units/or additional tech. Which as the OP stated translates to about 1 more stalker instead of a zealot (idn if i even want to make that trade )

can we please stop being so sensationalist? Pretty Please???
grs
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Germany2339 Posts
October 26 2011 17:50 GMT
#54
Perfect way to show the ridiculous overreaction of some to a small protoss buff. I liked all of your post, but this part almost made me spill me coffee
and still have 25 Minerals left.(for one Interceptor lateron maybe?)
KobyKat
Profile Joined August 2011
United States111 Posts
October 26 2011 17:51 GMT
#55
I don't think people are mostly concerned with the amount of units Protoss will be able to make due to the decrease in the upgrades costs. I'm more worried about how the actual upgrades will affect the game because they can already double forge and get super fast upgrades with chronoboost. Blizzard is mainly making the hellion transformer in HotS to deal with 3-3 chargelots and they basically just made it that much easier for Protoss to get to that point.
stokes17
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1411 Posts
October 26 2011 17:52 GMT
#56
On October 27 2011 02:51 KobyKat wrote:
I don't think people are mostly concerned with the amount of units Protoss will be able to make due to the decrease in the upgrades costs. I'm more worried about how the actual upgrades will affect the game because they can already double forge and get super fast upgrades with chronoboost. Blizzard is mainly making the hellion transformer in HotS to deal with 3-3 chargelots and they basically just made it that much easier for Protoss to get to that point.


so the extra resources we get from the decreased upgrade cost is not your concern?


.....that's literally the ONLY thing that changed .......wtf
Jerubaal
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States7684 Posts
October 26 2011 17:53 GMT
#57
The funny thing is that it almost would have been worth upgrading the new Shields Level 1 over the old Ground Armor 3, but it won't be with both changed. Still, after everything is upgraded, getting that +1 to shields might be worth it.
I'm not stupid, a marauder just shot my brain.
stokes17
Profile Joined January 2011
United States1411 Posts
October 26 2011 17:56 GMT
#58
Ok instead of calling out overreacting people.... I want to pose a question to those sane and educated of us..... Will these changes make a 0/1/1 rush (and 0/2/2) more viable over the standard 1/1?

I ask this with consideration to the EMP nerf (which is, in a way, a shield buff). It seems like going shields with armor may increase the longevity of a gateway army more so than +1 weapons increases the potency.

Thoughts?
infinity2k9
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United Kingdom2397 Posts
October 26 2011 18:01 GMT
#59
I find it strange a lot of the mineral/gas costs are being so seriously discussed by non-pro players, as if they don't constantly bank far more all the time after the early game.
Arolis
Profile Joined October 2010
United States496 Posts
October 26 2011 18:01 GMT
#60
On October 26 2011 23:21 rEalGuapo wrote:
A lot of Terrans and Zergs feel that Protoss has gotten a huge buff and that Protoss now overall is so much stronger it might become OP due to the Changes.

Do people really think this? I haven't been paying attention to the reaction to this change because to me it seemed almost negligible. It's like when slavaging bunkers got changed from 100% to 75% mineral return. It changes a very small amount of resource availability but ultimately does nothing to the overall strength of the race.
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