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On October 26 2011 20:32 Teiwaz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2011 20:27 Krejven wrote:On October 26 2011 20:17 Teiwaz wrote:On October 26 2011 20:11 Krejven wrote:On October 26 2011 20:05 Teiwaz wrote:On October 26 2011 20:02 Teoita wrote:On October 26 2011 19:56 Krejven wrote:
So many people who for some reason belive ghosts emp and snipe have range 10 as base. NO they have 9 in range same as storm and fungal, together with the radius it is still the same as fungal and storm.
Snipe is same range as feedback and broodlord attack, 9, so stop saying it is op because it has longer range than feedback because it's a lie. Not. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Ghost. Get your facts straight next time please. Also EMP is aoe which further adds to its range compared to Feedback. Don't talk to people who can't even do basic math. Or to people who are unaware of the difference between mathematics and misinformation. Dude... 1.) 9+x is often times greater than 9 2.) 75HP Marines? Seriously? 3.) Not even Bronze players take a full storm. First yes I was apparently wrong that the base range is 10 and not 9 we have concluded that. However I said BASE range, not total effective range, as you can tell by me mentioning you add the radius. Secondly the 75 is the aoe dmg of the storm, not how much dmg the MM ball takes. If 10 targets get hit by a storm the max dmg they can take is 750. I did however say that if in a more likely case the terran player micros out of the storm after half of the duration it still does 375 dmg. To answer your third statement: no they do not which is why I made a more likely scenario of them being hit for only half the duration. 375 dmg for 75 energy - that's 5 dpe (damage per energy). Taking into account that the HT is 1.) very slow and has 2.) no other form of attack at least I think 5 dpe is ok for an AOE spell.
You can also mass them by making one single tech building that is unlocked right away and is cheap. The awesome spell doesn't require a research either.
Oh no wait, that's the ghost.
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Bulgaria5679 Posts
There better not be any protoss whine from now on until HOTS .
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On October 26 2011 06:27 Jimbo77 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty - Patch 1.4.2 General“Audio Fade” under Sound Options has been renamed to Game Volume During Alerts. Its tooltips have also been changed for clarification. The fade-in for game sound during alerts changed from .5 seconds to 2 seconds. Bug Fixes
Fixed a truncation on specific resolution if the current and maximum supplies are 3 digits. Fixed an issue which prevented footprint from being edited in the Footprint Editor. Fixed an issue that caused the game to have missing icons and images on low end graphics cards. BalancePROTOSSForge The cost of Upgrade Shields Level 1 has been decreased to 150/150, down from 200/200. The cost of Upgrade Shields Level 2 has been decreased to 225/225, down from 300/300. The cost of Upgrade Shields Level 3 has been decreased to 300/300, down from 400/400. The cost of Upgrade Ground Weapons Level 2 has been decreased to 150/150, down from 175/175. The cost of Upgrade Ground Weapons Level 3 has been decreased to 200/200, down from 250/250. The cost of Upgrade Ground Armor Level 2 has been decreased to 150/150, down from 175/175. The cost of Upgrade Ground Armor Level 3 has been decreased to 200/200, down from 250/250. TERRANGhost EMP radius has been decreased from 2 to 1.5 http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/1213111662Really strange, for what reason Protoss ground weapons and armor cost has changed. (for Shields OK) And why there is no reduction to FG radius along with EMP? P.S. For P EMP radius reduction might have sense cuz HT/sentry are really small, but now EMP is even more useless against really fat infestors, that is really worse for TvZ mid/late game.
Emp against infestor were even before this change a silly thing to do. Just snipe them, not like they are hard to click on. If you see terran go for ghost you can just spread them out a little so all wouldn'tbe hit at once, it is another deal with the protoss army since they have to stick togheter to be effective.
Besides the reduction cost on armor and weapon upgrades seem silly, shield upgrade cost reduction should happened long time ago.
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On October 26 2011 20:28 Shade_CsT wrote:The following units benefit from the Ground Protoss upgrades : - Zealot
- Stalker
- Sentry
- Immortal
- Colossus
- Dark Templar
- Archons
The Protoss race can already Chrono Boost their upgrades to gain an advantage over the other races. I am not sure why Blizzard made this change. I kinda agree with the Shield Upgrade but buffing Protoss Ground Upgrade makes no sense.
True, they all benefit from the weapon upgrade. Except HTs, they cannot attack of course.
Here is the Percentage of the overall "Health" that is affected by the Armor Upgrade:
Zealot: 66%
Stalker: 50%
Sentry 50%
Immmortal 66%
Colossus ~67%
HT 50%
DT 33%
Archon 3.5ish%
If you want one of these units to have a certain amount of armour on 100% of its health you need to research 2 Upgrades. I hope you see that it is not accurate to say that only 2 Upgrades are needed, especially looking at the Archon. Also the Stalker, seen in almost every game only has Armor on half his health.
You then go on to say that Protoss already has an advantage due to Chronoboost.
Well, admittedly Protoss can research Upgrades faster then any other race using Chronoboost, but that still is how the race works. For God's sake, by that logic Terran has free Scouting, extra income and spends less money on Supply. Chronoboost is great at speeding some things. But on the other hand we don't have Mules, we cannot produce 22 Workers at once because of no Larvae etc.
THINK before you POST.
Ty
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I am so hot for this PTR <3
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That terran players seriously complain about something as insignificant as -25-25 on +2 armor...
@above
Yeah lets remove terran from the game and replace it with a balanced race :D
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On October 26 2011 20:37 raga4ka wrote:
There better not be any protoss whine from now on until HOTS .
Funny how you say that when these are completely irrelevant changes to the main problem with protoss currently, yes it's nice to have the buffs to the upgrades, but that doesn't mean it magically fixes everything else that is still an issue.
Also
On October 26 2011 20:39 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2011 20:28 Shade_CsT wrote:The following units benefit from the Ground Protoss upgrades : - Zealot
- Stalker
- Sentry
- Immortal
- Colossus
- Dark Templar
- Archons
The Protoss race can already Chrono Boost their upgrades to gain an advantage over the other races. I am not sure why Blizzard made this change. I kinda agree with the Shield Upgrade but buffing Protoss Ground Upgrade makes no sense. True, they all benefit from the weapon upgrade. Except HTs, they cannot attack of course. Here is the Percentage of the overall "Health" that is affected by the Armor Upgrade: Zealot: 66% Stalker: 50% Sentry 50% Immmortal 66% Colossus ~67% HT 50% DT 33% Archon 3.5ish% You then go on to say that Protoss already has an advantage due to Chronoboost. Well, admittedly Protoss can research Upgrades faster then any other race using Chronoboost, but that still is how the race works. For God's sake, by that logic Terran has free Scouting, extra income and spends less money on Supply. Chronoboost is great at speeding some things. But on the other hand we don't have Mules, we cannot produce 22 Workers at once because of no Larvae etc. THINK before you POST.Ty
Bang on, exactly, especially the end part. Armour upgrades are good but they still don't apply as well as other races due to the shield taking up alot of the hitpoints which is unaffected by it whatsoever.
I am interested however to see if we see +1 weapons +1 shield researches instead of the +1/+1 weapons/armour, I know it would be pretty beneficial to blink stalker play and some pros did experiment with the shield ups early on a while back.
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On October 26 2011 20:35 leather gracket wrote:
these are really stupid changes...
notice that terran upgrades cost exactly the same as protoss upgrades but..:
the protoss ground armor upgrade upgrades 8 units +1 (worker):
Archon, Colossus, Dark Templar, Sentry, High Templar, Immortal, Probe, Stalker, Zealot
the ground damage upgrades 7 units:
Archon, Colossus, Dark Templar, Sentry, Immortal, Stalker, Zealot.
protoss shields: ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL UNITS AND BUILDINGS
but it's not just the numbers, it's that the unit it ugprades are ALL the units of typical standard protoss army composition.
compare this to terran upgrades:
Infantry Weapons: Ghost, Marauder, Reaper, Marine
Infantry Armor: Ghost, Marauder, Reaper, Marine, SCV.
.. and you can just count this as 3 units, because of reapers.
then terran also needs to ugprade mech just for hellion, tank and thor, and air just for vikings.. and building armor also costs yet another 150/150 upgrade (comparing that shields = building armor for P)
same stuff goes for zerg, but at least the ground armor upgrade is for all ground units
emp? no comment. why doesn't blizzard just remove T from the game?
U mad?
Seriously, I would have agreed to some parts until I read "Terran needs to upgrade mech just for Hellion, Tank & Thor". Hwat? That's all of your mech units o.O
Top 3 Terran QQ.
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How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less...
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On October 26 2011 20:41 trinxified wrote:
How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less...
44% iirc
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On October 26 2011 20:41 trinxified wrote:
How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less...
25% reduction in radius, 44% reduction in area of effect. So it's pretty big.
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On October 26 2011 20:30 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2011 20:00 TheDraken wrote:On October 26 2011 18:21 rEalGuapo wrote:
I still think that Zergs do not use all their abilities. I have seen SO FEW Nydus Networks in SC2. Seriously, you can move your entire army or a part of it ultra fast.
i doubt you play zerg. say blizz required that once you rally a medivac to drop, you can't control it at all. if you rally a drop, it's gonna drop. once you arrive to where you're going to drop, you need to make sure you have a 3x3 space before you sit there for 15 seconds. once your 15 seconds is up, the enemy gets an audio notification "TERRAN IS DROPPING FROM A MEDIVAC" as you unload your first unit. remember, you can't go back, and your medivac doesn't heal at all. if you want to retreat the enemy gets to kill your medivac. if you want to drop with two medivacs, you have to wait 15 seconds after your first medivac waits 15 seconds. or you could build two starports so you can have 2 medivacs at the same time. strange why a zerg would never want that. yeah because you cannot build nydus outside of your opponents base... wait.. srsly you could make runbys way easier and connect bases etc. Or you have a Nydus at his 4th base, to harras the third kinda like a proxy pylon with the possibility to retreat. Later if he moves out you plant another one, so you can attack his siegetank line from the back and the front. Possibilities are almost infinite but you will propably never see that. Plus what is that crap about if you order the drop its gonna drop, you can retreat back through Nydus. And if it gets spotted no one forces you to press "Unload"... Oh and I have played about 300-400 Games as Zerg.
right. because i play against opponents who don't clear airspace around their base and don't watch the minimap. all the time.
the entire premise of the tech relies on the opponent playing poorly, which is horrible game design. i'm not going to waste 100/100 just hoping my enemy won't pull a small group of workers to kill it. the nydus only works when you've either 1.) won the game 2.) have an opponent playing with shit map awareness.
grats on having 300-400 games bro. i've got about 6 times that.
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On October 26 2011 20:41 trinxified wrote:
How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less...
44%. In a zealot ball, about a dozen less get hit than before.
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On October 26 2011 20:41 trinxified wrote:
How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less...
The area of a circle is not calculated like that I'm afraid, it will be pretty much half the size as you can see from people on the previous page.
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On October 26 2011 20:35 leather gracket wrote:
these are really stupid changes...
notice that terran upgrades cost exactly the same as protoss upgrades but..:
the protoss ground armor upgrade upgrades 8 units +1 (worker):
Archon, Colossus, Dark Templar, Sentry, High Templar, Immortal, Probe, Stalker, Zealot
the ground damage upgrades 7 units:
Archon, Colossus, Dark Templar, Sentry, Immortal, Stalker, Zealot.
protoss shields: ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL UNITS AND BUILDINGS
but it's not just the numbers, it's that the unit it ugprades are ALL the units of typical standard protoss army composition.
compare this to terran upgrades:
Infantry Weapons: Ghost, Marauder, Reaper, Marine
Infantry Armor: Ghost, Marauder, Reaper, Marine, SCV.
.. and you can just count this as 3 units, because of reapers.
then terran also needs to ugprade mech just for hellion, tank and thor, and air just for vikings.. and building armor also costs yet another 150/150 upgrade (comparing that shields = building armor for P)
same stuff goes for zerg, but at least the ground armor upgrade is for all ground units
emp? no comment. why doesn't blizzard just remove T from the game?
LOL.. what a clown. I'm not even a protoss player but I just found this post ridiculous.
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On October 26 2011 20:43 Krejven wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2011 20:41 trinxified wrote:
How big is the difference between radius 2 and 1.5? I can't imagine it being that big of a difference... 25% less... The area of a circle is not calculated like that I'm afraid, it will be pretty much half the size as you can see from people on the previous page.
Oh damn really.. sucks to be bad in math. 
Can anyone kindly point me out to the pictures of the radius change?
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Am I the only terran that is having problems in tvp lategame? 3-1-3 protoss feels crazy hard to beat for me. With this patch their grades will be even faster up + emp is much smaller...
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i like the emp change... but I think making all upgrades cheaper is a little bit too much..
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On October 26 2011 20:43 TheDraken wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2011 20:30 rEalGuapo wrote:On October 26 2011 20:00 TheDraken wrote:On October 26 2011 18:21 rEalGuapo wrote:
I still think that Zergs do not use all their abilities. I have seen SO FEW Nydus Networks in SC2. Seriously, you can move your entire army or a part of it ultra fast.
i doubt you play zerg. say blizz required that once you rally a medivac to drop, you can't control it at all. if you rally a drop, it's gonna drop. once you arrive to where you're going to drop, you need to make sure you have a 3x3 space before you sit there for 15 seconds. once your 15 seconds is up, the enemy gets an audio notification "TERRAN IS DROPPING FROM A MEDIVAC" as you unload your first unit. remember, you can't go back, and your medivac doesn't heal at all. if you want to retreat the enemy gets to kill your medivac. if you want to drop with two medivacs, you have to wait 15 seconds after your first medivac waits 15 seconds. or you could build two starports so you can have 2 medivacs at the same time. strange why a zerg would never want that. yeah because you cannot build nydus outside of your opponents base... wait.. srsly you could make runbys way easier and connect bases etc. Or you have a Nydus at his 4th base, to harras the third kinda like a proxy pylon with the possibility to retreat. Later if he moves out you plant another one, so you can attack his siegetank line from the back and the front. Possibilities are almost infinite but you will propably never see that. Plus what is that crap about if you order the drop its gonna drop, you can retreat back through Nydus. And if it gets spotted no one forces you to press "Unload"... Oh and I have played about 300-400 Games as Zerg. right. because i play against opponents who don't clear airspace around their base and don't watch the minimap. all the time. the entire premise of the tech relies on the opponent playing poorly, which is horrible game design. i'm not going to waste 100/100 just hoping my enemy won't pull a small group of workers to kill it. the nydus only works when you've either 1.) won the game 2.) have an opponent playing with shit map awareness. grats on having 300-400 games bro. i've got about 6 times that.
Well Zerg is not my mainrace, I just wanted to have played it to know what I'm talking about/to understand it better.
And playing a lot of games doesn't necessarily give you understanding of the game. I have friends that had like 7k Games in Warcraft 3 and I still would have won without a single unit lost even though I had about the same amount, propably one or two thousend games less.
And:
Please take the time to read my entire post before you comment on it.
Oh and I'm not your "bro", pal!
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On October 26 2011 20:46 Snowbear wrote:
Am I the only terran that is having problems in tvp lategame? 3-1-3 protoss feels crazy hard to beat for me. With this patch their grades will be even faster up + emp is much smaller...
It's been established that TvP is only wonky as far as statistics go in the GSL Code S, so you must be fighting the angry code S finalists who never made it because of their race. (A lot of them also post on teamliquid about the struggles they have because they're protoss)
Na, TvP is hard for me as well :<
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EPT
