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1.4.2 Patch notes PTR - Page 64

Forum Index > SC2 General
2455 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 62 63 64 65 66 123 Next
KDot2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States1213 Posts
October 26 2011 03:41 GMT
#1261
from a spectator standpoint I wish EMP was on the Raven
Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
October 26 2011 03:41 GMT
#1262
wait. is this actually real
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
Pirat6662001
Profile Joined January 2011
Russian Federation949 Posts
October 26 2011 03:44 GMT
#1263
What is Blizzard thinking? Where is the zerg nerf???? +the ghost problem (i'm a terran player) is solved in a wierd way. Why did they ignore or the pleas of zergs? Ghost soft counter Broodlords and ultras with snipe, SO WHY NOT MAKE SNIPE 50% VS MASSIVE? seems like a no brainer that doesnt affect anything besides those two units (cant snipe any other massive), instead they messed up EMP vs infestors
So.. this Earth, nice planet you might say- WRONG!!
jtan_123
Profile Joined June 2011
Australia5 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 03:47:27
October 26 2011 03:44 GMT
#1264
I think people are missing the reason why Protoss are getting these buffs. If you think about it at the highest level pros are able to hit the 1-1, 2-2 and 3-3 upgrades the second they're available. Reducing the costs of the upgrades won't make them come faster. It will only give P's more money to put into their army or into expanding. Logically speaking, it would be going into the army because no idiots gonna expand AND mass upgrade at the same time.

IMO, this buff is just to give P's a bigger army when they're double forging upgrades so they can 'survive' better against Terran timing attacks. Although having said that, only Shields level 1 is cheaper, so really to defend a timing attack (which normally comes at around 10 minutes or even before: 1-1-1, 3 rax stim, etc) you're paying the same for the 1-1 upgrades (200 mins and 200 gas). Which is a bit contradictory.

I guess at the end of the day, Blizzard wants to get P's to go for double forge upgrades and have a bigger army while upgrading. If you think about it, in PvT, Protoss MUST have either a bigger army with better upgrades (uneven food count vs. T), sick forcefields and perfect control (pulling zealots back and letting stalkers and sentries fight) or AOE to beat a Terran army.

Just my opinion though.

Edit: Hell, even at the Master's level players can macro properly and hit upgrades when they're done
Ryder.
Profile Joined January 2011
1117 Posts
October 26 2011 03:47 GMT
#1265
On October 26 2011 11:36 iLike413 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 11:30 The Final Boss wrote:
On October 26 2011 11:25 ImmortalTofu wrote:
On October 26 2011 11:22 The Final Boss wrote:
Now, for all the people talking about "Name a good Korean Protoss" or "Name a good Foreign Terran," I want everybody to try and name something for me. A Macro-Oriented Korean Protoss.

As far as Terrans go, you have players like TOP, TheStC, or Jjakji who consistently go for macro games. I can't think of a Korean Protoss player who looks for macro games often times in PvT, as they usually wind up doing some sort of timing attack, whether it is 1, 2, and very rarely 3 bases. The problem isn't lack of skill, but lack of depth in the play. Korean Protoss players are constantly aggressive--or, at the very least they are overly predictable.


Puzzle, and he got rolled pretty much every single time in PvT everytime due to EMP lategame. MC as well, after his GSL March win, and had alot of success against against Terran, with Puma and Bomber.

MC does Timing attacks in almost every game he plays. He is far from a Macro-Protoss. And Puzzle's PvT has never really impressed me. Maybe it's because he beat MMA with Dark Templar back in Code A and still almost managed to lose those games due to poor control and macro, but I just don't think he really understands the match-ups that well.

But regardless, congrats on naming a single Korean Macro Protoss.


Anyone who says "show me a macro protoss herp derp" doesn't really understand the game.... In late game situations terran has the ability to have a much more massive army than toss because they are running off of almost purely mules.. thats at least 30+ extra supply in army comp. Toss have always relied on timing pushes because they are the weakest macro race...

Yeah I don't understand why naming a macro toss is relevant; players do whatever they think they have the best chance of winning with, so if they are doing timing attacks it is because that's what they think they have the greatest chance of success with, and they sure as hell know better than you. .

Who exactly are you to tell them the reason they are losing is because they don't play macro and instead rely on timing pushes?
LAN-f34r
Profile Joined December 2010
New Zealand2099 Posts
October 26 2011 03:47 GMT
#1266
Good changes, but the weapons upgrade change seems weird. They currently have the same cost and same use from them. Armor and shield upgrades I understand, since they have to get 2 upgrades compared to everyone else's one. But they were level with weapon upgrades.

*shrug* I guess they aren't symmetric races anyway, but it seems that this will put unequal weighting on weapon upgrades, making people go weapon upgrades more than armor or shield.
The only barrier to truth is the presumption that you already have it. It's through our pane (pain) we window (win though).
Link_Drako
Profile Joined April 2011
United States53 Posts
October 26 2011 03:48 GMT
#1267
Well, I am pulling out of this discussion. I wanna leave with one final say.

This game CANNOT be balanced around anyone under a PRO level. If that were the case, we would still see most of the crap we have in the past. Barracks 1st builds an such as an example. They balance around PROs because it's them that can truly use these units and builds. No one copies a build done by a Diamond player or Masters player. No one cares if your Masters. However, if Boxer decides to start using BCs in a build every game, chances are, every good Terran will do the same.

It is ridiculous that these comments have gone from being objective criticism to subjective banter. In all honesty, most of these changes won't even make it into the game. Its in PTR for a reason.
To get smarter, you first have to play a smarter opponent. -Fundamentals of Chess (1883)
Pirat6662001
Profile Joined January 2011
Russian Federation949 Posts
October 26 2011 03:49 GMT
#1268
On October 26 2011 12:47 LAN-f34r wrote:
Good changes, but the weapons upgrade change seems weird. They currently have the same cost and same use from them. Armor and shield upgrades I understand, since they have to get 2 upgrades compared to everyone else's one. But they were level with weapon upgrades.

*shrug* I guess they aren't symmetric races anyway, but it seems that this will put unequal weighting on weapon upgrades, making people go weapon upgrades more than armor or shield.

terrans have 4 ground upgrades, zerg and toss only 3 (plus toss shield affects air)
So.. this Earth, nice planet you might say- WRONG!!
LAN-f34r
Profile Joined December 2010
New Zealand2099 Posts
October 26 2011 03:53 GMT
#1269
On October 26 2011 12:49 Pirat6662001 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 12:47 LAN-f34r wrote:
Good changes, but the weapons upgrade change seems weird. They currently have the same cost and same use from them. Armor and shield upgrades I understand, since they have to get 2 upgrades compared to everyone else's one. But they were level with weapon upgrades.

*shrug* I guess they aren't symmetric races anyway, but it seems that this will put unequal weighting on weapon upgrades, making people go weapon upgrades more than armor or shield.

terrans have 4 ground upgrades, zerg and toss only 3 (plus toss shield affects air)


Terran have two different styles though, bio and mech. They can choose to completely ignore one, but if P goes ground, they have 3 relevant. Zerg also kinda have 2 styles, melee (ie ling bling muta) and range (roach hydra infestor ect).

More to the point, weapon upgrades effect P more than armor do, at least when you compare the effects to other races.
The only barrier to truth is the presumption that you already have it. It's through our pane (pain) we window (win though).
Sabu113
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States11047 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 04:07:36
October 26 2011 03:54 GMT
#1270
+ Show Spoiler +
On October 26 2011 12:37 Shewklad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 26 2011 12:35 Mjolnir wrote:
On October 26 2011 12:21 Shewklad wrote:
I don't really mind these changes(I play Terran). But what annoys me is that I KNOW that people will still complain about Terran being OP every time a Terran wins a tournament.

And while I think it's good that Blizzard are listening to the community, they sometimes do it too much, it's the same in all blizzard games. When they have something that is slightly better, they nerf it down to a sack of shit. And when something is slightly worse then the other races they buff it to infinity. I really hope this isn't going to be the case this time.


I think people bitch about Terran being OP is because they get so goddamn far with really cheap, accessible, rapidly produced units.

Don't get me wrong, I play me a lot of Terran but you can't deny that bio is incredibly powerful. Stim and some scoot 'n shoot is so cost effective it's bonkers. No other race can do that as effectively from the outset to the end of a game - period.

Perhaps these earlier upgrades and reduced EMP radius will level the mid-game playing field.

We shall see.



Yes, yes. I absolutley agree that there are a few things that is favoring Terrans. BUT I'm very, very afraid that blizzard is gonna overdo it, something they've done a looooot of times before.


lol. Emp doesn't rape toss quite as badly. A Spell as good/arguably better (in the context of how the races play out not 1:1) has the same radius as storm. And your caster is still very strong and the rest of your race and your 1/1/1s weren't touched.

and yet your afraid of some apocalypse occurring to terran winrates.

I don't know what universe terran players live in or what kind of handicaps they want Toss to permanently have. Seriously.

Jtan hit the mark I think.

Considering how many terrans have been coasting on the stronger race, I wonder if we see more buffs/nerfs what hte appropriate short-term win ratio for terran should be.

Edit: This is the race that took 6 months to realise how amazing blue flame hellions are and that EMP is amazing. The race of geniuses.
Biomine is a drunken chick who is on industrial strength amphetamines and would just grab your dick and jerk it as hard and violently as she could while screaming 'OMG FUCK ME', because she saw it in a Sasha Grey video ...-Wombat_Ni
jay236
Profile Joined August 2010
29 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 03:58:50
October 26 2011 03:57 GMT
#1271
Just tested the EMP AoE...it's definitely not as effective against fat units (you can probably blanket 2-3 stalkers at max during a reasonable game)...not to say they're useless, I'll probably just make more ghosts.
tutsicockroach
Profile Joined March 2011
United States57 Posts
October 26 2011 03:59 GMT
#1272
THE RISE OF PROTOSS BEGINS NOW
ownage
blobrus
Profile Joined August 2011
4297 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-26 04:01:23
October 26 2011 04:00 GMT
#1273
Seems pretty good. Glad to see they didn't overreact and overnerf or anything, slight tweaks seem to be the best option.
ChaosTerran
Profile Joined August 2011
Austria844 Posts
October 26 2011 04:00 GMT
#1274
So blizzard release their ladder statistics where protoss has a 54% win ratio against terran and then they nerf terran and buff protoss? I don't understand. It's already so hard to beat protoss and now they make it even harder, it's even statistically proven that outside of GSL protoss is the strongest race. If you don't believe me just check the ladder stats or sc2ranks
EricCartman
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada306 Posts
October 26 2011 04:02 GMT
#1275
most redundant patch ever. encouraging the already broken chargelot/archon is the way to go blizz!
tomatriedes
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
New Zealand5356 Posts
October 26 2011 04:02 GMT
#1276
On October 26 2011 12:57 jay236 wrote:
Just tested the EMP AoE...it's definitely not as effective against fat units (you can probably blanket 2-3 stalkers at max during a reasonable game)...not to say they're useless, I'll probably just make more ghosts.


Yeah just make six ghosts instead of four and things won't have changed at all. Not as big a deal as people are trying to make out but definitely a step in the right direction.

(I still think increasing feedback range would have been the better solution though.)
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44271 Posts
October 26 2011 04:02 GMT
#1277
On October 26 2011 12:41 ToguRo wrote:
from a spectator standpoint I wish EMP was on the Raven


Like the science vessels from BW!

On October 26 2011 12:57 jay236 wrote:
Just tested the EMP AoE...it's definitely not as effective against fat units (you can probably blanket 2-3 stalkers at max during a reasonable game)...not to say they're useless, I'll probably just make more ghosts.


Or just not aim at the stalkers
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Ryder.
Profile Joined January 2011
1117 Posts
October 26 2011 04:03 GMT
#1278
On October 26 2011 12:07 XXXSmOke wrote:
I like the emp change and the forge changes good stuff,

but while Blizz seems to be following up on everything they said at blizzcon.....

Wheres my help with dealing with the late game Zealot?????

Im so sick of ppl calling out GSL GSL GSL GSL GSL

TvP at Masters level is unbeliavably hard for those of us who wish to not 1-1-1 every game.

It's coming in HOTS, the battle hellion?
tutsicockroach
Profile Joined March 2011
United States57 Posts
October 26 2011 04:04 GMT
#1279
patch makes sense since protoss upgrades scale the worst amongst the other races.
ownage
iiGreetings
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada563 Posts
October 26 2011 04:04 GMT
#1280
the toss upgrade buff i dont like at all, imo fast ups vs zerg just really really hurt and i don't like that its cheaper, regardless the ghost change i tihnk helps pvt mid game..
Adapt and React I MKP, PartinG, EffOrt ♥
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