|
Hardest
ZZTP
For easiest
PPZT
I feel at low levels the macro of zerg is too tough, and the micro of terran is also too hard, mid level I feel z has the advantage because I'd say there's a low level of micro needed for a lot of zerg styles(outside of muta) a lot of a moving lings, banes, and roaches and hitting F a few dozen times can work every game, and lets the zergs macro a lot easier. At the highest level, I feel the "easier" mechanics of protoss mean that we have had no advantage in that regard since diamond, and we need perfect positioning, and decision making in almost every case to succeed.
|
Pretty much agree. Once you get to diamond/master and everyone's macro is pretty good then you need to start having good micro and timing, and terran is heavily reliant on micro to come out cost efficient. If both players have good macro and they just 1 a into each other terran will lose most of the time.
Terran has good all-ins, but without proper timing and micro against someone with good macro they'll just have enough to hold it off.
At a certain point in GM/pro level I think it switches from zerg to protoss. At the very highest level I'd say protoss, but anything before that I think protoss has it okay.
|
On October 02 2011 17:27 Tanukki wrote:
With T and P it's easier to cheese your way into diamond, so I voted Z hardest for all lower leagues.
Even in higher leagues Z has the least capability to cheese. They are kinda forced to practice their macro game while learning the many contingencies against opponent cheeses. So I voted Z for high leagues as well.
As a zerg who cheesed a good 1/3 of his games to get into diamond, I disagree. Baneling busts, 9pools and roach all-ins are all pretty damn easy to pull off and result in quite a few free BO wins.
Anyway I started as a plat toss and got to diamond eventually but ended up switching to zerg because just about everything was easier after I got somewhat of a handle on the mechanics. At the diamond level zerg is the easiest race imo, army control is easy, production is all on one hotkey so macro is easy, although scouting is pretty difficult compared to toss as no observers or hallucinated phoenix. I do agree with zerg being harder at lower levels as you need more finger-speed to efficiently play zerg.
Also totally agree with terran being hardest at diamond/masters. Terran macro is the hardest and terran army control is def harder than zerg and toss at that level. Although that's just my experience as I'm really bad with terran.
|
Russian Federation304 Posts
On October 02 2011 18:40 Lobber wrote:
Hardest
ZZTP
For easiest
PPZT
my opinion is exactly like your
|
I think this is very hard to impossible to say.
As example, people say zerg is the hardest in bronze/silver (could be), Both the players their reactions are way slower, making it possible that a little muta harrasement kills tons of SCV's. And a Terran wouldnt be able to run/split marines very well, making banelings extremely deadly.
I am pretty sure there are a lot of examples for why every race plays out differently in the lower leagues, but that is exactly the reason why it is impossible to determen what race would be the weakest/hardest to play in league X.
|
So Zerg is more difficult for lower leaguers because the macro is difficult as fuck.
Im not sure that makes Terran difficult at Diamond/Masters
I also dont know what makes Protoss difficult at GM, someone let me know please.
|
Here's my opinion on this poll, most of the lower level stuff is based off of the experiences I have had teaching friends who are trying to get into SC2.
Bronze-Silver: Zerg - Larvae and Drone management are extremely lackluster at this level. The result of not properly managing the core macro mechanics of Zerg is most noticeable at this level since money is generally not an issue (sloppy macro at this level), so larvae will limit the Zerg player a lot.
Gold - Platinum - Protoss - While the other races do fairly well just macroing properly and intelligently attack moving, the forcefields of a Protoss player really determine how far he can go at this stage. Getting familiar with more economically oriented openers starts to occur at this level, and forcefields are essential to successfully execute them. They are also major factors in most engagements throughout the game.
Diamond - Masters: Terran - People have decent mechanics by now. Micro starts to determine how well a player does (in addition to all the other factors of course), and Terran is the most reliant on proper micro, which is a difficult task. How well you can split your marines and manage your tanks factors greatly into many engagements, and the result of the game. Being able to properly execute drops is also essential.
GM - Pro: Protoss - Mechanics are not an issue at this level, if you are at this level you have those down. Decision making generally determines the victor of the game, and Protoss...well, Protoss has been having a couple issues as of late.
|
I am actually a top 15 diamond protoss player and I personally disagree with people saying terran is hardest race to play at this level.90% of my PvT, the Terran is all-ining and I think terran all-ins are too easy to execute compared to the skill u need to have to stop it.
|
I'd say zerg is hardest to play at all levels, with protoss coming on top only towards the very end of the skill spectrum, like GSL.
|
On October 02 2011 19:14 KimJongChill wrote:
I'd say zerg is hardest to play at all levels, with protoss coming on top only towards the very end of the skill spectrum, like GSL.
No at high levels Zerg is pretty much attack move.
Terran or Protoss is harder at high levels imo.
|
I'm a top diamond protoss, and as the polls stand now I completely agree...the races all have differences in difficulty that hit at different times, zerg is hard right away due to the weird timings and with the added resource of larva. Terran is easy at the start, mainly due to campaign and its straight forward style but around the plat-diamond level you run into alot of issues you need to work at. As Protoss I feel as you play and learn you just get better and better until you hit the zergs and terrans that know what they are doing. Don't fall for the tricks or easy win timing pushes. This is where currently protoss is struggling (as seen in gsl etc.) and as the poll is currently saying, it is the most difficult race and the top right now.
|
I feel like terran is the hardest race to play, but the race is stronger once you get good because of so many things you can do.
|
Didn't blizzard release statistics related to this? At least one can extrapolate from that data.
|
Glad TL was pretty objective in these polls. Though I think there is a huge difference between a random NA GM and pro level (korea pro level).
|
I find it funny that people say terran is hardest at masters. I play terran and zerg at masters, and terran is easier to defend cheese and to play vs protoss.
Dont get me started on how easy it is for terran to all in on one base.
|
On October 02 2011 17:54 DertoQq wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 17:46 Elean wrote:
I really don't understand how protoss can be more difficult to play than terran at any level, including pro.
In term of balance, I believe terran is much stronger than protoss, so if you want to win GSL, it will be easier as terran.
But, in term of how difficult it is to reach the top of your race, I really think protoss is the easiest.They have the lowest skill ceiling of all races.
Seriously, is it easier to reach Nestea's level as a zerg or to reach MC's level as a protoss ?
I really don't see anything impressive from pro protoss. So many of them still have all their army in 1 control group...
Protoss is the race that rewards skills the least. In term of balance at pro level, it's a disavantage. But that makes protoss the easiest race to master. chose a fixed skill lvl, let's say... better than everyone in code S. Is is easier to reach it as Terran or as Protoss ?
Depends if your good at TvT or not lmao
|
The question is in itself flawed due to the lack of defining the core expression 'core' and the usage of the blizzard leagues as 'skill levels'.
First you would have decide whether you want to target the ability to win or the rate of improval in play ('cheese' versus 'being good at the game').
Then you should build up more reasonable levels like beginner, irregular and regular (although the term doesn't fit perfectly, the average regular will be better than the average irregular).
And even then it's still nonsense because the game is constantly shifting and all people have different skills and or flaws in different aspects of the game (macro, micro, strategy, tactics etc.) so you won't find a common ground for comparison.
|
At lowest levels it is very easy for a new player to beat a zerg with just about anything and harder for a zerg to put together a viable strategy and good unit compositions. After that zerg still has the most trouble scouting which is basically a design problem that causes even pro zergs to guess many times. Multitasking execution at highest levels is most commonly required for terran, while protoss and zerg can more often have less strategic multitasking even with warp prisms or baneling mines for example, compared to multi-pronged harass that basically all terrans should always do.
So Terran has the highest skill level to exploit and when all races are taken to their extremes in challenge I think Terran both requires and rewards challenging yourself the most. At low levels terran is the safest and has a huge variety of very powerful builds that new players will often lose to. In other words, terran is very easy until you face players who are very good and then you need to be very good as well and in some cases superior to win, but if you excel greatly you can win more even against players with equivalent mechanics.
|
On October 02 2011 19:18 Iroh wrote:
I'm a top diamond protoss, and as the polls stand now I completely agree...the races all have differences in difficulty that hit at different times, zerg is hard right away due to the weird timings and with the added resource of larva. Terran is easy at the start, mainly due to campaign and its straight forward style but around the plat-diamond level you run into alot of issues you need to work at. As Protoss I feel as you play and learn you just get better and better until you hit the zergs and terrans that know what they are doing. Don't fall for the tricks or easy win timing pushes. This is where currently protoss is struggling (as seen in gsl etc.) and as the poll is currently saying, it is the most difficult race and the top right now.
there is a big difference between a race having an hard time due to current trends/meta-game and objectively being the hardest to play.
if you made this poll back when the P was dominating Z and during the MC-era even T, you would have seen a completely different result from the "GM/pro" level on this poll.
i think it's so obvious.. yet so many people seem to fail to see it.
|
I understand why protoss may be difficult. Warpgate favors timing attacks and constant pressure, and sometimes counters. But it's protoss' main weakness too. I mean, you can't macro as easily as the other races while attacking, cause you need to have a pylon in sight,in order to reinforce your army, and you reinforce directly on the field, which eats up your apm and multitask.
Plus, from early to mid game, it's the most micro intensive, and it requires to be more precise than with other races (for example, often bad forcefields = immmediate loss). So, higher is the level, hardest it is to play protoss.
But that's what makes this game so tense and fun: main strengths are also main weaknesses for each race: ( zergs' macro/decision making, terran cost efficiency....)
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
