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Genome852
United States979 Posts
On July 29 2014 00:10 _Epi_ wrote: Wouldnt be unreasonable to have that option at least for unranked matchmaking Problem with that is, protoss players wouldn't be able to find opponents anymore... | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 29 2014 00:51 Genome852 wrote: Problem with that is, protoss players wouldn't be able to find opponents anymore... In seriousness, I doubt that happens. That would mean that noone plays ranked anymore. And even if it does happen, how's that a problem? If people don't think vP (or ZvZ or ...) is not fun and everyone skips on it, at least it would send a message. One that blizzard would probably not even be unhappy about, given that it would be an insanely great method for feedback where to improve the game. | ||
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Pirfiktshon
United States1072 Posts
Mostly because I liked being able to choose my opponent in ICCUP though you eventually had to face your fears. Though they could make the system not a NULL situation where there is no way you could be matched up against the race of your choosing but it just increases or decreases your chance of playing against that race. Let's just be honest if you ever have been in GM trying to find an opponent sometimes can take like 5-6 minutes.... can you imagine if you vetoed one race and that was all that was up it would take forever to find an opponent LOL | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 29 2014 01:55 Pirfiktshon wrote: Its funny you guys are suggesting something I suggested in 2010 when SC 2 came out. Mostly because I liked being able to choose my opponent in ICCUP though you eventually had to face your fears. Though they could make the system not a NULL situation where there is no way you could be matched up against the race of your choosing but it just increases or decreases your chance of playing against that race. Let's just be honest if you ever have been in GM trying to find an opponent sometimes can take like 5-6 minutes.... can you imagine if you vetoed one race and that was all that was up it would take forever to find an opponent LOL In all fairness, I think it makes sense to not be able to choose your matchup in ranked play. After all, we want ranks to be somewhat of a representation of overall skill, not just of 1matchup. But if I don't want to play ZvZ, why force me? I'm just gonna leave the game, even if the chances to get it are tiny. That's what I'm doing in unranked (though not currently because I'm rolling Terran; I'm leaving TvPs and TvTs when I'm not in the mood for them). Loading a game and then leaving is just more frustrating to both players, then just having to wait a little longer to begin with. And again, if you veto and then wonder why you are not getting matched in a short time... | ||
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duckk
United States622 Posts
Or maybe on the load screen have 3 maps, and both players can pick to play on 1, and automatically veto one? Bad spawn catallena 10 games in a row is not even worth wasting time playing. | ||
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learning88
United States160 Posts
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KotaOnCue
United States180 Posts
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learning88
United States160 Posts
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BurningRanger
Germany303 Posts
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Survivor61316
United States470 Posts
On July 29 2014 01:40 Big J wrote: In seriousness, I doubt that happens. That would mean that noone plays ranked anymore. And even if it does happen, how's that a problem? If people don't think vP (or ZvZ or ...) is not fun and everyone skips on it, at least it would send a message. One that blizzard would probably not even be unhappy about, given that it would be an insanely great method for feedback where to improve the game. Hey dont hate on ZvZ, its honestly one of my favorite MUs! Its all about scouting and reacting, not too much coin flipping in it. | ||
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
is tvp actually balanced? I feel there's nothing maru could have done better to win this. bear in mind i'm a shit player but i can't help asking these questions can T play greedier than what maru did? i don't think so, not vs oracle / blink / greedier protoss I think it's a general consensus that T has no late-game answer to all that P has late game. so T does indeed have to win before? maru didn't make ghosts in that game i believe, yet did he ever have the money to? I just feel there was nothing maru could have done in that game to beat zest | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 29 2014 05:48 Survivor61316 wrote: Hey dont hate on ZvZ, its honestly one of my favorite MUs! Its all about scouting and reacting, not too much coin flipping in it. Early game is a mess and midgame is stale. I guess it's actually mechanically great in the midgame if it is roach vs roach and if someone guarantees me that I'd get there somewhat evenly, I'd put up with it. But as is, I have no interest at all playing against the mass zergling, ling/baneling, slightly later LB, slightly earlier LB, early pool, even earlier pool, early pool with speed, early pool with banes all day long. And yes, I think a big part of those strategies do rely on coinflips. There's not a single thing telling me that the 10eggs he starts are zerglings, when I have to decide upon 10lings or drones as well. And I believe people play so retartedly, because they dont want to put up with the matchup and rather just gamble on something. Not to mention that it is the only of my 6matchups that Im sometimes too slow to leave before my opponent has already. (Not quite true. Has happened in TvT once or twice too) WoL ZvZ was a thousand times better. It's the one matchup they really fucked up in HotS. Not that it was amazing to begin with, but roach/hydra/infestor posturing with infestor harass and roach runbies were a more interesting macro style and 2basish infestor builds prevented that you always had to just match each yolo attack with mass units of your own. | ||
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Deleted User 261926
960 Posts
On July 29 2014 06:18 Incognoto wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgSqwToTEA4 is tvp actually balanced? I feel there's nothing maru could have done better to win this. bear in mind i'm a shit player but i can't help asking these questions can T play greedier than what maru did? i don't think so, not vs oracle / blink / greedier protoss I think it's a general consensus that T has no late-game answer to all that P has late game. so T does indeed have to win before? maru didn't make ghosts in that game i believe, yet did he ever have the money to? I just feel there was nothing maru could have done in that game to beat zest Ghost good unit. He would have had money had he gone less marauder heavy. By going heavier on marauders you do well for some time but in the end too many storms will overwhelm you and you'll still need ghosts. | ||
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Salient
United States876 Posts
On July 29 2014 06:18 Incognoto wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgSqwToTEA4 is tvp actually balanced? I feel there's nothing maru could have done better to win this. bear in mind i'm a shit player but i can't help asking these questions can T play greedier than what maru did? i don't think so, not vs oracle / blink / greedier protoss I think it's a general consensus that T has no late-game answer to all that P has late game. so T does indeed have to win before? maru didn't make ghosts in that game i believe, yet did he ever have the money to? I just feel there was nothing maru could have done in that game to beat zest Maru chooses to forgo ghosts and sometimes even vikings in order to put everything into midgame attacks. That often works because he can exploit the extreme midgame power of MMM, but there is a downside. It's almost an "all in" style from a tech prospective. It's his choice to play that way. Taeja plays quite differently. He gets ghosts and vikings and extra CCs while still pressuring. Taeja beat Zest 3-0 last week, even before the recent Terran buff and Toss nerf. That's impressive because Zest is probably the best player in the world. | ||
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Deleted User 261926
960 Posts
On July 29 2014 06:33 Big J wrote: Early game is a mess and midgame is stale. I guess it's actually mechanically great in the midgame if it is roach vs roach and if someone guarantees me that I'd get there somewhat evenly, I'd put up with it. But as is, I have no interest at all playing against the mass zergling, ling/baneling, slightly later LB, slightly earlier LB, early pool, even earlier pool, early pool with speed, early pool with banes all day long. And yes, I think a big part of those strategies do rely on coinflips. There's not a single thing telling me that the 10eggs he starts are zerglings, when I have to decide upon 10lings or drones as well. And I believe people play so retartedly, because they dont want to put up with the matchup and rather just gamble on something. Not to mention that it is the only of my 6matchups that Im sometimes too slow to leave before my opponent has already. (Not quite true. Has happened in TvT once or twice too) WoL ZvZ was a thousand times better. It's the one matchup they really fucked up in HotS. Not that it was amazing to begin with, but roach/hydra/infestor posturing with infestor harass and roach runbies were a more interesting macro style and 2basish infestor builds prevented that you always had to just match each yolo attack with mass units of your own. This is cool and all but you don't take into account that there is a map for the lings to cross. They cross it fast but you can still morph baneling. WoL ZvZ was very very similar apart from the number of mutas and infestor being better in general. Instead of infestor harrass we have burrow roaches so it doesn't change much on that part. The early game was also literally the same just like late game with roach hydra infestor and broodlord if it's possible to do. | ||
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Pewpz
Canada21 Posts
Deleted: someone stated the same thing above. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On July 29 2014 06:18 Incognoto wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgSqwToTEA4 is tvp actually balanced? I feel there's nothing maru could have done better to win this. bear in mind i'm a shit player but i can't help asking these questions can T play greedier than what maru did? i don't think so, not vs oracle / blink / greedier protoss I think it's a general consensus that T has no late-game answer to all that P has late game. so T does indeed have to win before? maru didn't make ghosts in that game i believe, yet did he ever have the money to? I just feel there was nothing maru could have done in that game to beat zest Maru plays a style that's very "allin." It relies on the strength and mobility of mid-game bio to overpower the opponent before he can get enough splash damage. Someone who defends it really well while teching can beat that style, even if on the surface it looks like Maru played a "perfect" game because he was multitasking a lot or what have you. Zest is also one of the best Protosses on the planet. EDIT -salient said the same thing, basically. | ||
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Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
On July 29 2014 06:18 Incognoto wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgSqwToTEA4 is tvp actually balanced? I feel there's nothing maru could have done better to win this. bear in mind i'm a shit player but i can't help asking these questions can T play greedier than what maru did? i don't think so, not vs oracle / blink / greedier protoss I think it's a general consensus that T has no late-game answer to all that P has late game. so T does indeed have to win before? maru didn't make ghosts in that game i believe, yet did he ever have the money to? I just feel there was nothing maru could have done in that game to beat zest Maru didn't make ghost/vikings fast enough, but the game is still BS with Zest having 2k minerals after 10 zealots warpin and stuff. No race should be able to stay alive this long on 2 bases too. He really got outplayed and the only move he did well was placing his stalkers at the good position, but he lost 2 colossis so it evens things out. Maru macro et microed like a god, Zest survived with poor macro and micro, but it was enough to secure his third and thus winning the game because maru commited a lot in the early game. There you have it, the really strong midgame terran. | ||
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LingBlingBling
United States353 Posts
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Dingodile
4132 Posts
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