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PlayXP article on NASL, S2CON situation - Page 12

Forum Index > SC2 General
538 CommentsPost a Reply
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dc302
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia576 Posts
August 14 2011 17:14 GMT
#221
Not looking good for NASL I guess. Still too early to tell what's happening though in my opinion. I hope things get sorted out... I was very disappointed hearing that the koreans were withdrawing from NASL =/
...
EricCartman
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada306 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 17:15:32
August 14 2011 17:15 GMT
#222
All this drama is getting out of hand. Something needs to be done in order to guarantee effective and clear communications between all parties. The longer this goes on, the korean sc2 will be blighted.

Just as more and more folks are turning to sc2 from BW, this drama will have the opposite effect.
Erik.TheRed
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1655 Posts
August 14 2011 17:16 GMT
#223
SC2con denies knowledge...

I think we need to hire Mulder and Scully to get to the bottom of this.
"See you space cowboy"
TDN3
Profile Joined August 2011
United States81 Posts
August 14 2011 17:17 GMT
#224
I think we should stop racing to the forum and blaming on S2con and trying to be the good guy with the early advantage. This is so unprofessional.
BackSideAttack
Profile Joined December 2010
1103 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 17:17:38
August 14 2011 17:17 GMT
#225
sigh NASL really needs to release a neutral statement instead of a biased one blaming people...it's their fault there's been all this drama and miscommunication.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
August 14 2011 17:20 GMT
#226
On August 15 2011 02:05 thanhbao86 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2011 01:56 Doodsmack wrote:
After all this, as well as the EG/Puma issue, I would hope the TL community has learned its lesson about bringing out the pitchforks before hearing both sides of the story. Given the obvious communication issues between Korea and the west, I would hope TL mods do something to mitigate the impact of any future threads similar to Milkis's post on the EG/Puma issue and NASL's post on the present issue.


What do you suggest they do then ?
You realize TL is a community site right (forum) ? Everyone can post what they want. You suggest mods should check every single new post before allow them to be posted (your posts included and I would love to see your reactions when you know mods block your posts). Is that system really the system that you want, ask yourself that question.
Please think before posting, dont just say stuffs like I want ABC without giving real good solutions because those posts are not contributing they are just demanding and we dont want that.



No actually it would be a pretty simple solution - lock the thread after including a mod edit saying this is only one side of the story and the thread will be reopened once the other side has been added.

Notice how I didn't insult you personally when I wrote that? Take this post as an example for your response.
whateverpeeps
Profile Joined August 2011
United States214 Posts
August 14 2011 17:20 GMT
#227
On August 15 2011 02:17 BackSideAttack wrote:
sigh NASL really needs to release a neutral statement instead of a biased one blaming people...it's their fault there's been all this drama and miscommunication.


"biased one blaming people"

Where is this?

Big mistake NASL did was say that SC2Con was involved because they claim they're not (if you want to believe that, maybe they didn't issue an official decision but it definitely seems like they are working behind the scenes).

However, this is due to the fact that whoever came to the decision to boycott NASL has been REFUSING to come forward and speak openly and directly with the NASL, forcing NASL to speak through intermediaries like Mr.Chae and other people.
thebearot
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada6 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 17:22:50
August 14 2011 17:20 GMT
#228
On August 14 2011 23:00 Intricate1 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 14 2011 21:53 NHY wrote:

"It is nonsense to suggest S2CON is blocking [our] participation. If we wanted to participate, we would do so regardless of whatever S2CON's wishes were."

There are rumors that S2CON is blocking korean team's participation in foreign scene. However, it's been confirmed that since their creation in Nov, 2010 S2CON has left the decision of participating in foreign events to each team's discretion and have not interfered in any way in this regard since.

Original article in Korean:
+ Show Spoiler +
NASL 주장, 사실무근으로 확인
- NASL, 협의회 인지(認知) 잘못에 대해 사과
- 이형섭-최윤상 감독, NASL측 주장 사실무근

스타크래프트2 협의회(이하 협의회)가 '이번 NASL 시즌2에 한국 선수 참가 철회가 협의회와는 무관하다'는 입장을 발표했다. 협의회는 공식 홈페이지를 통해 참가 철회로 인한 분쟁은 각 게임단 자체적으로 진행된 내용이라 해명했다. 이어서 협의회는 NASL로부터 공식적인 내용을 전달하거나 받은 적도 없다고 밝혔다.

이 소식을 접한 NASL측은 “한국에서 진행되는 일을 정확하게 알지 못한다. 하지만, 우린 한국팀들의 공통된 결정을 들었고 첫 계약서에는 ‘스타크래프트2 한국 팀 협의회(SC2 Korean Team Committee)’라고 작성되어 있었다. 이후 계약 때에도 이렇게 작성되어 협의회라고 적은 것이다. 만약, 소수 팀들의 결정이었으면 스타2협의회(S2CON)에 사과하고 싶다”며 자신들의 실수에 사과하는 뜻을 내비쳤다.

하지만, 그는 “김승철(FXO소속, sC)와 MVP팀의 소속 선수들이 NASL에 참가하려 하는데 ‘S2CON’이 출전을 막고 있어 당황하고 있다”는 입장을 밝히며 ‘S2CON’가 NASL에 피해를 주고 있다고 주장했다.

이에 PlayXP는 김승철이 소속되어 있는 FXO의 이형섭 감독과 MVP의 최윤상 감독에게 확인해 본 결과 사실 무근인 것으로 확인됐다.

이형섭 감독은 “김승철 선수 본인이 출전하지 않기로 해 철회 한 것”이라며 “NASL 출전과 관련해 S2CON과 그 어떤 논쟁을 벌인 적이 없다”고 밝혔다. 최윤상 감독 또한 “처음부터 NASL에 출전할 의사가 없었는데 이런 말을 듣게 되어 황당하다. 형제 팀인 ‘compLexity’로부터 NASL 출전 제안을 받은 것은 사실이나, 팀 사정상 힘들어 정중히 거절했다, 또 이 제안은 한국 팀들의 출전 철회 후 온 것이고 NASL로부터 직접적인 교섭은 없었다”고 밝혔다. ‘S2CON’의 참가 저지에 대한 질문에는 “만약, 우리가 출전하고 싶었다면 협의회 의사와는 무관하게 출전할 수 있는데 출전을 저지한다니 웃기는 소리다”며 NASL측의 주장을 반박하기도 했다.

한편, 일각에선 ‘S2CON’이 국내 팀의 해외 진출을 막고 있는 것이란 설이 일고 있지만, S2CON은 지난 해 11월 발족 당시부터 해외 대회 출전 여부는 팀 자율에 맡겼으며 그에 따른 부분에 대해 관여한 바가 전혀 없는 것으로 확인 됐다.

글: 안영훈(ethan@playxp.com)



So Based on this we are lead to believe that oGs, Startale, WeMadeFox, TSL, and Prime each decided independently, came to the same conclusion and not one thought to pass that decision over to the NASL?

I mean it could be the NASL yeah, but why would they respond like they did, citing the money issues and attacking them like that, in this case in more inclined to believe in the NASL's "truth" to the story


^-- THIS
This actually looks like sanctions and/or union strike. And the ones doing this are lying when they say they are acting independently. How can they all agreed upon something like this all together and not only that, intentionally failed to obey the signed contract? It's the same as "Give us more money or we all go on strike" sorta stuff. Bullies?? :O
Mithriel
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands2969 Posts
August 14 2011 17:22 GMT
#229
On August 15 2011 02:16 Erik.TheRed wrote:
SC2con denies knowledge...

I think we need to hire Mulder and Scully to get to the bottom of this.


haha, i laughed, mainly because i just watched 7 x-files episodes in a row. x-files marathons ftw!!!!

There is no shame in defeat so long as the spirit is unconquered. | Cheering for Maru, Innovation and MMA!
Doso
Profile Joined March 2008
Germany769 Posts
August 14 2011 17:23 GMT
#230
Yo Koreans, if you don't want to play in our leagues that's fine. But don't expect us to play in yours (GSL) either, hokay?
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
August 14 2011 17:24 GMT
#231
On August 15 2011 02:09 BaLoO- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2011 01:59 Doodsmack wrote:
On August 15 2011 01:54 BaLoO- wrote:
This is very very strange to be honest. I don't get why the NASL staff would have made such a statement if it was baseless, give a justification for korean teams to leave ? Telling the truth would have been more or less the same ... And they would certainly not have continued further after a first lie proven wrong ... I also don't get why players like sC who played a full tournament to be in the next season would have changed their minds, furthermore after the finals which went pretty well for the koreans.

We'll probably never know the truth, but I fear that the SC2Con already took the power over the whole SC2 in Korea ...



You clearly have not read very much of the various threads here because 1) Xeris wasn't "lying", there was simply a miscommunication issue, and 2) SC2Con wasn't exerting control over the Korean teams. Basically your entire post has already been debunked.


I didn't say they were lying, and I didn't say SC2Con was exerting control. I said I wouldn't see the point for the NASL staff to tell something wrong (i.e. lie), which is the case if they never had any contact with the MVP team and someone related to sC. Yes it is possible that someone said they were these representatives but weren't, but it is in no way more likely than another explication. Second, i said I feared that the SC2Con could make pressure, I've nothing to argue on it beside some strange facts, so I just gave a possibility which is absolutely not "debunked" by someone who didn't even read what I wrote. And after my post, you can read all other posts pointing others strange things. There is miscommunication, and there is tricky things. Once again, we'll probably never know the truth, but that's kinda worrying.



"I didn't say they were lying"

On August 15 2011 01:54 BaLoO- wrote:
... And they would certainly not have continued further after a first lie proven wrong ...


"I didn't say SC2Con was exerting control"

On August 15 2011 01:54 BaLoO- wrote:
I fear that the SC2Con already took the power over the whole SC2 in Korea ...




lol?
Ansinjunger
Profile Joined November 2010
United States2451 Posts
August 14 2011 17:25 GMT
#232
This is more confusing than the Xenosaga storyline.

I will be glad to see what top players NASL manages to retain.
Imres
Profile Joined March 2011
515 Posts
August 14 2011 17:26 GMT
#233
On August 15 2011 02:23 Doso wrote:
Yo Koreans, if you don't want to play in our leagues that's fine. But don't expect us to play in yours (GSL) either, hokay?


... Why being so dumb ?
tiaz
Profile Joined December 2010
Sweden231 Posts
August 14 2011 17:27 GMT
#234
In the recent weeks different "dramas" I've personally sided pretty much all the time with the "korean" standpoint. I must say tho, that signing contracts and not fulfilling them and leaving when the season has started, is a pretty shitty way to go about things..
Also it really seems like there are huge holes in the communication. Either that, or someone is lying.
I kinda liked NASL and wish them good luck whatever the outcome may be.
"When you play, you have to start off with a mind to turn the game into a rape." - Iloveoov
Like a Boss
Profile Joined January 2011
502 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 17:31:44
August 14 2011 17:27 GMT
#235
GSL and NASL are actually direct competitions, they both want your money, and sponsorship money. NASL in all aspects can out compete GSL except for the korean players. The only way for GSL to stay on top of NASL is to not let their korean players play in NASL.

NASL>GSL>SC2CON>NASL>GSL....


As of right now GSL and SC2Con are working together hence:

GSL= SC2CON> NASL
chipmonklord17
Profile Joined February 2011
United States11944 Posts
August 14 2011 17:27 GMT
#236
On August 15 2011 02:23 Doso wrote:
Yo Koreans, if you don't want to play in our leagues that's fine. But don't expect us to play in yours (GSL) either, hokay?


That almost makes it sound like we'd MAKE it more than a round...
Dr.Sin
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada1126 Posts
August 14 2011 17:29 GMT
#237
On August 15 2011 02:20 thebearot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 14 2011 23:00 Intricate1 wrote:

So Based on this we are lead to believe that oGs, Startale, WeMadeFox, TSL, and Prime each decided independently, came to the same conclusion and not one thought to pass that decision over to the NASL?

I mean it could be the NASL yeah, but why would they respond like they did, citing the money issues and attacking them like that, in this case in more inclined to believe in the NASL's "truth" to the story


^-- THIS
This actually looks like sanctions and/or union strike. And the ones doing this are lying when they say they are acting independently. How can they all agreed upon something like this all together and not only that, intentionally failed to obey the signed contract? It's the same as "Give us more money or we all go on strike" sorta stuff. Bullies?? :O


This is exactly why the Korean teams' story doesn't hold up. If all members of the sc2con act in unison, its silly to say that sc2con isn't responsible. The guys running sc2con are the very people that run the teams themselves.
TriZen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England219 Posts
August 14 2011 17:30 GMT
#238
On August 15 2011 02:12 Milkis wrote:
Someone needed to be photobombed. It was justified. Please don't make drama out of that fact


Lmao XD Oh well, I think all this 'drama' will have calmed down in a year. Games growing stupidly fast and with it will obviously be a period of well, this.
marxgarza
Profile Joined January 2011
United States373 Posts
August 14 2011 17:30 GMT
#239
I'm so confused as to what the hell is going on in the korean scene as of late
Silence is golden, duct tape is silver
skipgamer
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Australia701 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 17:33:43
August 14 2011 17:32 GMT
#240
*cue circus theme*
+ Show Spoiler +


This whole situation is a shame considering how strong the relationship between the Korean and foreign e-sports scenes has been thus far since Starcraft 2.

I think it's even more of a shame that this has all played out on the forums as it has. Or perhaps, TeamLiquid IS serious business. *shrug*?
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