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Ladder points in season 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
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MaXn00bPwNeR
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark12 Posts
July 28 2011 13:22 GMT
#1
I have been wondering how some get so much ladder points despite having a lower W/L ratio. in the beginning of the season.
Check out the screenshot...
[image loading]
[image loading]
It seems that some start with a large bonus pool? Thus getting much more ladder points when winning matches.
Anyone knowing why would be great to know! ^^
darcevader88
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada648 Posts
July 28 2011 13:23 GMT
#2
probably got promoted? no one should have much bonus pool yet
"The ground is my ocean, I'm the shark and most people don't even know how to swim."
Dephy
Profile Joined January 2011
Lithuania163 Posts
July 28 2011 13:23 GMT
#3
they playing higher mmr players, thus getting more points pretty simple..
pingy[wen]
Profile Joined June 2010
United States157 Posts
July 28 2011 13:25 GMT
#4
On July 28 2011 22:23 Dephy wrote:
they playing higher mmr players, thus getting more points pretty simple..


playing higher MMR players and winning.
JoelE
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States112 Posts
July 28 2011 13:25 GMT
#5
People with higher MMR will play matches where the other person is always slightly favored. This happens because the rating system compares your points to your opponents MMR to determine favored. For top players, their points lag behind their mmr, so both players see slightly favored. This means more points for a win and less for a loss, so they can get way more points quickly.
http://www.firecaster.com
Jochan
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Poland1730 Posts
July 28 2011 13:26 GMT
#6
Their match history would be more appropriate, explanation can be very simple. They've lost their first games, and as ladder does not allow negative numbers they couldn't dip below 0 points.
"(...)all in the game, yo. All in the game"
Rachnar
Profile Joined October 2010
France1526 Posts
July 28 2011 13:26 GMT
#7
everyone played against in the beggining of a season is favored ... we already learned that from season 2...
"What if it's a triple DK ?" "Then we cry" "Prepare your handkerchief then ..."
GreEny K
Profile Joined February 2008
Germany7312 Posts
July 28 2011 13:30 GMT
#8
You should just look at their match history and see how many points they're getting for their wins and how many they're losing for their losses.
Why would you ever choose failure, when success is an option.
shannn
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands2891 Posts
July 28 2011 13:32 GMT
#9
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=195273

It's answered here and by the comments above me.
Players from season 2 who has high MMR will lose less points when they lose and gain more points when they win compared to someone with lower MMR.

So basically you will see this from players at the top of masters / grand masters who can go 10-20 and still end up at 300 points (just exaggerating but making a point here).

And this also works the other way which in your case you have already experienced. Like you have 25-15 but only end up at 150 points.

The MMR makes the big difference
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=6321864 Epic post.
MaXn00bPwNeR
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark12 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-28 13:34:44
July 28 2011 13:32 GMT
#10
Okay, thanks guys, was just wondering
I tried to search for similar topics but i couldn't find any, so i thought it wouldn't hurt to just post and ask the folks ^^
My first topic to post on TL Forums btw :D
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
July 28 2011 13:33 GMT
#11
When you find that their points don't even match their history, they were promoted at the very beginning (but not in the placement match) - that gives you 73 points to start with, and with the point amouonts so small as they are, it can skew the rankings a lot.

If you care about rankings, promotion (or demotion) on the second match of the season is the best thing that can ever happen to you. but it will eventually even out later on.
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
GxZ
Profile Joined April 2010
United States375 Posts
July 28 2011 13:35 GMT
#12
You don't lose as many points now.
Binabik
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany686 Posts
July 28 2011 13:35 GMT
#13
It's about your mmr
Blizzard wants to have their old GM players high ranked because then it will look legit that they become GM again.
I have a very high MMR and every opponent I play against is "favored" and gives me +20 and -1 points.
Kerm
Profile Joined April 2010
France467 Posts
July 28 2011 13:38 GMT
#14
It's your name, the longer, the most points you get

Just kidding, obviously MMR, are everyone already stated ^^
What i know is that I know nothing - [http://twitter.com/UncleKerm]
Sqq
Profile Joined August 2010
Norway2023 Posts
July 28 2011 13:38 GMT
#15
worst nick ever :p
Dead girls don't say no.
MaXn00bPwNeR
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark12 Posts
July 28 2011 13:43 GMT
#16
Here we go again with my nick like in other forums ;P
I don't know, I just got stuck with it since cs and I couldn't find a new suitable nick for me, unless you guys know a good one >.<
I have the option to change my nick on sc2 :-)
pallad
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland1958 Posts
July 28 2011 13:46 GMT
#17
Its normal im in diamond in seson 3 , and i get 15-20 pts for win (whitout any bonus pool) , and lose 1-7 pts for lose , i play mostly favored players.
SC 2 -LingsLover- EU -- Jaedong , NesTea , Nerchio , DRG , Moon , Oz , Tarson , Scarlett -- Dota 2 Pallad EU- NaVi - LGD
DooMDash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1015 Posts
July 28 2011 13:48 GMT
#18
I don't get how you guys have such high win ratios. I am like 28-27 . I guess being 300+ is the pay off but I want a nice win ratio some day hah.
S1 3500+ Master T. S2 1600+ Master T.
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-28 13:53:51
July 28 2011 13:51 GMT
#19
--- Nuked ---
kedinik
Profile Joined September 2010
United States352 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-28 13:54:41
July 28 2011 13:54 GMT
#20
Everyone plays favored enemies and gets lots of points for wins and few points for losses until their points get closer to their MMR and the MMR of their opponents.
Tantaburs
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada1825 Posts
July 28 2011 13:55 GMT
#21
Its not so much that they are playing people with a higher MMR then them its that they have a high MMR.

If i recall correctly if 2 people have an MMR of 1500 and a point value of 0 then they will both appear favoured against one another.

Correct me if im wrong but i think thats how it works
"One cannot play StarCraft with clenched fish.." ~Nick "Confucius" Plott
MaXn00bPwNeR
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark12 Posts
July 28 2011 14:00 GMT
#22
Now I realize how bad the ladder points system works >.<
goswser
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3546 Posts
July 28 2011 14:00 GMT
#23
I lost a game the other day and lost 0 points :p, usually I only lose 1, so right now W/L ratio really isn't important.
say you were born into a jungle indian tribe where food was scarce...would you run around from teepee to teepee stealing meat scraps after a day lazying around doing nothing except warming urself by a fire that you didn't even make yourself? -rekrul
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
July 28 2011 14:02 GMT
#24
--- Nuked ---
JonSki
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom126 Posts
July 28 2011 14:07 GMT
#25
Surely they are just playing favored oppenents probably promoted thus playing favored and slightly favored opponents im only saying this beacvsu i dont know how the MMR system works but if you were in masters season 2 and retained it in season 3 then you will not be playing said players unlike someone that was plat season 2 and now masters who would play said opponents

Tell me if im wrong though :D
"Keep St. George in my heart keep me English"
MaXn00bPwNeR
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark12 Posts
July 28 2011 14:13 GMT
#26
Just a fun little pole i made just to see how many people gains more ladder points than others ^^
Poll: More ladder points gained from winning than when losing points?

Yes, I gain much more ladder points when i win (5)
 
63%

No, I gain and lose points quite equally (3)
 
38%

Sometimes, it depends... (0)
 
0%

I somehow don't get much points when winning (0)
 
0%

8 total votes

Your vote: More ladder points gained from winning than when losing points?

(Vote): Yes, I gain much more ladder points when i win
(Vote): No, I gain and lose points quite equally
(Vote): Sometimes, it depends...
(Vote): I somehow don't get much points when winning

Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-28 14:18:01
July 28 2011 14:17 GMT
#27
at the beginning of the season for higher mmr players it's just wins*24 +/- 24

You can go w/l/w/l/w/l and you'll have 48 points because the first win doesn't count for points, only the placement. On the other hand, if you go l/w/l/wl/w, you will have 72 points but you'll still be 3-3. I'm not sure how long it will be till you start losing points for losses with high mmr. I'm guessing around 300-400 points you'll start losing 1-2 instead of 0, maybe more points than 300-400 though.

edit: less bonus pool ofc
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
Wolf
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Korea (South)3290 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-28 14:26:14
July 28 2011 14:23 GMT
#28
My Taiwanese account was COMPLETELY reset with the merge. I played against Gold leaguers in my placements and 5-0'd into Diamond league. What happened to my GrandMaster MMR? I mean, sure Gold League in Korea is like Diamond/low Master NA, but... =_=

Edit: Wrong thread
Commentatorhttp://twitter.com/proxywolf
TL+ Member
Kairos~
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada129 Posts
July 28 2011 14:26 GMT
#29
On July 28 2011 22:23 darcevader88 wrote:
probably got promoted? no one should have much bonus pool yet

I got promoted and only had 9 bonus pool, so no.
Huge EG Fan Right Here ^
shannn
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands2891 Posts
July 28 2011 14:30 GMT
#30
Just going to requote my previous post

On July 28 2011 22:32 shannn wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=195273

It's answered here and by the comments above me.
Players from season 2 who has high MMR will lose less points when they lose and gain more points when they win compared to someone with lower MMR.

So basically you will see this from players at the top of masters / grand masters who can go 10-20 and still end up at 300 points (just exaggerating but making a point here).

And this also works the other way which in your case you have already experienced. Like you have 25-15 but only end up at 150 points.

The MMR makes the big difference


The top masters/grand masters will lose only few points for a loss untill their points reaches closer to their mmr.
For newly promoted Masters they will most likely already be at their MMR so they will already be getting even matches or at the least faster than say season 2 high masters / gm's.

The system is just rewarding high masters / grand masters because of their high MMR in comparison to the low league players in the previous season I like it tbh as those players put in a lot of effort to get up there at masters/grand masters. Would totally be unfair if everything would reset.

It's only messed up for the players who merged with the servers like the ru / tw / la players cuz they got everything reset (like Wolf has stated).
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=6321864 Epic post.
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