• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 00:26
CEST 06:26
KST 13:26
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League32Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.164Rollback Netcode in Brood War1295.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 202624Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0
StarCraft 2
General
No more sc2 streamers on team liquid? Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.16 Server Blocker SCII needs to put more weight on strategy and tact Terran AddOns placement
Tourneys
RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) $3,500 WardiTV Not-Summer Championship
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
[Megathread] Daily Funny Videos BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Rollback Netcode in Brood War Hands of Pluto Mineral gathering rate (boosted) for each patch
Tourneys
[ASL22] Grand Finals [$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
MLB/Baseball 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
The Link Between Gaming and …
TrAiDoS
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 10146 users

Season 3 Ladder Map Changes (Official) - Page 43

Forum Index > SC2 General
1106 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 41 42 43 44 45 56 Next
ThaSlayer
Profile Joined March 2011
707 Posts
July 26 2011 13:13 GMT
#841
Seems blizzard is trying too hard to appease bronzeys and silveys
Baum
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany1010 Posts
July 26 2011 13:13 GMT
#842
I agree with Metal being taken out. Despite my doubt about the new maps I think there is a slight chance that the map pool has gotten better since they have only taken out very bad maps.

On a sidenote, I love how they recycled their 1on1 maps as new ffa maps instead of making proper ffa maps. -.-
I want to be with those who share secret things or else alone.
Tuczniak
Profile Joined September 2010
1561 Posts
July 26 2011 13:17 GMT
#843
I don't like the whole idea of maps returning to ladder.
Although i would miss Metalopolis, reunion would be kinda awkward.

And it's so funny reading comments about balance.

And be able to tell something from statistical data very hard in these situations.
vrok
Profile Joined August 2009
Sweden2541 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 13:19:53
July 26 2011 13:17 GMT
#844
On July 26 2011 22:11 Phaded wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2011 22:06 vrok wrote:
Good morning Mr Noob fuck. TLPD stats don't lie. Metalopolis isn't a zerg favored map at the highest level so Blizzard's argument about that was plain wrong. My post detailed why their 'high level' ladder stats are irrelevant compared to TLPD. If zerg is OP or not overall is completely irrelevant. Even if zerg is OP, it only further proves that Metalopolis is indeed not zerg favored.

To be fair, Blizzard is balancing ladder by looking at ladder stats. TLPD is irrelevant. It simply means the map is balanced for tournament use. Nobody has the statistics for the imbalances on ladder except Blizzard, so we can either take their word for it and accept it, or create conspiracy theories.

Metalopolis is balanced in tournament play. Blizzard states that metalopolis is not balanced for ladder play and removes it.

That's all we can conclude from this

That's true, but I would rather be of the viewpoint that the ladder itself is irrelevant. Which it is. Especially when they specified that the stats were from 'higher levels' of play.
"Starcraft 2 very easy game" - White-Ra
AXygnus
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Portugal1008 Posts
July 26 2011 13:18 GMT
#845
>taking out Metalopolis

Oh boy, here we go.
"To create, to recreate. To create, to recreate. Down to the last seed, I stand with a dark stare. Still silent. Still frighteningly silent."
Glenwoodian
Profile Joined October 2010
United States28 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 13:23:48
July 26 2011 13:20 GMT
#846
is it bad that i'm getting emotional over metalopolis being taken out....
But i believe, Aang can save the world
Everhate
Profile Joined September 2010
United States640 Posts
July 26 2011 13:21 GMT
#847
Wish they'd picked Backwater instead of Meta, but I don't think it's such a huge deal.

Mostly relieved that they FINALLY got rid of delta...actually the non-meta maps they removed are almost always maps i had veto'd, so this may turn out to be a better map pool overall for me, just kinda depends on how some of the new ones play out.
Exstasy
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom393 Posts
July 26 2011 13:24 GMT
#848
Why are they reducing the sizes of the 2v2 and 3v3 pools?
it always felt like i was playing on Redstone or Kheydarin
now there is less choice =/
Checkered
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia14 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 13:40:36
July 26 2011 13:36 GMT
#849
As z, Metalopolis going out and Backwater gulch remaining hurts, but we should also be talking about the new maps.

As a disclaimer: pretty much every map I see I find it a lot easier to see how terran or toss could manipulate the terrain against me rather than using it to my slimy short range zerg advantage, I don't like the way early zerg tech interacts with the environment.

These new maps are very bad for zerg in my opinion, but at the same time I'm not sure if their flaws will show up in a win/loss ratio because the maps balance will change very substantially with spawn positions.

If I spawn crossmap searing crater vs T then I think I will be fairly happy. If I spawn on the same side of the map, it is much worse than steppes of war. 2 narrow chokes, a 5 second walk with any mobile army, and a gold expansion lie between each natural. This'll also be really bad for PvT I'd assume.

Getting a 3rd base as zerg on abyssal caverns when spawning close by ground will either be very vulnerable to harrass, or in the main line of any pushes coming your way, yet, if I'm crossmap I think it'll be fairly imba for zerg with an easy 3rd and a large path to counter attack.

Antiga Shipyard, depending on spawn location your 3rd base will be very hard to get or extremely easy.

Maps aren't everything to sc2, I think this game is balanced enough that usually a superior player will end up winning despite positions. But playing gambling with the maps as to whether it'll be a game I will enjoy or a game where I'll be cramped and paranoid regardless of the enemy's skill is not my idea of fun gaming.

I think overall, because of randomised spawn locations the maps might show more balanced statistics, with a bit of a bigger edge for higher level terrans, so maybe blizzard is going about their job of trying to balance the game, tvz is a tough matchup to be good in. But I think the new maps will be balanced the way scissors paper rock is balanced. Spawn positions will be too important.

Also, the new xelnaga towers on these maps (except on nerazim crypt) do not cover the move out areas unless you're cross map, making them much less effective scouting against cheese and early attacks, you have to have a unit at their ramp or natural entrance, which makes early cheese scouting a fair bit more difficult imo.

TL:DR: The new maps, close spawn will favour terran and toss or terran vs toss too much, cross map spawn will favour zerg. Win ratio balance may be achieved, but the maps won't be fun.
Giku
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands368 Posts
July 26 2011 13:39 GMT
#850
On July 26 2011 06:16 Zoia wrote:
Show nested quote +
The following changes are being made to the ladder map pool when Season 3 begins on Tuesday, July 26:
2v2

3v3

4v4

Since everyone is discussing 1v1, here goes the rest:
2v2
Omega Sector already isn't part of the pool atm in Europe(no patch yet) and I can't remember playing it either on the ladder
The rest in 2v2 are good decisions though!

3v3
Once again, Quicksand not in the Map pool anyways
I like the fact they removed Colony 426, but Frontier should've been kicked as well, I like Typhon, but I guess I can miss that.

4v4
Finally removed Megaton, if you had that in the map pool you always seemed to be playing it for some reason. Awfull map as well.
High ground was a decent map though, had some nice backdoors and stuff.
They should've kicked Toxic Slums or Lava Flow though, horrible maps.

Let the music be the fuse that'll spark my soul
sidesprang
Profile Joined January 2009
Norway1033 Posts
July 26 2011 13:43 GMT
#851
Don't really see the big problem with taking out metalopolis, its been on ladder since the start of beta(as far as i can remember) and some change is good in my oppinion. Even tho it was a kickass map and will be remember as such
Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee.
DeflowSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Sweden76 Posts
July 26 2011 13:44 GMT
#852
No no NO why metalopolis?! It's the best map when you don't spawn close pos for christ sakes.
Loose and Learn
BoxedLunch
Profile Joined January 2011
United States387 Posts
July 26 2011 13:48 GMT
#853
blizzard's stubbornness towards removing close spawns must have boiled over. on the bright side, I can just veto shattered and never have to deal with close spawns again. I'll probably only use one veto this season though. backwater is still trash
In theory, practice and theory are the same. In practice, they are not
EmilA
Profile Joined October 2010
Denmark4618 Posts
July 26 2011 13:50 GMT
#854
On July 26 2011 22:44 DeflowSC2 wrote:
No no NO why metalopolis?! It's the best map when you don't spawn close pos for christ sakes.


Precisely, that's why it was taken out.
http://dotabuff.com/players/122305951 playing other games
pallad
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland1958 Posts
July 26 2011 13:50 GMT
#855
On July 26 2011 22:13 ThaSlayer wrote:
Seems blizzard is trying too hard to appease bronzeys and silveys


And why you think that way ? because they removed one good map ?
Maby new maps will be ok to , you must play them , not only see screen shots .
SC 2 -LingsLover- EU -- Jaedong , NesTea , Nerchio , DRG , Moon , Oz , Tarson , Scarlett -- Dota 2 Pallad EU- NaVi - LGD
DooMDash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1015 Posts
July 26 2011 13:51 GMT
#856
On July 26 2011 22:13 ThaSlayer wrote:
Seems blizzard is trying too hard to appease bronzeys and silveys

I'm masters and I love blizzards current direction.
S1 3500+ Master T. S2 1600+ Master T.
bunnymuncher
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada112 Posts
July 26 2011 13:57 GMT
#857
The game changes for the better. I trust that blizzard will continue this game along the right path. I will miss my auto-win BF hellion drops on scrap station though
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
July 26 2011 14:03 GMT
#858
On July 26 2011 22:17 vrok wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2011 22:11 Phaded wrote:
On July 26 2011 22:06 vrok wrote:
Good morning Mr Noob fuck. TLPD stats don't lie. Metalopolis isn't a zerg favored map at the highest level so Blizzard's argument about that was plain wrong. My post detailed why their 'high level' ladder stats are irrelevant compared to TLPD. If zerg is OP or not overall is completely irrelevant. Even if zerg is OP, it only further proves that Metalopolis is indeed not zerg favored.

To be fair, Blizzard is balancing ladder by looking at ladder stats. TLPD is irrelevant. It simply means the map is balanced for tournament use. Nobody has the statistics for the imbalances on ladder except Blizzard, so we can either take their word for it and accept it, or create conspiracy theories.

Metalopolis is balanced in tournament play. Blizzard states that metalopolis is not balanced for ladder play and removes it.

That's all we can conclude from this

That's true, but I would rather be of the viewpoint that the ladder itself is irrelevant. Which it is. Especially when they specified that the stats were from 'higher levels' of play.

Well, if the imbalances are specifically from ladder and if it actually does happen to be a 60% favor for one race after a TON of samples, then I'd say it is pretty relevant considering it is well.... ladder. It's not like they're changing tournament maps after all.

I'm wondering which ladders they are looking at though. If you go from GM to GM on different servers I would say the statistics would be skewed quite differently, but I feel like they're taking only samples from 1 server and then applying the changes to all servers.
eits
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States210 Posts
July 26 2011 14:08 GMT
#859
Meta was a good map as long as you didn't get close positions of course, wish they could of just fixed that and possibly left it in there. Thank god delta and scrap were taken out though.
Syntac
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39 Posts
July 26 2011 14:13 GMT
#860
The changes to the map pool excluding the trauma I've experienced so far on Inferno Crater are good. I even agree with a revamp of meta in the future and the reasons listed for its removal seem good enough.

Blizzard's direction in map making is getting better and better, let's hope we see the complete removal of close spawns season four and perhaps a new 2 player map in the next pool.
Prev 1 41 42 43 44 45 56 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
08:00
Continental Nation League S1
Liquipedia
BSL Open Qualifier
04:00
Pro & Gosu - Last Chance #2
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
NeuroSwarm 186
Nina 0
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3028
GuemChi 1626
ProTech117
Aegong 58
Icarus 6
League of Legends
JimRising 764
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox822
Other Games
summit1g8099
WinterStarcraft480
PiGStarcraft286
Livibee188
RuFF_SC241
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick703
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH231
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota236
League of Legends
• Scarra1217
• Rush1080
• Lourlo924
• Stunt237
Other Games
• Shiphtur693
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Weekly
6h 34m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 6h
PiGosaur Cup
1d 19h
The PondCast
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
3 days
FEL
5 days
FEL
6 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 22
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
IPSL Winter 2026-27
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Acropolis #5 - GSC
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.