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On July 12 2011 08:46 Ownos wrote:
Plus the open qualifiers being able to go to playoffs is just off. Everyone knows about Ret's situation. It really highlights the problem. Spend 3 months and lose to a guy who qualified in a 2 day tournament. Not to take anything away from Puma. Open tournament wasn't needed. You should've rewarded the actual players who participated in the bulk of your season. So what's the point in investing watching the regular season and rooting for those players when there is a possibility (and it happened) that most of the open qualifiers would destroy everyone who played in the regular season. Knowing this shortcut to the playoffs, why would anyone want to play out the regular season? If you want to inject new players, do it next season, not insert them into the playoffs.
Their format is bad but not because of the open tournament. Getting the most skilled players into the finals isn't a bad thing. Make sure the stable of players in the regular season is filled with highly skilled people and an open tournament wouldn't be necessary (although I think it still might be a good idea). As for Ret, think of it another way. Puma wins the open, flies to the US, and if Ret had won Puma would be out after playing a single game after coming all that way. That's a pretty big problem right there. There's problems with format, the open tournament is not one of them.
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I think its wise of geoff to get out while he can, i dont know why, but i was losing a lot of my fan boyism for him the longer he was casting for NASL, he was a god on SotG, and is an awesome player, NASL really wasnt for him.
Also Gretorp should go back to playing, he was actually a really good player when he was playing 100%, but now he is an average player and an average caster =/
Also, 9 weeks is too long for regular season. i just dont care enough. They are risking it becoming like a "who a support" thing if they do that, like who watches every NFL game? you watch the team you support, and maybe a top team clash, but you dont watch every match. While something like the GSL, i watch every game i can, the elimation is what makes it exciting i think, while with NASL, ill watch nony and idra and thats about it
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On July 12 2011 08:50 reisada wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 08:48 BryanSC wrote:On July 12 2011 08:41 reisada wrote:
so you prefer to see better organization and worst games then better games and worst( although not that worst) organization? It's not GSL's fault that their Code S finals have been terrible, just as it's not to NASL's credit that MC vs. Puma turned out to be a great finals. the thing is that doesnt matter! what matters is what are the games you get. even if thats not nasl credit
Fair enough, to each his own. Production value, VODs, etc. might not matter to you but for many it does.
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Hmmm. so far a resubscription rate of 38%.
Not horrible, but not good.
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Amazing production value for such a long tournament with sooooooo many games, if this season is anything like the first, it will definitely have been money well spent.
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On July 12 2011 08:46 Ownos wrote:Did not buy since I wouldn't watch. Just too many games so it's not worth it for me. $25 for the live event I was happy to pay for and go to. Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 08:29 BryanSC wrote:
Bought Season 1, will not be buying Season 2 for a number of reasons.
Most suggestions made seem to be going over NASL's head. For the longest time, complaints were made over audio, and they still had issues both with their stream and their live event in the final weeks of the overall tournament.
VOD quality for watching videos couldn't be changed. 1080p videos take forever to buffer for some people; sorry I'm not going to sit and wait half an hour for a video to buffer for a game that might have turned out to be mediocre.
I'm not sure this is a Justintv issue (I believe it's not), but almost every single time there would be a big battle going on during a game the stream would lag. I've seen many different streams/tournaments where this issue doesn't come up, so something must be going on.
Player selections, casters, etc. are largely subjective. However, I think the amount of players they had for Season 1 was too much and basically the season ended up having dead periods where the games wouldn't matter anymore. Yeah sometimes in certain divisions it did come down to the wire, but players that were under .500 by Week 5 had no shot anymore at the playoffs and just took up time.
This may have been NASL's first run and I did expect a few hiccups but they still have not proved to me that they had a refined product at the end of Season 1, which is why I probably won't shell out another $25 for Season 2. Threatening taking players money for not playing won't be enough. Even the viewers know the games won't matter so why force the players to play a pointless game. Format needs reworking so that these hopeless players can be cut and no longer be obligated to participate. Maybe multiple group phases. Plus the open qualifiers being able to go to playoffs is just off. Everyone knows about Ret's situation. It really highlights the problem. Spend 3 months and lose to a guy who qualified in a 2 day tournament. Not to take anything away from Puma. Open tournament wasn't needed. You should've rewarded the actual players who participated in the bulk of your season. So what's the point in investing watching the regular season and rooting for those players when there is a possibility (and it happened) that most of the open qualifiers would destroy everyone who played in the regular season. Knowing this shortcut to the playoffs, why would anyone want to play out the regular season? If you want to inject new players, do it next season, not insert them into the playoffs.
Imo the 2 day tournament was much much harder than the 3 months.
Assuming everyone has the same chance, ret had a 20% chance of going to the finals because he's in group play. Puma had like .000001 % chance of going to the finals. Puma had to go through the cut throat deadily bo1 tournament that was the open series to qualify into the bracket.
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On July 12 2011 08:50 reisada wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 08:48 BryanSC wrote:On July 12 2011 08:41 reisada wrote:
so you prefer to see better organization and worst games then better games and worst( although not that worst) organization? It's not GSL's fault that their Code S finals have been terrible, just as it's not to NASL's credit that MC vs. Puma turned out to be a great finals. the thing is that doesnt matter! what matters is what are the games you get. even if thats not nasl credit
That's weird logic to slam the GSL over/praise NASL for.
I do agree with you that it's about the game quality. How many of us watched G-Stars over someone 2nd hand stream with livechat translations? I know I did. Or CSN recording the LG Cinema Special Tourny via Rachel's cell phone?
Quality wasn't an issue there b/c the games were good.
But on the other hand, good games isn't something NASL can even control. They got lucky that Puma and MC put on a show. Just like GSL got unlucky that HopeTorture rolled over and died for Fruitdealer despite the two of them playing pretty good games (HT - Tester in the Ro8 was good and FD - Top was near legendary, then FD - Inca was fun too, despite being kinda weird) and just about every championship since then has sucked.
I watched a lot of the NASL regular season and those games weren't all that interesting to me. There were good match-ups here and there and I missed about half the games (basically all the wknd ones), but the ones I saw were pretty forgettable. So NASL just as easily could have had a bad finals.
Of course production does make your perception of the games that much better, for example MLG Columbus has some pretty one-sided series on the last day, but they still felt worth watching (Idra's meltdown was epic and the storyline for MMA was pretty good too).
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On July 12 2011 08:50 reisada wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 08:48 BryanSC wrote:On July 12 2011 08:41 reisada wrote:
so you prefer to see better organization and worst games then better games and worst( although not that worst) organization? It's not GSL's fault that their Code S finals have been terrible, just as it's not to NASL's credit that MC vs. Puma turned out to be a great finals. the thing is that doesnt matter! what matters is what are the games you get. even if thats not nasl credit
NASL final>Code S final
Rest of NASL<<<<<Rest of GSL
I would rather watch good games for 99% of the season and a bad final than the other way around. The only highlights to the NASL finals were MC vs sen and Puma, Alive vs darkforce was really bad and many other matches were just 1 side slaughter feast.
Though i am more positive towards season 2, now that we don't need to watch drewbie vs painuser again. the memories still burn!
Edit: oops used quote instead of edit.
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On July 12 2011 08:58 Wuster wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2011 08:50 reisada wrote:On July 12 2011 08:48 BryanSC wrote:On July 12 2011 08:41 reisada wrote:
so you prefer to see better organization and worst games then better games and worst( although not that worst) organization? It's not GSL's fault that their Code S finals have been terrible, just as it's not to NASL's credit that MC vs. Puma turned out to be a great finals. the thing is that doesnt matter! what matters is what are the games you get. even if thats not nasl credit That's weird logic to slam the GSL over/praise NASL for. I do agree with you that it's about the game quality. How many of us watched G-Stars over someone 2nd hand stream with livechat translations? I know I did. Or CSN recording the LG Cinema Special Tourny via Rachel's cell phone?Quality wasn't an issue there b/c the games were good. But on the other hand, good games isn't something NASL can even control. They got lucky that Puma and MC put on a show. Just like GSL got unlucky that HopeTorture rolled over and died for Fruitdealer despite the two of them playing pretty good games (HT - Tester in the Ro8 was good and FD - Top was near legendary, then FD - Inca was fun too, despite being kinda weird) and just about every championship since then has sucked. I watched a lot of the NASL regular season and those games weren't all that interesting to me. There were good match-ups here and there and I missed about half the games (basically all the wknd ones), but the ones I saw were pretty forgettable. So NASL just as easily could have had a bad finals. Of course production does make your perception of the games that much better, for example MLG Columbus has some pretty one-sided series on the last day, but they still felt worth watching (Idra's meltdown was epic and the storyline for MMA was pretty good too).
Comparing some random recordings to Over Hyped " The best tournament in the world ", that You basically HAVE to pay or just watch in 360p. Is just funny.
Im wondering from where they have that much money, cuz they can't even form semi-amateur production value.
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I refuse to buy access to VODs. If the VODs were free, I would enjoy watching the recommended games but at this point, it's not worth it for me. I only watch it live maybe about an hour a week.
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I think Season 2 will have one of the best overall line-ups, of any tournament, in the world.
Still, I'm in wait-and-see mode.
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I sadly won't be paying for season 2. I think season 1 was worth the money...if I could of watched the VODs. Streaming the NASL in 1080p cause the video to freeze (what is odd b/c i have a i7 930. Everything else plays GREAT!). Also 1080p VODs takes too long to load with my internet connection, and being its still "steaming", only in 1080p its not watchable.
And when asked why the NASL doesn't have 720p VODs (or less). They they blamed it on Justin.tv.?. The only NASL I watched was when I was lucky enough to be home to watch it live in 720p.
And to be honest, in general, it seems silly to just have VODs in 1080p. 
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I just like to watch the finals, so paying for the whole season seems like a best waste of money for me!
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I did not buy a pass for the full regular season, but I did lay down the $10 for the finals weekend. The HD stream worked perfectly for me all weekend and the in-game quality was astonishing.
That said, I probably won't buy a pass for the entirety of Season 2, but I will probably lay down the cash for the finals again. Had the production blown me away this weekend though, I think it's safe to say I would have bought a pass right away.
Overall, I still feel there is this air of "amateur-ness" with regards to production values. During the regular season, the greenscreen backdrop looks worse than those in many YouTube videos. They either need to improve this, or just get a *real* backdrop (see MLG Columbus). NASL surely has some sort of operating budget, and getting a nicely designed set/backdrop for the regular season would go a long way for improving the visual quality of the regular season. In addition to that, the lighting needs to be tweaked, because from my computer at least, regular season broadcasts look like they were filmed with a crappy consumer camera in someones garage. Ironically, video podcasts like Diggnation which are actually often filmed in someones garage, look better.
I must admit I did not watch a whole lot of the regular season, I mainly just tuned in when a few select players were playing (Boxer/Idra/Artosis), so I'm not sure if I'm in a position to criticize the sound quality of the broadcasts. At the beginning of the season, and clearly during the finals, there were many glaring problems. Casters mic's not being equalized to the same level, microphones not working for the stream etc.
With regards to the finals:
-MAKE A SCHEDULE AND STICK TO IT PLEASE. I watched the entirety of the finals with a friend who lives across town, and on two occasions I had to tell him to frantically drive across town because games were starting an hour or more early. Because there was 2 hours slotted for the "opening ceremony" and the musical/entertainment act, my friend missed the entirety of the 3rd place match because it started early. The GSL schedule runs like clockwork every night, starting perfectly on time.
-I thought the production of the player highlights was decent, and they were surely well intentioned, but they were way too long. The GSL highlight videos shown for the Code A semifinals earlier today were perfect in length IMO. Something like that would be far more reasonable.
-Get someone to do a proper design for the stage please. And those booths, good god. I appreciate the fact that you had booths, but those things looked like deathtraps. Throw some sponsor logos/NASL logos or ANYTHING on the outside of those to brighten them up a bit..
-Earthquake cam was not appreciated, and neither was the clear interlacing shown whenever the camera panned.
-What the hell was going on with the observer in day 1? Huge oversight that should not happen. If there was obsing like that in a GSL finals, well.. It just wouldn't happen.
These were my main issues, and if reasonable strides can be taken in resolving them, I would gladly lay down the cash for a full NASL season.
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nah I dont think I will. Maybe if the quality was more like the GSL free stream (terribad). The 360p or w/e the free stream is now is good enough. Not worth it to me otherwise. Though I would probably buy a weekend pass for the finals if they offered it
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I purchased last season the week NASL came out for 25$ or whatever it was and i watched matches for the first week than simply stopped because i preferred GSL over NASL but i will still purchase NASL this season and will probably(maybe not) watch players i like, I dont really ever watch the NASL but i do like to support it.
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On July 12 2011 08:09 Nadir wrote:
I bought the ticket but could never watch the VODs because there was no low quality version. Thanks to my Australian internet I had to buffer for 2 hours to watch a 30 minute video and if I ever wanted to fast forward or rewind the process had to start over again. Won't buy season 2 if this isnt changed.
Same here. If they fix this I can definatly see myself buying a season 2 ticket.
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On July 12 2011 08:55 L3g3nd_ wrote:
I think its wise of geoff to get out while he can, i dont know why, but i was losing a lot of my fan boyism for him the longer he was casting for NASL, he was a god on SotG, and is an awesome player, NASL really wasnt for him.
Also Gretorp should go back to playing, he was actually a really good player when he was playing 100%, but now he is an average player and an average caster =/
Also, 9 weeks is too long for regular season. i just dont care enough. They are risking it becoming like a "who a support" thing if they do that, like who watches every NFL game? you watch the team you support, and maybe a top team clash, but you dont watch every match. While something like the GSL, i watch every game i can, the elimation is what makes it exciting i think, while with NASL, ill watch nony and idra and thats about it
You kinda have a good point. I think I watched NASL 1st week for support but after that I only watched if I wasn't doing anything and the stream happened to be going on. Most of the time I would go look at the schedule see Idra wasn't playing and just not tune in. Pretty only watched what I thought would be entertaining and sometimes I wouldn't even stick it out and wait for those games.
I think NASL was a good idea but something seriously needs to be done about the length. It seems like all the good tourneys that happen are those weekend tourneys. And even NASL final ended up good. Its kinda why I think MLG and DH > GSL atm. I just start to lose interest in gsl until they are deeper in the tourney.
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I bought season 1 pass the day it started and have barely watched. GSL is better on every level and I don't think there is enough time for both, I would probably watch IPL over NASL if I had enough time. Every so often (about 4-5 times throughout the season) I would try to watch VODs but get frustrated with the poor editing and sometimes missing games.
I wish the NASL the best, to me its not worth it.
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I would buy a pass for NASL for sure till the final matchup came up. The resolution fell from 1080p+ which i used for the rest of the matches to 480p. Yeap I know that 80k viewers is a lot of traffic but I payed for HD and not the crappy 480p.
I guess I'll think it twice next time.
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EPT
