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On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on?
Have you not been watching any major SC2 tournament in the past 6 months? All the winners have been Korean, have Korean training regiments, or have the Korean ladder.
MLG Columbus - MMA, LosirA, MC
DH 2011- HuK, Moon, Bomber, July
HSC3- HuK, NaniwA (Who is going to KR), and MC
NASL- Puma, MC, Sen (Sen is in TW, I don't know his practice regiment, but he practices frequently on KR, and now that KR+TW is merged, his practice will be the KR ladder through and through)
Not to mention all the TL-Opens being won by Koreans, and in fact sweeping 1-2-3 by Koreans. Sure there's easy money, but it's not so easy when the Koreans decide to come to battle for the money.
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On July 17 2011 06:02 echO [W] wrote:
HSC3- HuK, NaniwA (Who is going to KR), and MC
NaniwA is going to KR, and that proves your point how? He could do a Sheth. He's more a counter to your argument - he's been doing very well and yet does not train in Korea etc.
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Yo Sheth... Much love man. Keep your chin up and keep on chuggin away. 
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On July 17 2011 06:36 SeaSwift wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 06:02 echO [W] wrote:
HSC3- HuK, NaniwA (Who is going to KR), and MC NaniwA is going to KR, and that proves your point how? He could do a Sheth. He's more a counter to your argument - he's been doing very well and yet does not train in Korea etc.
Naniwa said himself that HuK is a better player than him due to his korean practice though, Seriously, this isn't even up for discussion, Korean practice pays off.
Also I'd add IEM Grand Finals to the list. That is imo the best example of the impact of Korean practice.
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On July 17 2011 06:00 enecateReAP wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 05:52 iamahydralisk wrote:On July 17 2011 03:33 Evangelist wrote:
Most of you have obviously never travelled, lived in a harsh environment and then come home for a week or two.
The pull of home is really difficult to resist. If he came home, he's made the right decision. It is also not oddly enough, as Sheth himself said, a dickish move. You're there to win Starcraft games. If you don't think the experience is going to help you, you don't stay. End of.
It IS a dick move. Quick dickish in fact. Bailing on your team when you're their captain and ace, and they have virtually no chance without you... Is the definition of a dick move. Too many of you are forgetting that Sheth had a team that was relying on him. If he was there alone, it'd be different, but all of you saying stuff like "why should Sheth have to sacrifice his happiness" or something like that need to realize that Sheth made a commitment to his team and to his job, and that is why he should have to sacrifice his happiness. Maybe it's just the type of person I am, but if I were in his shoes, I'd stick it out until the end of the GSTL because it would be my job to do so. And people like you are neglecting the fact that Sheth is one of the nicest and most manner people in the world. HE SAID HIMSELF, that it was a dick move, but its what he needs. If anyone is acting like a dick here, it's you. You're making bold statements without fully understanding the situation and...reality check...YOURE NOT SHETH. You can't comment on how he feels, everyone here knows Sheth wouldn't just 'abandon'' FXO without a good reason, and on page 3, and on SOTG, he has made his good reasons clear. Personally I think this thread should be closed, it's just turning into a flame war, when it doesn't need to be.
I'm a dick for thinking it's wrong to abandon your team in the middle of a tournament? lol
so I guess I'd be a dick if Kobe decided to quit the Lakers mid-season and I thought that was a bad thing too.
some people just don't understand the concept of commitment these days.
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On July 17 2011 07:26 iamahydralisk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 06:00 enecateReAP wrote:On July 17 2011 05:52 iamahydralisk wrote:On July 17 2011 03:33 Evangelist wrote:
Most of you have obviously never travelled, lived in a harsh environment and then come home for a week or two.
The pull of home is really difficult to resist. If he came home, he's made the right decision. It is also not oddly enough, as Sheth himself said, a dickish move. You're there to win Starcraft games. If you don't think the experience is going to help you, you don't stay. End of.
It IS a dick move. Quick dickish in fact. Bailing on your team when you're their captain and ace, and they have virtually no chance without you... Is the definition of a dick move. Too many of you are forgetting that Sheth had a team that was relying on him. If he was there alone, it'd be different, but all of you saying stuff like "why should Sheth have to sacrifice his happiness" or something like that need to realize that Sheth made a commitment to his team and to his job, and that is why he should have to sacrifice his happiness. Maybe it's just the type of person I am, but if I were in his shoes, I'd stick it out until the end of the GSTL because it would be my job to do so. And people like you are neglecting the fact that Sheth is one of the nicest and most manner people in the world. HE SAID HIMSELF, that it was a dick move, but its what he needs. If anyone is acting like a dick here, it's you. You're making bold statements without fully understanding the situation and...reality check...YOURE NOT SHETH. You can't comment on how he feels, everyone here knows Sheth wouldn't just 'abandon'' FXO without a good reason, and on page 3, and on SOTG, he has made his good reasons clear. Personally I think this thread should be closed, it's just turning into a flame war, when it doesn't need to be. I'm a dick for thinking it's wrong to abandon your team in the middle of a tournament? lol so I guess I'd be a dick if Kobe decided to quit the Lakers mid-season and I thought that was a bad thing too. some people just don't understand the concept of commitment these days.
I just don't see how you can argue against that. Whatever his reasons, he quit on his team in the middle of a tournament. That's the bottom line here, not whether he misses home, or whether he can't bear to stay in korea, its that he quit. There's no need to attack people that are dissapointed in him for that, becuase in fact, it is what he did. Whether its right or wrong, is up to Sheth himself to determine, but when it comes down to it, he did QUIT on his team.
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Come on Sheth you gotta give yourself time to catch up to the workload the koreans have 
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Just a bunch of E-peens dissing Sheth, such a great guy.
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I'm sorry, just because he's a pro gamer, it doesn't give him any special treatment. So many of us travel for work and stay away for extended periods of time. How is going to Korea any different from the thousands of kids that go abroad for university for months at a time without going home.
I myself travel a lot for work, for periods as long as 3 months without going back home. This is the modern age, there is skype to voice chat or webcam, or instant messaging to chat online, you just need to adjust and learn to deal with it, and figure out the time zone differences.
I don't get why people are here defending him. So many times people on TL say how Koreans "have it easy because they have a more developed gaming infrastructure" well this it the "developed infrastructure" guys. People being crammed into a room. They don't like it either but they realize that's what you need to succeed. If foreigners aren't ready to make that sacrifice then they aren't ready to dominate. This is honestly the last time I want to hear how Koreans are lucky for getting team practice houses, because they give up a lot.
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On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on?
Tournament results and observed skill? At this point it's basically ludicrous to argue that training in Korea doesn't make you better. And really, if you actually take playing SC2 seriously, I don't see how you could argue against training to be the best.
Perhaps if you have a real reason like you have a family/job, or your mother is sick so you don't want to leave your home country, but "It's kind of uncomfortable and the environment is different" is a rather impotent reason.
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On July 17 2011 08:41 Ocedic wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on? Tournament results and observed skill? At this point it's basically ludicrous to argue that training in Korea doesn't make you better. And really, if you actually take playing SC2 seriously, I don't see how you could argue against training to be the best. Perhaps if you have a real reason like you have a family/job, or your mother is sick so you don't want to leave your home country, but "It's kind of uncomfortable and the environment is different" is a rather impotent reason.
Agreed.
And this is why I feel gamers like Naniwa and Thorzain show infinitely more drive and desire than the NA players who are too comfortable at home to challenge themselves (aside from HuK of course).
Being a progamer was never meant to be luxurious. All of us "regular" people have to work hard for our money too.
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On July 17 2011 08:44 ct2299 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 08:41 Ocedic wrote:On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on? Tournament results and observed skill? At this point it's basically ludicrous to argue that training in Korea doesn't make you better. And really, if you actually take playing SC2 seriously, I don't see how you could argue against training to be the best. Perhaps if you have a real reason like you have a family/job, or your mother is sick so you don't want to leave your home country, but "It's kind of uncomfortable and the environment is different" is a rather impotent reason. Agreed. And this is why I feel gamers like Naniwa and Thorzain show infinitely more drive and desire than the NA players who are too comfortable at home to challenge themselves (aside from HuK of course). Being a progamer was never meant to be luxurious. All of us "regular" people have to work hard for our money too.
30k a year for working 12 hours a day 6-7 days a week.
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On July 17 2011 09:15 Eknoid4 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 08:44 ct2299 wrote:On July 17 2011 08:41 Ocedic wrote:On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on? Tournament results and observed skill? At this point it's basically ludicrous to argue that training in Korea doesn't make you better. And really, if you actually take playing SC2 seriously, I don't see how you could argue against training to be the best. Perhaps if you have a real reason like you have a family/job, or your mother is sick so you don't want to leave your home country, but "It's kind of uncomfortable and the environment is different" is a rather impotent reason. Agreed. And this is why I feel gamers like Naniwa and Thorzain show infinitely more drive and desire than the NA players who are too comfortable at home to challenge themselves (aside from HuK of course). Being a progamer was never meant to be luxurious. All of us "regular" people have to work hard for our money too. 30k a year for working 12 hours a day 6-7 days a week.
Or be really good like MC and win 200k/yr not counting salary :D
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On July 17 2011 09:15 Eknoid4 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 08:44 ct2299 wrote:On July 17 2011 08:41 Ocedic wrote:On July 17 2011 01:36 Raygun wrote:On July 16 2011 15:57 Jibba wrote:It is. It absolutely 100% is. The people that left early for "easy money" have all made a mistake. What the fuck do you base this on? Tournament results and observed skill? At this point it's basically ludicrous to argue that training in Korea doesn't make you better. And really, if you actually take playing SC2 seriously, I don't see how you could argue against training to be the best. Perhaps if you have a real reason like you have a family/job, or your mother is sick so you don't want to leave your home country, but "It's kind of uncomfortable and the environment is different" is a rather impotent reason. Agreed. And this is why I feel gamers like Naniwa and Thorzain show infinitely more drive and desire than the NA players who are too comfortable at home to challenge themselves (aside from HuK of course). Being a progamer was never meant to be luxurious. All of us "regular" people have to work hard for our money too. 30k a year for working 12 hours a day 6-7 days a week.
There are people with worse situations in the world. And you fail to mention that 'working' entails playing a video game. You also overestimate the workload by a significant margin; no one in SC2 practices that much (or at least, no one is forced to like in Brood War.) Read the interview with Slayers Jessica and she mentions that they want their members to have a healthy life outside of the game.
And finally, if you don't like it, then don't let the door hit you on the way out. Either call yourself a professional and do what it takes to be the best at what you love (in which case money should not even be a factor) or don't call yourself a 'professional' without having the results to back it up.
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Everyone who is hating on Sheth on this thread listen to Sotg 43 and repent...It is funny to see people act like they know the circumstances of something like this when they don't. If people didn't care so much about stroking their own ego by putting forth their views that make them seem good and Sheth bad maybe they would try to learn the facts and stop looking like arrogant asses.
It is not Sheth's lack of commitment, dedication or distate of Korea that made him make the decision to not come back, but multiple completely valid reasons that he says on Sotg 43, that anyone sane would not blame him for.
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If Sheth wasn't one of the best players on the team, I'd imagine he would be cut immediately for pulling such a selfish move.
EDIT:
Looking back, my comments were out of line, not knowing the hardships that awaited Sheth at the progaming house and living in a foreign enviorment. Especially when directed at such an esteemed player. I really am sorry and hope Sheth will accept my apology.
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On July 17 2011 09:31 carltron wrote:
If Sheth wasn't one of the best players on the team, I'd imagine he would be cut immediately for pulling such a selfish move.
And you Carltron are exactly why I hate the teamliquid forum. For the most part it is just a bunch of people who sit on their asses who judge people without knowing the truth or circumstances and frankly don't care enough to find them out as long as they get their daily self righteous dose in of the day.
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On July 17 2011 06:36 SeaSwift wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2011 06:02 echO [W] wrote:
HSC3- HuK, NaniwA (Who is going to KR), and MC NaniwA is going to KR, and that proves your point how? He could do a Sheth. He's more a counter to your argument - he's been doing very well and yet does not train in Korea etc.
While that may be true, most of NaniwA's HSC3 games were PvPs, which at the moment is a bit coin-flippy.
Also, Naniwa himself knows that the best way to do well and excel in the game is to move to Korea and play in Korea, the ladder and the Korean regiments, he himself posted in this thread.
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EPT
