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On July 03 2011 01:13 SimDawg wrote:
Pretty crappy by Mousesports to assure you he could get a visa and then not deliver. I thought these were supposed to be professional businesses?
Strelok is not in mouz but in imba now. Really sucks for Darkforce though, I think preparing for Strelok is way easier since they know each other from several tournaments and ladder.
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On July 03 2011 01:15 Naniwa wrote:
why is he replacing strelok instead of the person who came third in the group? Me.
NASL fails?
User was warned for this post
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DAMN IT
Strelok had epic mech style
Oh well alive is good too
HWAITING!
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On July 03 2011 03:19 Florix wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 01:15 Naniwa wrote:
why is he replacing strelok instead of the person who came third in the group? Me. NASL fails?
No, I'm afraid the failure is on your part good sir, the correct answer would be : Because those are the rules.
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On July 03 2011 01:15 GTR wrote:
is there a reason why white-ra manages to enter america and not brat_ok/strelok? D:
bring vodka get visa 
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what does this mean for the NEXT season ? with alive is now one more player in.
is strelok disq. ? i really hope not
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On July 03 2011 03:07 CTStalker wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 02:03 Takezou wrote:On July 03 2011 01:40 Xeris wrote:On July 03 2011 01:15 Naniwa wrote:
why is he replacing strelok instead of the person who came third in the group? Me. 1) It's been in our rules from the start that the 2nd place of the Open Tournament would have the first backup spot if a player couldn't make it. 2) If aLive had declined the invite, we would have invited the 2nd place finishers in the playoff brackets according to seeding: which would have been: Ace, Naniwa, KiWiKaKi, NaDa, and IdrA. 3) Either way, I would be hesitant to invite you because you've publicly said "thank god I'm done with NASL" and called us a shitty league. Think your actions have no consequences? 4) White-Ra I think as a B1 VISA, he's proven several times he can get to the USA. BRATOK has B1 VISA too (he showed us a scan of it), which is why we accepted him into the league. Strelok was our risk player, and we were assured he could make it here... it just sucks ~_~ While part 1 and 2 make sense. 3 is very unnecessary and unprofessional. You are representing a supposedly professional organization. You could have easily addressed the issue without those comments. agreed. think of how many times idra has slandered or bad mouthed various people and admins on TL -- while he may get banned from the forums, just being a douche isn't going to stop TL from letting him play in tournaments, because he's one of the best in the world, as is naniwa
I don't agree with this. First, which part from the RULES of NASL you don't understand.
Second, Idra, being BM thats true, but most of the time hes just BM toward a person. I don't think Idra ever insult or called TL any thing very bad.
TL also is a forum where people can express their opinions. There is no TL as an business organization unlike NASL, they are an business organization just like many league organizer out there, so they can ban, fine people that talk shit about them.
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On July 03 2011 03:07 mmdmmd wrote:
I've came to the conclusion that you have NO idea what you are talking about. Let's not argue about business model here. It's not going to get anywhere.
Don't know about you, but I've actually run successful businesses. The customers I've thrown out or simply ignored over the years may not have liked me, but I've been just fine without them and I don't really consider them my customers anyway. Maybe you're the type that likes to cater to everyone and try to please everyone, but I've found that approach to not work as well as you may think. If you're good enough at what you do and your product is good, you won't need to have people validate your decisions with ridiculous feedback mechanisms such as polls or surveys (which are never accurate anyway). The best skill you can develop when running any business is to filter out "public opinion" because the vast majority of it is useless and irrelevant.
In this specific case, the big question NASL needs to ask themselves is whether or not this particular decision is going to affect their viewership. I would say that it's most likely not so it's pointless to dwell on it. Of course if it's a huge issue that may have a significant impact (ie. match fixing or some other scandal), then of course action needs to be taken to protect their business, but nobody's going to stop watching because Strelok was replaced with Alive instead of Naniwa and if they are, it's their loss in the end. Note that I'm not saying that people will LIKE the decision. I'm simply stating that even if they don't like it this is not the kind of situation that's likely to drive away any significant portion of the viewership. As long as people are still tuning in and/or giving you their money despite not liking a particular aspect of the product, you're fine. Of course if your product is so shabby that something as stupid as this is going to seriously affect it, you have way more problems than just the situation at hand. Either way, it's not something that's going to be solved by polling the community for advice.
tldr: The "Soup Nazi" from Seinfeld would be me in a nutshell as far as running a business goes and if you're good enough at what you do, people will still give you their money regardless.
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The innate disadvantage of being an Eastern European SC player.
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Really sucks for strelok, the guy seemed super pumped for NASL.
What boggles my mind mostly is that it's still as hard getting VISAs to the US. It's as if it was still 1980 =\
Just sucks bad all around, seems everyone involved handled everything as well as they could have and got screwed by bureaucracy. There should also be some props given to the congressman who tried to help!
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On July 03 2011 02:58 mmdmmd wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 02:56 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:55 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:50 LegendaryZ wrote:On July 03 2011 02:42 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:39 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:37 mmdmmd wrote:
Xeris, why don't you just make a poll in the first post to see what the general opinion is? Why on earth would they do that? This is a professional tournament it's not a popularity contest, you don't make rules just to ignore them because some kids on a forum don't like it. So public opinion doesn't matter to you at all? Glad that you are not running NASL. It'll be "my way or the high way for you"? Kid. What's the point of writing up rules if you're going to change them in the middle of an event whenever people bitch about them? They had clear guidelines written down beforehand as to what would happen in this scenario and they followed those guidelines. People obviously didn't bitch about it back then, but suddenly now that Naniwa comes out and says something, everyone's all up in NASL's face about it after the fact. There's no need for a poll and having one wouldn't resolve anything as people would still bitch and whine about whatever is decided. Public opinion is fine for some things, but in this case it's just plain pointless. I don't want to go in to details of the importance of public opinions in any organisation/business model(especially when you are a start up). I have only one thing to say: Most of the customer never complain, they just walk away. Please justify how NASL should change their rules at the last minute to allow Naniwa in, how is that fair? Let's work on this "after" we see what the majority want.
That's a silly way of thinking. A similar way would be to have a poll after every single Bo3 that said "do you want the player that won to advance or the other player?". Then we could have a finals with Nada and Boxer every single time.
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On July 03 2011 03:20 CoR wrote:
what does this mean for the NEXT season ? with alive is now one more player in.
is strelok disq. ? i really hope not
Since Alive was 2nd in the open, it also means he had already qualified for season 2. Also, Strelok made a thread here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=239791 stating that although he will not have the visa in time for the finals, he will still be getting it and attending the next MLG. With the visa proof, I'm sure he won't have any issue remaining in the NASL.
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On July 03 2011 03:18 Odal wrote:
Stuff like this REALLY makes me regret not getting a refund for NASL when I had the chance.
Your upset at the fact that they followed their rules?
Yeah I'd be pretty mad too.
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On July 03 2011 03:26 BilltownRunner wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 03:18 Odal wrote:
Stuff like this REALLY makes me regret not getting a refund for NASL when I had the chance. Your upset at the fact that they followed their rules? Yeah I'd be pretty mad too.
rofl
User was warned for this post
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its a real shame strelok cant make it considering how well he played over the course of 2 months.
as far as naniwa, hes literally my favorite eu player, i love to see him in any tournament but he needs to grow up and not slander the people/organisations who want to pay him. i wont even comment on him vs alive for the spot in this tournament but i hope he learns in general not to publically bash the hand that feeds.
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Wow so much drama in this thread, think lots of you just need to take a step back and chill the fuck out.
I feel sorry for naniwa, but the rules clearly are outlined that the open bracket player would get the spot in this situation so there is no room for argument there.
Oh and Xeris, you really need a lesson in PR if you want everyone to take you and your league seriously. You just CAN'T get emotional and personal when you are representing a professional organisation, that's not just my opinion - that's the way it works.
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sigh, why do people have to invite koreans instead of the people who actually worked to get to play(Darkforce Naniwa etc.)
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On July 03 2011 03:25 Lobo2me wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 02:58 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:56 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:55 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:50 LegendaryZ wrote:On July 03 2011 02:42 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:39 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:37 mmdmmd wrote:
Xeris, why don't you just make a poll in the first post to see what the general opinion is? Why on earth would they do that? This is a professional tournament it's not a popularity contest, you don't make rules just to ignore them because some kids on a forum don't like it. So public opinion doesn't matter to you at all? Glad that you are not running NASL. It'll be "my way or the high way for you"? Kid. What's the point of writing up rules if you're going to change them in the middle of an event whenever people bitch about them? They had clear guidelines written down beforehand as to what would happen in this scenario and they followed those guidelines. People obviously didn't bitch about it back then, but suddenly now that Naniwa comes out and says something, everyone's all up in NASL's face about it after the fact. There's no need for a poll and having one wouldn't resolve anything as people would still bitch and whine about whatever is decided. Public opinion is fine for some things, but in this case it's just plain pointless. I don't want to go in to details of the importance of public opinions in any organisation/business model(especially when you are a start up). I have only one thing to say: Most of the customer never complain, they just walk away. Please justify how NASL should change their rules at the last minute to allow Naniwa in, how is that fair? Let's work on this "after" we see what the majority want. That's a silly way of thinking. A similar way would be to have a poll after every single Bo3 that said "do you want the player that won to advance or the other player?". Then we could have a finals with Nada and Boxer every single time.
Why is everyone quoting that line with the assumption that Naniwa will win if there is a poll? I am simply suggesting a "listen then decide" approach to this matter.
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On July 03 2011 03:20 CoR wrote:
what does this mean for the NEXT season ? with alive is now one more player in.
is strelok disq. ? i really hope not
What do you mean what does it mean? Alive got top 8 in the first open tournament, he's in next season of NASL anyways, and so is strelok for being in top 34.
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On July 03 2011 03:30 mmdmmd wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2011 03:25 Lobo2me wrote:On July 03 2011 02:58 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:56 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:55 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:50 LegendaryZ wrote:On July 03 2011 02:42 mmdmmd wrote:On July 03 2011 02:39 lunchforthesky wrote:On July 03 2011 02:37 mmdmmd wrote:
Xeris, why don't you just make a poll in the first post to see what the general opinion is? Why on earth would they do that? This is a professional tournament it's not a popularity contest, you don't make rules just to ignore them because some kids on a forum don't like it. So public opinion doesn't matter to you at all? Glad that you are not running NASL. It'll be "my way or the high way for you"? Kid. What's the point of writing up rules if you're going to change them in the middle of an event whenever people bitch about them? They had clear guidelines written down beforehand as to what would happen in this scenario and they followed those guidelines. People obviously didn't bitch about it back then, but suddenly now that Naniwa comes out and says something, everyone's all up in NASL's face about it after the fact. There's no need for a poll and having one wouldn't resolve anything as people would still bitch and whine about whatever is decided. Public opinion is fine for some things, but in this case it's just plain pointless. I don't want to go in to details of the importance of public opinions in any organisation/business model(especially when you are a start up). I have only one thing to say: Most of the customer never complain, they just walk away. Please justify how NASL should change their rules at the last minute to allow Naniwa in, how is that fair? Let's work on this "after" we see what the majority want. That's a silly way of thinking. A similar way would be to have a poll after every single Bo3 that said "do you want the player that won to advance or the other player?". Then we could have a finals with Nada and Boxer every single time. Why is everyone quoting that line with the assumption that Naniwa will win if there is a poll? I am simply suggesting a "listen then decide" approach to this matter.
Because he has a way bigger fanbase than alive? At least on TL
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EPT
