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Patch 1.3.3 PTR - Page 90

Forum Index > SC2 General
4401 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 88 89 90 91 92 221 Next
Massive units are not affected by concussive shells. If you think they are, you are wrong.
It's SPORE crawlers that are being changed, not SPINE. Please read carefully.
See.Blue
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2673 Posts
April 26 2011 18:08 GMT
#1781
On April 27 2011 02:19 LetoAtreides82 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 11:24 Xapti wrote:
ROFL WAFL

Patch 16: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 17: Zealot build time decreased from 38 to 33.

Patch 1.1.0: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 1.3.3: Zealot train time decreased from 38 to 33.

WTF M8?


Am I the only one that have seen this?


Right but you have to look at it in the context that there are other changes being made to other races and the map pool.
FMJ
Profile Joined February 2011
United States169 Posts
April 26 2011 18:09 GMT
#1782
On April 26 2011 11:34 jared1259 wrote:
Spanishiwa build Buff!!!!!!!!!!!!

How does faster zealots = Spanishiwa buff? 2-gate pressure will prevent Spanishiwa build.
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
April 26 2011 18:10 GMT
#1783
On April 27 2011 03:04 Sultan.P wrote:
This salvage change makes no sense. It obviously can't be a balance issue since the difference is 25 minerals which is pretty negligible. It must be blizzard finally giving into the QQ; but if they were going to back away from their initial stance on salvage so easily, why even do it in the first place?


would you rather have no salvage option? there was no point in having salvage in the first place.
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
GoldenH
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
1115 Posts
April 26 2011 18:12 GMT
#1784
In my experience, 2 gate expand on close positions is almost autowin, you do need to build some cannons for the roaches, but all your zealots will keep the roaches off your cannons and away from your probes.
"(Dudes are) not going to say "Buy this game — I cried at the end". (...) I suppose the secret is to find a game that makes you shoot eight million fuckin' dudes and then cry about how awesome it is to shoot eight million fuckin' dudes." - Tim Rogers
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
April 26 2011 18:13 GMT
#1785
On April 27 2011 03:09 FMJ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 11:34 jared1259 wrote:
Spanishiwa build Buff!!!!!!!!!!!!

How does faster zealots = Spanishiwa buff? 2-gate pressure will prevent Spanishiwa build.


i've been loving zerg ever since i learned the spanishiwa build, i've done some 15pool/14hatch w/o gas vs 2gate and works fairly well.
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
TheResidentEvil
Profile Joined September 2010
United States991 Posts
April 26 2011 18:14 GMT
#1786
On April 27 2011 02:19 LetoAtreides82 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 11:24 Xapti wrote:
ROFL WAFL

Patch 16: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 17: Zealot build time decreased from 38 to 33.

Patch 1.1.0: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 1.3.3: Zealot train time decreased from 38 to 33.

WTF M8?


Am I the only one that have seen this?


all you are seeing is what people have been saying for a long time. Too many patches. The game has evolved so much that we are now back to where we started. Blizzard needs to layoff
Unhallowed
Profile Joined January 2011
Canada171 Posts
April 26 2011 18:14 GMT
#1787
On April 27 2011 03:06 superxmikey wrote:
The pylon radius nerf seems a little strange.

Rather, what blizzard should do is allow buildings to be placed still in the 7.5 range and units cannot spawn after the 6.5 range. Honestly, this coding should not be difficult and 2 rings can indicate the unit spawn and building placement, maybe darker ring for units?

But changing the radius of the pylon is an easier fix so.... laziness?


I feel cannons may be a focus of the radius reduction as well; that would not be accounted for with your fix.
What is evil but good tortured by it's own hunger and thirst?
j3i
Profile Joined February 2011
United States357 Posts
April 26 2011 18:15 GMT
#1788
I was expecting a way for zerg to deal with forcefields, but I still like these changes. Maybe next time they'll make spine crawlers "massive."
I am an idiot who knows only about gaming, so there is nothing private to talk about to begin with. - Bisu
Shiladie
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada1631 Posts
April 26 2011 18:21 GMT
#1789
On April 27 2011 03:15 j3i wrote:
I was expecting a way for zerg to deal with forcefields, but I still like these changes. Maybe next time they'll make spine crawlers "massive."


That would be a neat idea, I don't know how balanced it would end up being though.
Volka
Profile Joined December 2010
Argentina408 Posts
April 26 2011 18:22 GMT
#1790
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.
http://www.starsite.com.ar
Eleaven
Profile Joined September 2010
772 Posts
April 26 2011 18:23 GMT
#1791
On April 27 2011 03:22 Volka wrote:
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.



warp gate refresh starts from the beginning of the warp in cycle. so its still 5 seconds quicker than gateways
TheResidentEvil
Profile Joined September 2010
United States991 Posts
April 26 2011 18:23 GMT
#1792
also the sentry energy would build up right away instead of waiting for it to spawn
Johnranger-123
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United Kingdom341 Posts
April 26 2011 18:26 GMT
#1793
On April 27 2011 03:22 Volka wrote:
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.

Oh I didnt realise this. tbh this is great cause now its a decision rather then an absolute. Yay! ^^ I like all these changes apart from the flying units thing TT To bad I cant test it for myself.
Maybe after this leave the game for a bit? not sure tbh cause the balance changes I feel have all been good ^^ I just dont know if they need anymore for a while even if they dont go though with these.
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 18:28:21
April 26 2011 18:28 GMT
#1794
On April 27 2011 03:26 Johnranger-123 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 27 2011 03:22 Volka wrote:
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.

Oh I didnt realise this. tbh this is great cause now its a decision rather then an absolute.


I agree wholeheartedly with this. What is the point of optional research if you HAVE to do it ASAP anyways !
Roxy
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada753 Posts
April 26 2011 18:30 GMT
#1795
On April 27 2011 03:28 Zorkmid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 27 2011 03:26 Johnranger-123 wrote:
On April 27 2011 03:22 Volka wrote:
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.

Oh I didnt realise this. tbh this is great cause now its a decision rather then an absolute.


I agree wholeheartedly with this. What is the point of optional research if you HAVE to do it ASAP anyways !


Thanks for bumping that post

I think this change is awesome
Now there is no benefit to chronoboosting the warp gate tech
I like the options this brings!
http://sc2ranks.com/us/941824/Roxy - Masters Protoss: "Respect my authoritai"
Bobster
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany3075 Posts
April 26 2011 18:31 GMT
#1796
I really hope this will lead to longer games in PvP matches from now on.

It got pretty embarrasing reading the roundups and recaps and while TvT, PvT and PvZ games usually hover around 15-25 and upwards, there's rarely a macro game lasting longer than 15 minutes.

Here's hoping this change will prompt more macro games and less 3Gate/4Gate all-ins!

On April 27 2011 03:14 TheResidentEvil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 27 2011 02:19 LetoAtreides82 wrote:
On April 26 2011 11:24 Xapti wrote:
ROFL WAFL

Patch 16: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 17: Zealot build time decreased from 38 to 33.

Patch 1.1.0: Zealot build time increased from 33 to 38.

Patch 1.3.3: Zealot train time decreased from 38 to 33.

WTF M8?


Am I the only one that have seen this?


all you are seeing is what people have been saying for a long time. Too many patches. The game has evolved so much that we are now back to where we started. Blizzard needs to layoff

Half of the base wants more changes, the other half wants less.

Who to listen to?
universalwill
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States654 Posts
April 26 2011 18:31 GMT
#1797
well, 4gate is going to become less of an issue, but 2gate might go back in style. that's ok, i'll take a 2gate opening against a 4gate any day. speedling expands should be able to deal with that cleanly enough, and we're no longer playing on the bloodbath maps of old, which should keep 2gates from being as strong as they were in the beta. i'm sure that people are still going to 4gate a ton, and nothing other than the removal of protoss from the game will stop them, but 40 extra seconds to prepare is such a welcome change.

archons are getting their fair buff. nothing really to say about that.

and that pylon thing seems kinda strange, but once you think about it, it really changes the dynamics of PvP.

and that spore crawler root time decrease is going to be wonderful when dealing with banshee based allins, because once the banshees get to a queen-raping mass and find a sweet spot in between spores, there's really nothing that can be done about them.

salvage change is welcome. not really that big a deal and doesn't punish terrans nearly as much as it should for early pressure, but i appreciate the sentiment nonetheless.

the ghost change is ok i suppose. don't think it's going to change too much. terrans have a natural hatred of spellcasters, so i doubt ghosts will be cropping up in the zvt matchup anytime soon.

overall pretty solid patch. i really can't complain about any of the changes.
sihyunie
Profile Joined June 2008
United States108 Posts
April 26 2011 18:33 GMT
#1798
One thing that worries me more than zealot build time reduction is the stalker build time reduction. In the current maps, 2 gate zealot push will be very frightening on close position, but people have played around it before. Now, they also have to worry about 1 zealot 1 stalker pressure, or fast 3 stalker pressure as well. Terran will feel more pressure than now, but in the current fast expansion builds, they sit back in the base and power up before actually moving the orbital command if they feel the protoss pressure. Zerg on the other hand has to worry about too many things now. Hatch first build is pretty much impossible now (not that it was all that prevalent now), and they need speed fast to counter early stalker pressure, but that may just lose to zealot pressure. Regardless, zerg will be even more drone starved than now in zvp, which imo is the most imbalanced matchup right now. I do see one positive side for zerg tho. If protoss forge expands, they stop early game all-ins (baneling busts or heavy roach aggression) with very well timed sentries off warp gates, but now that timing is pushed back, giving zerg bigger timing window.
Aequos
Profile Joined October 2010
Canada606 Posts
April 26 2011 18:34 GMT
#1799
On April 27 2011 03:28 Zorkmid wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 27 2011 03:26 Johnranger-123 wrote:
On April 27 2011 03:22 Volka wrote:
So now gateway production rate= warpgate production rate
Like this:
Zealot: 28+5(warp time)=33 =gateway build time!
Stalker: 32+5=37

So the only advantage of wg is warping anywhere. I wonder, perhaps you could go into mid game with just gateways if you're planning to defend. Dunno.

Oh I didnt realise this. tbh this is great cause now its a decision rather then an absolute.


I agree wholeheartedly with this. What is the point of optional research if you HAVE to do it ASAP anyways !

It really isn't optional research - Blizzard has stated multiple times that Warp Gates are how they intend for Protoss to produce a Gateway army (ironically). The research exists for exactly 1 reason - to weaken early Protoss play so that they can't do the equivalent of a 2-gate proxy for the cost of a Pylon.

That is why the research is for a token cost, and takes so long, yet upgrades all your buildings permanently - they want it to be delayed so that the early cheese that would be available for Protoss with immediate Warp Gates is gone.

I don't see why people don't get this - it would be like if, once you got Concussive Shells, you had to decide per Marauder if you wanted them on or off (coincidentally, Concussive Shells is another ability that was intended to be part of the unit, but was made a research for balance reasons). If the Gateway had less build time than the Warp Gate, it would literally change nothing - Protoss would simply leave them in Gateway form until they have a maxxed army, then shift them to Warp Gates to attack so they can reinforce as they fight cross-map.
I first realized Immortals were reincarnated Dragoons when I saw them dancing helplessly behind my Stalkers.
Roxy
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada753 Posts
April 26 2011 18:35 GMT
#1800
I agree this seems like one of the better thought out patches

75% salvage on a bunker that has no damage on it sounds reasonable
I think that there should be even less refudned if it has 10 hitpoints left and is being attacked by units at the time the salvage takes effect

perhaps make salvage take half of the time it takes to build the bunker, or make an scv salvage the bunker or refund a % of the total life x 75%
http://sc2ranks.com/us/941824/Roxy - Masters Protoss: "Respect my authoritai"
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