Seriously avilo has been spamming the NASL threads since day 1. You can understand his enthusiasm to participate in such a league but this drama now really ?.
If the NASL stays true to their credo to have the 50 best players in it. ( Which they wont have ). Do you actually believe you are one of them ? ....
The only reason you are getting so much attention is due to your votes which are invalid...
My only question is, if avilo recieved troll votes, isn't it obvious that a lot of other people might have..? Sorry if this was already mentionned, didn't read the whole thread.
Lol at avail saying there is no professionism when he just uses the f word. 500 votes... How does he know he have 500 votes. He's got 500 friends he knows personally. Anyways the op has proof of fraud voting. But where is avilos proof of his 500 real life friends. Anyways besides the accusation of mass voting, hasn't the issue been clear that he still remains in the list just without the fake votes? Si why all the bickering still when the issue is solved? Me do not get it
In my opinion, Xeris/NASL should apologize to avilo and NASL absolutely should not penalize him in any way.
I agree with Tyler, it seems like people have lost their minds in this topic and are hell bent on hating on some guy most of us barely even know.
He isent complaining that he wont get in NASL, he is complaining (rightfully so) that he was accused of being the cheater
There is no proof that Avilo did any of this
There is proof that he was accused of cheating
People love freaking drama, and why not jump on this horse and hate on someone, but entertainment aside: Look at this logically and half the people in this thread are trashing this guy. Let me remind you, he did not even make this topic, he didnt even bring this up, yet now he is getting scorned from people asking him if he thinks he is "good enough" to be in the tournament when that was never the reason why he was upset.
Put the "lulz trollin'" aside, and realise why he being unfairly treated here.
Oh finally! This is a good post. Let's just go with the facts that we know.
I've read this entire thread. Wow. I see a few things that stand out to me, and heres my opinions:
1) Xeris worded his first PM poorly, but quickly remedied the situation in subsequent PMs/emails. Mistakes happen, not really that big of a deal. He didn't accuse idra of hacking, he accused some dude we don't know.
2) Now that avilo has been removed from the backup list, he is attempting to slander a tournament for being biased, unprofessional, and illegitimate. Sorry, but this tournament is more important in the grand scheme of e-sports then your meager pissing contest. Funny, you were the biggest NASL fan until they removed you from the list.
3) Watching avilo's stream you will clearly and quickly see he is a young, obnoxious, and whiney player. He complains about imbalance in every TvX matchup, and disrespects/BMs players more accomplished than himself in ladder matches.
4) Who cares? Hes almost as no-name and random as I am. You had fraudulent votes - they were removed - you can't play in the league. Get. Over. It.
5) You say you're more accomplished than some of the people they will choose. Who have they chosen? What are your accomplishments? Being in masters league isn't an accomplishment, regardless of your point total.
6) Woot NASL players to be announced soon, can't wait! 2011 esports should be amazing.
Edit:
After reading a few of the PMs below its obvious NASL needs to tighten up a bit. You're a professional organization now. You should be spitting out robotic answers to inquiries. If you need to hire community managers to do this, than do it.
Tyler I don't see how they're "penalizing" him. If most of his votes were fraudulent, and he had only 43 votes or however many, then why should he be on the waiting list with that few votes? It's just a matter of the exploit being corrected and things working out the exact same way they would have if nobody had "hacked" the voting system in his favor in the first place.
On March 23 2011 04:07 Liquid`Tyler wrote: In my opinion, Xeris/NASL should apologize to avilo and NASL absolutely should not penalize him in any way.
I agree on NASL apologizing to Avilo because they haven't actually done so despite backtracking on their words. To my knowledge he hasn't been punished any way unless you mean the removal of fake votes as a punishment, which just seems silly. The fact that they were illegal votes automatically invalidates them - there is no better alternative choice.
EDIT:
On March 23 2011 04:13 intergalactic wrote: My only question is, if avilo recieved troll votes, isn't it obvious that a lot of other people might have..? Sorry if this was already mentionned, didn't read the whole thread.
The OP says that they ran a check on everyone on the first page and those were the only ones that counted I guess?
On March 23 2011 04:13 intergalactic wrote: My only question is, if avilo recieved troll votes, isn't it obvious that a lot of other people might have..? Sorry if this was already mentionned, didn't read the whole thread.
It was mentioned that the company running the voting system has measures to prevent cheated votes, specifically two "layers." It sounded to me that avilo just happened to have a lot of them, and they were removed.
That said, do you really doubt anyone on the front page deserves to be there?
Although it's great you guys (NASL) are trying to be open about the issue, this REALLY isn't the way. What you should have done is posted an apology for the first PM where Avilo was accused of rigging the votes himself, explained that the fraudulent votes were removed and then leave it at that. By being so defensive you're only turning it into a bigger issue then it needs to be.
jesus christ, stop bashing me for no goddamn reason. It's gotten old since the beta, seriously.
Obviously, I won't be in the first 50, they already said that. Why do people think I don't have a right to speak up for myself? Jesus christ even the title of this thread is fucking mocking me. Good stuff yeah?
Here's some original msgs when I was first removed from their dumb polls a month or so ago. ty tyler for being a voice of reason, and obviously i won't be in their first 50 club, but that doesn't mean i want to be taken out of consideration as an alternate or whatever in the future because these people are telling me i cheated their poll.
some lovely PMs where i'm left dumbfounded from weeks ago:
Original Message From Xeris: no clue, nobody has touched that site in awhile, players already decided anyways, plus voting doesn't matter.
some more recent after they accuse me of being some lowly hacker/cheater:
Original Message From Xeris: What I said was that you used the same account for your votes, whether it was you specifically or someone doing it for you, I don't know, I guess there's really no way to tell if it was you or someone trolling you. Either way, almost all of the votes to your name weren't legitimate.
The polling doesn't matter, but someone trying to cheat the system does matter. Stealing a $1 candy bar doesn't make a huge difference, but if I actually did that it would make a difference because stealing is bad. So your analogy that even if you cheated it shouldn't matter because the poll doesn't matter is wrong.
So, whether it was you, or someone randomly deciding to rig the poll to give you 23,000 votes or however many you had -- we can't tell. All we know is that the votes you received were fraudulent. So we can't in good conscience keep you on a list to be considered knowing that you possibly rigged the voting; does that make sense?
Original Message From avilo: How is that my fault when your voting system is public? Any random idiot can troll the voting system.
Accusing me of cheating or hacking a online poll that doesn't matter according to you guys, and would lower my standing in the community... is absolutely ridiculous. Just as ridiculous as you accusing me of cheating for something, that as said...doesn't even matter.
Which on top of that, is even more ridiculous that you deleted when you guys claim the votes don't mean anything.
Sure, no conspiracy, except that you guys keep doing everything you can to keep me out of your tournament which you claim is the birth of NA e-sports where "everyone can apply!"
Obviously I wanted to be invited, but I really do not care, you guys knew the in-crowders you were going to pick b4 this thing even started, but i'd still like to be on your "standby list" and seriously...pretty damn disgusting that you accuse me of cheating.
Original Message From Xeris: I don't know who the CEO of uservoice is either, but we investigated fraudulent votes of every player in the first page of the poll, and almost all of yours were found to be fraudulent. Dunno what else to tell you.
Original Message From avilo: Me? I don't know who the hell the CEO of uservoice is, but the only thing I ever did to get votes was post a replay pack, advertise it on stream sometimes, post it in my sig everywhere, and spread the word, as well as my gf helping me with email contacts.
I highly doubt all of my votes were "fraudulent" as I managed to get quite a lot of support. I do know from reading forum posts that a troll put a lot of votes previously into my account, idra's, trumps, etc or whatever to troll the polls, but I never have "hacked" or cheated votes, let alone do i even know how.
Original Message From Xeris: Nobody has anything against you, none of us here have ever dealt with you or know you at all. The CEO of uservoice told me that almost all of your votes were fraudulent, and that they were also almost all made from one account. So, am I believing you or the CEO of uservoice?
Original Message From avilo: That's just pretty damn sickening period man. I don't know what it is you guys have against me, but I 'd still like to be a "standby" since obviously I didn't "qualify" for your invite system this first go round.
Original Message From Xeris: Ah, you were removed from the poll by uservoice. We investigated fraudulent voting and your votes were illegitimate. You used the same account but changed IP's every time, which was pretty funny.
You were actually first on the list of standbys, but given this info from uservoice, we're just totally removing you.
Original Message From avilo:
Original Message From Xeris: no clue, nobody has touched that site in awhile, players already decided anyways, plus voting doesn't matter.
oh, it's a conspiracy though.
Original Message From avilo: just wondering?
Ok, when do we know if we're in or not? And I was just asking for gods sake didn't say anything about a conspiracy
On March 23 2011 04:15 avilo wrote: jesus christ, stop bashing me for no goddamn reason. It's gotten old since the beta, seriously.
Obviously, I won't be in the first 50, they already said that. Why do people think I don't have a right to speak up for myself? Jesus christ even the title of this thread is fucking mocking me. Good stuff yeah?
Here's some original msgs when I was first removed from their dumb polls a month or so ago. ty tyler for being a voice of reason, and obviously i won't be in their first 50 club, but that doesn't mean i want to be taken out of consideration as an alternate or whatever in the future because these people are telling me i cheated their poll.
some lovely PMs where i'm left dumbfounded from weeks ago:
Original Message From Xeris: What I said was that you used the same account for your votes, whether it was you specifically or someone doing it for you, I don't know, I guess there's really no way to tell if it was you or someone trolling you. Either way, almost all of the votes to your name weren't legitimate.
The polling doesn't matter, but someone trying to cheat the system does matter. Stealing a $1 candy bar doesn't make a huge difference, but if I actually did that it would make a difference because stealing is bad. So your analogy that even if you cheated it shouldn't matter because the poll doesn't matter is wrong.
So, whether it was you, or someone randomly deciding to rig the poll to give you 23,000 votes or however many you had -- we can't tell. All we know is that the votes you received were fraudulent. So we can't in good conscience keep you on a list to be considered knowing that you possibly rigged the voting; does that make sense?
Original Message From avilo: How is that my fault when your voting system is public? Any random idiot can troll the voting system.
Accusing me of cheating or hacking a online poll that doesn't matter according to you guys, and would lower my standing in the community... is absolutely ridiculous. Just as ridiculous as you accusing me of cheating for something, that as said...doesn't even matter.
Which on top of that, is even more ridiculous that you deleted when you guys claim the votes don't mean anything.
Sure, no conspiracy, except that you guys keep doing everything you can to keep me out of your tournament which you claim is the birth of NA e-sports where "everyone can apply!"
Obviously I wanted to be invited, but I really do not care, you guys knew the in-crowders you were going to pick b4 this thing even started, but i'd still like to be on your "standby list" and seriously...pretty damn disgusting that you accuse me of cheating.
Original Message From Xeris: I don't know who the CEO of uservoice is either, but we investigated fraudulent votes of every player in the first page of the poll, and almost all of yours were found to be fraudulent. Dunno what else to tell you.
Original Message From avilo: Me? I don't know who the hell the CEO of uservoice is, but the only thing I ever did to get votes was post a replay pack, advertise it on stream sometimes, post it in my sig everywhere, and spread the word, as well as my gf helping me with email contacts.
I highly doubt all of my votes were "fraudulent" as I managed to get quite a lot of support. I do know from reading forum posts that a troll put a lot of votes previously into my account, idra's, trumps, etc or whatever to troll the polls, but I never have "hacked" or cheated votes, let alone do i even know how.
Original Message From Xeris: Nobody has anything against you, none of us here have ever dealt with you or know you at all. The CEO of uservoice told me that almost all of your votes were fraudulent, and that they were also almost all made from one account. So, am I believing you or the CEO of uservoice?
Original Message From avilo: That's just pretty damn sickening period man. I don't know what it is you guys have against me, but I 'd still like to be a "standby" since obviously I didn't "qualify" for your invite system this first go round.
Original Message From Xeris: Ah, you were removed from the poll by uservoice. We investigated fraudulent voting and your votes were illegitimate. You used the same account but changed IP's every time, which was pretty funny.
You were actually first on the list of standbys, but given this info from uservoice, we're just totally removing you.
Original Message From avilo:
Original Message From Xeris: no clue, nobody has touched that site in awhile, players already decided anyways, plus voting doesn't matter.
oh, it's a conspiracy though. [quote]
Ok, when do we know if we're in or not? And I was just asking for gods sake didn't say anything about a conspiracy
It's obvious by how your acting taht you didn't cheat the poll, but you have to also consider that without those votes i dont think you would be on their standby list
Nobody actually cares and apparently only 43 people wanted to see you in the league.
If you play better and make a name for yourself, you could be in the next one. If I was running the NASL I'd be going out of my way at this point to make sure you don't make it into any future NASL events either, even if you deserve it.
On March 23 2011 04:07 Liquid`Tyler wrote: In my opinion, Xeris/NASL should apologize to avilo and NASL absolutely should not penalize him in any way.
Isnt that *exactly* what they're saying in this thread that they're NOT doing (penalizing him)?
They can go ahead and apologize all they want - whether it's justified or not its still a good display of professionalism - but I do not get the penalized thing. At all.
Nope check out these quotes from the OP:
This has less to do with the fact that his votes were illegal than it does the fact that he only has a small number of legitimate votes...
So the fact that there were a lot of illegal votes may have played up to a 49.99% part of the decision. We don't know. We only know that it played a smaller part than the small number of legitimate votes. That's the careful wording that Xeris decided upon and that's what it means. If they want to be more specific about they made the decision, they would have been. Even if it's not close to 51/49, I was talking about absolutes. There should be 0 penalty. It would be easy enough for them to say "The only reason we were considering avilo for the standy list was because of his apparent popularity. He's not actually that popular so we took him off the list." But no, there's this extra component of him being associated against his will with fraudulent voting and now the NASL doesn't want to associate with him.
Since there's no way to tell WHO actually did the votes, it's basically Avilo's word that he didn't versus uservoice's evidence that all his votes were rigged. So, in good conscience it was the decision of the owners of the NASL that he can't be included in a standby list because it might jeapordize our integrity. The reason Avilo was first on our standby list was because of his perceived popularity. Obviously that has now been shown to be false, so we can no longer have him on that list.
Again, the wording is purposely unclear. You can see some reasoning going on here, but you don't quite understand exactly why things were decided the way they are. Again it could have been a simple argument about how they were deceived by the fraudulent voting and now that they know the truth, he's not on the standby list anymore. But they didn't want to keep it simple like that. The word "integrity" has to pop up.
It's ridiculous when they have no evidence at all.
He was turned down because he's not top 50. He was insinuated to be cheating in a pm once, which later his redacted and Xeris changed his language. He was removed from the standby list because the votes weren't real votes, thus any leverage he had to get into the tournament was removed.
Seriously, this is like a bad joke. Xeris had essentially 1 sentence of 1 pm that wasn't "professional", and I actually had to try to hold in my laughter as I typed that. Avilo now drumming up "damning" pm's which show nothing is as equally humorous.
EPT
). Do you actually believe you are one of them ? ....
