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You can break a Zealot wall with Zerglings. - Page 17

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Basileus
Profile Joined October 2010
United States103 Posts
December 09 2010 09:21 GMT
#321
Im going to try that wall off and see if I can get a stalker and immortal through, this is a very disturbing situation as it would be near impossible to stop fast pool all ins.
zunova
Profile Joined April 2010
United States83 Posts
December 09 2010 09:33 GMT
#322
On December 09 2010 15:31 Dstnb3 wrote:
Just make a wall in like this, me and a friend tested it and it was the only wall-in that worked. He couldn't get by after trying for a good minute or two. The zealot pushed back a little bit but there was no room to get by, and the amount of time it took to push the zealot back wouldn't be worth it anyway.

TL;DR: solution >> http://img844.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot2010120822264.jpg


Seems a little difficult to see, could you get a couple screenshots of that without the health bars on?
Lobotomist
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1541 Posts
December 09 2010 09:36 GMT
#323
Part of me thinks that this showing right NOW is just God punishing Protoss players for the pheonix buff. You get to lift my drones more, I get to break your walls.

And then I realize that this is definitely a bug. A bug which I may use on the ladder once or twice, just to see. But then back to 14 pool 16 hatch
Teching to hive too quickly isn't just a risk: it's an ultrarisk
Marcury
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada141 Posts
December 09 2010 09:46 GMT
#324
On December 08 2010 07:50 Marcury wrote:
Wall off with zealot next to gateway and not cyber core. Cybercore is actually a little smaller than the gateway if you look at the circle. I just tested it and the zlot died before getting pushed out of the way when you wall off with the zealot next to gateway, however in the replay the zealot was next to a cybernetics.


Can someone please show me a replay of zerglings breaking the wall-in I described, cause I've tested it twice and it's not breakable.
azzu
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany141 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-09 19:37:46
December 09 2010 19:37 GMT
#325
On December 09 2010 18:02 oZii wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 09 2010 15:31 Dstnb3 wrote:
Just make a wall in like this, me and a friend tested it and it was the only wall-in that worked. He couldn't get by after trying for a good minute or two. The zealot pushed back a little bit but there was no room to get by, and the amount of time it took to push the zealot back wouldn't be worth it anyway.

TL;DR: solution >> http://img844.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot2010120822264.jpg



Can a stalker still make it through there?


yes, and this works because there is a 1 square wide, at least 2 square long pathway. if you place a zaelot in this pathway, he will only be moved to one side of the path, but still no zerglings can go through.
CurLy[]
Profile Joined August 2010
United States759 Posts
December 10 2010 20:39 GMT
#326
this shit makes me fucking rage.
Great pasta mom, very Korean. Even my crown leans to the side. Gangsta. --------->
Scoop
Profile Joined August 2010
Finland482 Posts
December 10 2010 21:23 GMT
#327
On December 09 2010 15:31 Dstnb3 wrote:
Just make a wall in like this, me and a friend tested it and it was the only wall-in that worked. He couldn't get by after trying for a good minute or two. The zealot pushed back a little bit but there was no room to get by, and the amount of time it took to push the zealot back wouldn't be worth it anyway.

TL;DR: solution >> http://img844.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot2010120822264.jpg


Pylon in the wall is just begging to be baneling busted.
dump
Profile Joined August 2010
Japan514 Posts
December 11 2010 05:58 GMT
#328
well that explains why i've been constantly losing to lings lately.

just read the whole thread, a few thoughts...

1. stop shooting the messenger. a single secret complaint lobbed at blizzard won't get the problem fixed. software companies prioritize bug fixes based on how severe the impact is, and the only way to convince them that this will have a severe impact is by revealing it publicly and making a huge fuss about it.

2. it's often taken a long time for blizz to fix bugs -- remember the graviton bug a couple months ago? we're probably going to need to find a solution for ourselves.

3. any solution would need to cost more or less the same resources as the current standard wall build would cost, because zerg has many timing options for lings, and the wall-in is the only practical one. stop suggesting placing a second zealot or a sentry or a stalker. the two-pylon solution is better than nothing, but definitely susceptible to baneling bust.

4. high level players do indeed use this wall. case in point, huk: http://www.sc2replayed.com/pages/starcraft-2-news/97-liquidhuk-replays-are-available

5. blizz fixed the mineral boosting bug even though the only "real" problem with it was that it required you to spam if you wanted to keep up. by that same reasoning, even if spamming H on your zealot is enough to keep you safe, it needs to be fixed.
ilubbapples
Profile Joined December 2010
3 Posts
December 14 2010 00:41 GMT
#329
I'm not understanding why the full wall-in is not a valid strategy. Worst case scenario, let's say you didn't scout and you see lings coming up your ramp, why is it not possible to jux leave a probe near your zealot and throw up a full wall-in? If a zerg saw that they'd likely turn around and you can cancel the pylon after they leave. If they keep trying to attack you, let it finish. Let's be realistic if he's been attacking you long enough for a pylon to be finish then the zealot wall in would not have held anyways. Seems reasonable to me without changing the game dramatically. I could be missing some obvious fact so feel free to correct me, but in my head this makes sense.
unbal3
Profile Joined September 2010
Korea (South)131 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-14 00:47:12
December 14 2010 00:46 GMT
#330
i build sentries.

problem, cheesers? ahahahahaha


on a more serious note, i'm gonna have to go check this out. i'll be watching that replay.... after i take a shower.
Dragar
Profile Joined October 2010
United Kingdom971 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-14 01:07:46
December 14 2010 01:05 GMT
#331
On December 09 2010 18:46 Marcury wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 08 2010 07:50 Marcury wrote:
Wall off with zealot next to gateway and not cyber core. Cybercore is actually a little smaller than the gateway if you look at the circle. I just tested it and the zlot died before getting pushed out of the way when you wall off with the zealot next to gateway, however in the replay the zealot was next to a cybernetics.


Can someone please show me a replay of zerglings breaking the wall-in I described, cause I've tested it twice and it's not breakable.


You could actually be correct. I've an example (the single time I've (ab)used this technique) of pushing past two zealots next to a cybercore, but not at a gateway. I post for those curious of seeing it in action anyway.

Check at 9-minutes, after the 4-gate-into-hidden-expo-attack gets crushed.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/115841-1v1-protoss-zerg-delta-quadrant

Of course, one sentry would have done wonders...
reQ
Profile Joined October 2010
United Kingdom45 Posts
December 14 2010 02:09 GMT
#332
Now if only one could move a Depot by spamming move next to it
~
Msrobinson
Profile Joined October 2010
United States138 Posts
December 14 2010 02:55 GMT
#333
How would dance patrolling the zealot work? Does that make the zealot run after the zerglings?

Just curious cuz whenever I put my drone on patrol it never follows drones that do run bys .
The IQ and the life expectancy of the average American recently passed each other in opposite directions.
goswser
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3548 Posts
December 14 2010 03:08 GMT
#334
To be honest, most of the time you don't even need this trick. I'm about 215th in the us ladder as zerg, and if the protoss has 2 zealots or fewer a bunch of zerglings can just kill them pretty easily.
say you were born into a jungle indian tribe where food was scarce...would you run around from teepee to teepee stealing meat scraps after a day lazying around doing nothing except warming urself by a fire that you didn't even make yourself? -rekrul
NinjaAUS
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia133 Posts
December 14 2010 09:33 GMT
#335
Cannon their ramp like u do every other game
???
profit
Brewed Tea
Profile Joined October 2010
United States124 Posts
December 15 2010 10:45 GMT
#336
its the cybercore \ gateway placement, i have noticed most people have their wall where the zealot and the cybercore arent touching, actually im going to look at my replays and see if i do that O.o
if it wasnt for mules terrans would have to 15 hatch every game.
MassHysteria
Profile Joined October 2010
United States3678 Posts
December 17 2010 04:30 GMT
#337
Looks like PTR is down to fix some issues and this will be one of them FYI Go
"Just ban all the J's...even jinklejoes" --unnamed source
KillerDucky
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States498 Posts
December 17 2010 17:01 GMT
#338
On December 17 2010 13:30 MassHysteria wrote:
Looks like PTR is down to fix some issues and this will be one of them FYI Go


Yeah came to post the same thing here:

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/1566036666

The following changes should be implemented when the PTR returns:
• Fixed a pathing issue that units can push an opponent's units.
• SCVs can no longer continue construction on a building from inside of an adjacent bunker.
• Fixed an issue where SCVs can keep repairing at a short range even though the structure they are repairing is blocked by force fields.
MarineKingPrime Forever!
MoreFaSho
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1427 Posts
December 17 2010 17:04 GMT
#339
On December 18 2010 02:01 KillerDucky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 17 2010 13:30 MassHysteria wrote:
Looks like PTR is down to fix some issues and this will be one of them FYI Go


Yeah came to post the same thing here:

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/1566036666

The following changes should be implemented when the PTR returns:
• Fixed a pathing issue that units can push an opponent's units.
• SCVs can no longer continue construction on a building from inside of an adjacent bunker.
• Fixed an issue where SCVs can keep repairing at a short range even though the structure they are repairing is blocked by force fields.

I'm fine with this change, it might make some excellently-well controlled scv/marine balls very strong, but I don't know how to deal with this, right now I haven't seen anybody actually be able to control it that well and for whatever reason qxc, who loves to practice awesome micro (even makes maps for it) I've never seen 2-rax all-in in a tournament game.
I always try to shield slam face, just to make sure it doesnt work
simme123
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Sweden810 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-17 17:08:47
December 17 2010 17:06 GMT
#340
This is such bs... I'm gonna have to watch the replay though but we need to be able to def against really early lings though but yeah.. Hope it's not that bad.
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