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Your thoughts on new ZvT trend? (GSL 3 spoilers) - Page 10
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Coolcatqt
United Kingdom36 Posts
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fAnTaCy
United States893 Posts
There is a 14CC Build...I've played vs it a few times and only one once because terran made a mistake and let my speedlings and blings into his wall at his nat..lol | ||
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Asshat
593 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:28 Noocta wrote: Sigh.... I know Terran have lot of difficulty pass early game against zerg, but this kind of push are just depressing. ZvT, in the ( small ) history of Starcraft 2, is all about terran trying to find a new timng push to win instantly again and again and again... As long as T continues as a gain decisive advantage/win early or don't win at all race, that's how it's going to be unfortunately. I can't remember the last time a terran beat an accomplished zerg without doing either of those. It's almost like playing terran is that kind of game where you have X time to complete all your objectives, you can do a few things here and there to increase the time you have, but when time runs out, game over. Protoss being the "rookie" difficulty level of that game, and Zerg being the "insanity" difficulty. | ||
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Alphasquad
Austria505 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:18 rampaeg wrote: Maybe blizzard should just make a better map pool with more maps like Shakuras...that would solve a lot of issues. i honestly think that shakuras isnt longer a zerg favoured map considering terran and protoss semi-FEs that appeared lately | ||
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Penecks
United States600 Posts
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Foreplay
United States1154 Posts
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Phrencys
Canada270 Posts
IMO they should closely look at things such as decreasing the build time of hatchery(80 sec instead of 100?)/queen(35 sec like OC instead of 50?), their cost, or increasing base larvae generation even slightly. Then if Terran is considered too weak in mid-game then just help them in this department instead of encouraging them to do these brainless cheeses. | ||
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LeafBlower
United States115 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:46 Penecks wrote: The scariest part of this build is that T can poke around the hatch a bit and force lings, meanwhile he is expanding at his base. By the time speed hits and you can reliably get rid of his marines, he's got an expo and bunkers while you are ridiculously behind. That is the main thing I hate when going up against a build like this. Ok, we all realize that you can't 14 hatch now, but what are you supposed to do when you do a 14 pool/16 hatch and then you scout two barracks at the top of their ramp? It is impossible to tell if theyre building more raxs to do an all in, or if theyre just playing mindgames. It pretty much forces the zerg to get a blind baneling nest every single game vs terran which sucks, and you also have to blindly make 2 spine crawlers and enough lings that you think will hold it off. Then you do this and they end up not even attacking just fast expanding with only 2 rax.. I just feel like there are literally endless amount of options for terran to open with, but zerg is limited to a very few openings and then must scout 24/7 to know whats coming (which is hard to do until you get overseers/overlord speed.. btw im not blaming terrans, if i played their race i would do this every single game vs zerg, it isn't that hard to pull off and seriously messes up the zergs standard gameplan.. now we just need to figure out more viable ways to feel out when to drone vs make lings for the unpredictable scv marine all ins | ||
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Consolidate
United States829 Posts
The ZvT dynamic at this point depends mostly on map distance. I look forward to the inclusion of larger maps which may offer more flexibility and diversity to this match-up. | ||
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Jermstuddog
United States2231 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:42 fAnTaCy wrote: There is a 14CC Build...I've played vs it a few times and only one once because terran made a mistake and let my speedlings and blings into his wall at his nat..lol You are misunderstanding the 14 OC. I'm not saying for Terran to expand. I'm saying for him to upgrade his CC to an OC. If you do it on 14 or 15 it doesn't matter, what matters is that if the zerg player doesn't FE, he'll be extremely far behind economically. | ||
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Coolcatqt
United Kingdom36 Posts
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
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Virtue
United States318 Posts
Zerg's 2 base play is really strong and I think if Terran can't punish a fast expand they have a very poor chance of winning the game, even if they FE as well. | ||
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VenerableSpace
United States463 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:54 Jermstuddog wrote: If you do it on 14 or 15 it doesn't matter, what matters is that if the zerg player doesn't FE, he'll be extremely far behind economically. Not true, only slightly behind until you get the 2nd hatch up safely. | ||
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MLG_Wiggin
United States767 Posts
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Velr
Switzerland10761 Posts
Why don't Roaches beat that? Are the Terrans just getting Marauders or what? | ||
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90ti
United States100 Posts
On November 24 2010 01:28 Noocta wrote: Sigh.... I know Terran have lot of difficulty pass early game against zerg, but this kind of push are just depressing. ZvT, in the ( small ) history of Starcraft 2, is all about terran trying to find a new timng push to win instantly again and again and again... but isn't that what SC2 is all about..catching your opponent with his pants down. I feel like most of T vZ/P is about timing pushes when detection (banshee) or colossus is not ready. Before that included reapers..now not so much. It seems like T in this thread expects insta-win, if not QQing ensues. The funny thing is that for Z and P this is rarely the case (outside of the baneling busts, which are far less popular now). P has no insta-win timing push..that I've seen anyways (VRs nerfed) | ||
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latan
740 Posts
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Madkipz
Norway1643 Posts
On November 24 2010 02:02 Velr wrote: stupid question: Why don't Roaches beat that? Are the Terrans just getting Marauders or what? once the terran has 4 marines per roach, the mighty roach begins to suck in direct confrontations. | ||
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AnAngryDingo
United States223 Posts
first terran had 5rax reaper, hellions that could kite all zerg T1 units, etc, to kill or indefinitely cripple the zerg before the 10 minute mark. then the patch came out, nerfed the reaper, buffed the roach, made it so zerg had a fighting chance if not even became the favorite in the matchup and now, either due to most terrans being unskilled/uncreative/simply lazy, or simply not feeling that they can win a macro game against zerg (which may honestly be the case, but this signals a much deeper balance problem in the game) they have come up with this, a new way to kill or cripple the zerg before the 10 minute mark. this will go on until terran's feel that they can win a macro game against the zerg, or blizzard decides to make balance changes. | ||
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