EPTPatch 1.1.2 Notes - Page 87
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Gescom
Canada3370 Posts
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tdt
United States3179 Posts
Toss was just crushing other races gold and below. I'm sure by holing up with VR or balls late game. Course at diamond things were pretty balanced. 1.1.2 toss nerfs will destroy professional Toss but may balance out lower which is more important in some ways since thats 90% of customer. Win % in Diamond (accounting for player skill) 49.6% win rate for Protoss when fighting Terran. 52.8% win rate for Protoss when fighting Zerg. 49.6% win rate for Terran when fighting Zerg. Win % in Platinum (accounting for player skill) 56.3% win rate for Protoss when fighting Terran. 47.3% win rate for Protoss when fighting Zerg. 44.5% win for Terran when fighting Zerg. Win % in Gold (accounting for player skill) 61.0% win rate for Protoss when fighting Terran. 61.1% win rate for Protoss when fighting Zerg. 49.5% win rate for Terran when fighting Zerg. Win % in Silver (accounting for player skill) 63.6% win rate for Protoss when fighting Terran. 50.7% win rate for Protoss when fighting Zerg. 51.6% win rate for Terran when fighting Zerg. Win % in Bronze (accounting for player skill) 59.0% win rate for Protoss when fighting Terran. 55.1% win rate for Protoss when fighting Zerg. 45.4% win rate for Terran when fighting Zerg. | ||
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Yaotzin
South Africa4280 Posts
Thankfully you're wrong and it doesn't destroy professional Protoss play at all. | ||
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johngalt90
United States357 Posts
I for one am most upset about roach range. how are the protoss supposed to wall off or FE without cannons that are protected from roaches we will get busted all day long by this BS. That being said if none of these changes turn out to matter i wont care, though imho minus building health increase this was not a step in the right direction | ||
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MegaVolt
28 Posts
On October 16 2010 08:30 johngalt90 wrote: I for one am most upset about roach range. how are the protoss supposed to wall off or FE without cannons that are protected from roaches we will get busted all day long by this BS. Protoss now have to actually scout the Zerg and react to what he is doing. Maybe even build some units for a change. You know, the stuff Zerg had to do all the time. Scout, react, build appropriate forces to deal with what your opponent has (Force Fields still demolish Roaches). Not being able to hide behind a wall is a good thing. | ||
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NonFactor
Sweden698 Posts
On October 16 2010 08:30 johngalt90 wrote: voidray nerf is rather nonsensical and stupid. only MU they are decent in is t and once they get a viking or two they are pretty wothless also marines are pretty decent at dealing with vr's. People complaing about voidrays must not have played the beta when they really were OP. I will say if blizzard wants to nerf a unit to the point of extinction then they should just remove it. I mean honestly they might as well just take out the reaper and voidray now. I also am pretty sure the VR and reaper were for 2v2's etc and i could see them being too powerful in those circumstances. I for one am most upset about roach range. how are the protoss supposed to wall off or FE without cannons that are protected from roaches we will get busted all day long by this BS. That being said if none of these changes turn out to matter i wont care, though imho minus building health increase this was not a step in the right direction Maybe make more Cannons? I find it to be even more BS when a Protoss can in certain maps just make 1 cannon behind a wall, maybe 2, and be completely safe. Now if you see 1 base roach pressure atleast you have something to be worried about. What has the world come to? | ||
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Grond
599 Posts
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Assymptotic
United States552 Posts
On October 16 2010 08:30 johngalt90 wrote: I for one am most upset about roach range. how are the protoss supposed to wall off or FE without cannons that are protected from roaches we will get busted all day long by this BS. That being said if none of these changes turn out to matter i wont care, though imho minus building health increase this was not a step in the right direction Forge/FE is still very powerful on maps where the build is doable. Get at least 4 sentries to keep the roaches out of range, some stalkers, and scout with OBs if you went robo, or phoenix if you went stargate and place down more cannons as appropriate. Don't forget to have pylons around your base so you can spot Nydus worms. Push out with +1 chargelot timing attack, or wait until your HT/colossus count is great enough. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
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tyreecestylz
7 Posts
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RaZzy
Netherlands36 Posts
Also, they made the HT tech even more useless now. There are only 3 units you can feedback now? HT / Ghosts / Infestors. What is this shit. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On October 16 2010 09:48 RaZzy wrote: Huge nerfes for P.. wth are we gonna do against thors now?? Immortals suck, they'll get EMP'ed and will be obliterated by the thors in 2 sec. Also, they made the HT tech even more useless now. There are only 3 units you can feedback now? HT / Ghosts / Infestors. What is this shit. You forgot Medivacs, Queens, Ravens, PDD's, Banshees, Sentries, and Motherships. | ||
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tdt
United States3179 Posts
On October 16 2010 08:28 Yaotzin wrote: Uh disregarding balance at professional level would be incredibly stupid. Thankfully you're wrong and it doesn't destroy professional Protoss play at all. No it's incredibly smart. Lemme draw you a picture to follow. 1. Blizzard is a company. 2. Companies want to make maximum profit. 3. Gaming companies profit when game is good. 4. A game is good when higher proportion of player are happy. 5. Catering to non pros or even non diamond players makes more people happy since bronze - platinum make up most of the players. 6. Catering to 200-300 professionals makes no sense vs. 3 million and counting good/pros. 7. Blizzards goal is not to make game balanced or people happy in pros or even all diamond but as many people as possible instead. 8. Nerfing races and buffing others is done with that calculus in mind as reflected by Bnet statistics posted. Toss are crushing others. And Zerg very weak against both. Anyone who cares about profit and understand business would agree. As to you second part. I'll bet anyone and all comers $10 a tourney with 4:1 odds (there is only 3 races) protoss will not win any major tourney again. | ||
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Yaotzin
South Africa4280 Posts
On October 16 2010 10:08 tdt wrote: 7. Blizzards goal is not to make game balanced or people happy in pros or even all diamond but as many people as possible instead. They say otherwise. Quite rightly. Unbalanced games do not have a long lifespan, which leads to less sales. Certainly they are interested in balance at lower levels as well, but that doesn't preclude balancing it at the top. As to you second part. I'll bet anyone and all comers $10 a tourney with 4:1 odds (there is only 3 races) protoss will not win any major tourney again. Oh I wish I could. Even if they end up underrepresented again as in BW, they'll still win things. | ||
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Dromar
United States2145 Posts
On October 16 2010 10:08 tdt wrote: No it's incredibly smart. Lemme draw you a picture to follow. 1. Blizzard is a company. 2. Companies want to make maximum profit. 3. Gaming companies profit when game is good. 4. A game is good when higher proportion of player are happy. 5. Catering to non pros or even non diamond players makes more people happy since bronze - platinum make up most of the players. 6. Catering to 200-300 professionals makes no sense vs. 3 million and counting good/pros. 7. Blizzards goal is not to make game balanced or people happy in pros or even all diamond but as many people as possible instead. 8. Nerfing races and buffing others is done with that calculus in mind as reflected by Bnet statistics posted. Toss are crushing others. And Zerg very weak against both. Anyone who cares about profit and understand business would agree. As to you second part. I'll bet anyone and all comers $10 a tourney with 4:1 odds (there is only 3 races) protoss will not win any major tourney again. That doesn't look incredibly smart. You didn't mention anything about Blizzard attempting to uphold their reputation, uphold/expand the Starcraft brand/universe, and the potential drawbacks of an imblanced game failing as an e-sport, which they've mentioned several times is their goal. If the game is horribly balanced and they don't do anything about it, GSL and similar tournaments will eventually be overrun by mirror matchups (or at least a very high proportion of boring games). This will make the game very weak as a spectator sport, and Blizzard will look like a huge failure since they've been hyping SC2 as an "e-sport." Also you seem to forget that, regardless of the actual balance of the game, 99% of players (that is, all but the very best and very worst) are going to have similar experiences playing ladder. Namely, the matchmaking system is going to steer them toward 50% winrate. And if you're gonna go by the "company wants to make the most money" angle, why should they do anything at all? They already have our money. You don't mention their plans for expansions or anything. | ||
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Deathstar
9150 Posts
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fearus
China2164 Posts
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Dromar
United States2145 Posts
On October 16 2010 10:43 Deathstar wrote: The supply depot necessity nerf is going over the line. Zergs are able to fast expand and there's nothing I can do to punish them. If I'm not able to get some advantage in the early game, then the zerg can easily macro into victory. For what asinine reason did Blizzard place this nerf. I feel like playing random now because I'm bouncing around races too much and Blizzard doesn't know what they're doing. You can harass their expo area with an SCV, or even partially build a depot or ebay there, continue scouting with your SCV, and cancel once lings are out. It was really annoying for Zerg players in BW, and even more so now since Zerg usually don't build a non-expo area hatch until midgame. edit: that said, I'm a bit critical of this depot before rax thing too. | ||
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
On October 16 2010 10:08 tdt wrote: No it's incredibly smart. Lemme draw you a picture to follow. 1. Blizzard is a company. 2. Companies want to make maximum profit. 3. Gaming companies profit when game is good. 4. A game is good when higher proportion of player are happy. 5. Catering to non pros or even non diamond players makes more people happy since bronze - platinum make up most of the players. 6. Catering to 200-300 professionals makes no sense vs. 3 million and counting good/pros. 7. Blizzards goal is not to make game balanced or people happy in pros or even all diamond but as many people as possible instead. 8. Nerfing races and buffing others is done with that calculus in mind as reflected by Bnet statistics posted. Toss are crushing others. And Zerg very weak against both. Anyone who cares about profit and understand business would agree. As to you second part. I'll bet anyone and all comers $10 a tourney with 4:1 odds (there is only 3 races) protoss will not win any major tourney again. #4 is incredibly flawed and wrong. Thus your argument falls apart. | ||
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njtwkr
Sweden73 Posts
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