EPTOn October 13 2010 13:30 Chill wrote:
lol i like how you pretend this will singlehandedly destroy sc2 as an esport or something.
lol i like how you pretend this will singlehandedly destroy sc2 as an esport or something.
My thoughts exactly.
Zerg Build Order optimizer. - Page 6
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FrostedMiniWeet
United States636 Posts
My thoughts exactly. | ||
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Almania
145 Posts
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RifleCow
Canada637 Posts
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NeSS1
United States101 Posts
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
as for an exercise for you, i'd like to know the quickest BO to make 5 mutas, the BO has to include at least 1 queen, 2 bases(with optimal drone count prior the mutas out), 2 spines, ling speed upgrade, and you need to make at least 3 pairs of lings before spire is finished. it would be super useful if you can do that out :p on a serious note: just tell me the quickest BO to make 5 mutas+3lings, regardless all the conditions i said above. | ||
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voss
Australia146 Posts
On October 13 2010 13:36 Beef Noodles wrote: When Sky Net takes over, Chill will eat those words Yes. This program will not only ruin esports, but take over the entire world. Except Madagascar. Aint no way to get there when something breaks out anywhere else in the world... | ||
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bovi
Japan208 Posts
like althought it cant do best eco with 7 roach. it can show you 7 Roach in 4:40. vs 7 Roach in 5:40 and show you how many extra drones you'd have with the latter build. or the reverse way, ask the program to design the fastest 7 Roach build with a minimum of 20 drones by the time the 7th roach hatches. it would certainly help people improve. | ||
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Lomilar
United States130 Posts
On October 13 2010 14:32 Chipotle wrote: This build order optimizer is a phenomenal development. It adds dynamic to early game timing pushes. It can't be used for longer games, though, both because of harass and the early economy sacrifice to get out units. Any plans on posting it for download? I have to make it suitable for non-Lomilar use. It has no UI right now, I made changes to code, then run it in a debugger. :-x What flavor would you guys like it in? Runnable program -- Will require Java 1.6, can run own build optimizations, but will consume computer's processing power for several hours to get a optimized build. Web application -- Zero installs, will work slower, but will be able to have common repository of builds that it will run on. Won't eat computer, and will do something like email you when your build gets better. Distributed program -- Zergling@Home (like Seti@Home). Like Web Application, takes longer. You can help optimize other people's builds, as well as your own. Android application -- Can run on phone! Very slow if optimization is done on phone. Maybe combined with one of the online options. Poll: What flavor would you like to see the build order optimizer in? Runnable Application. I want to use my awesome computer for personal gain! (1188) Web Application. I want it to be the easiest thing to use, don't care if it is slow. (475) Android Application. I want to do it at work. Discreetly. In the bathroom. (174) Distributed Program. I don't care if it takes a while to get out, I want community support! (76) 1913 total votes Your vote: What flavor would you like to see the build order optimizer in? (Vote): Runnable Application. I want to use my awesome computer for personal gain! | ||
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ApBuLLet
United States604 Posts
This would significantly damper the creative, strategic aspect from the game and make it revolve more around mechanics and efficiency. Now I am not saying that mechanics are not important part of the game but at the same time, that's what it is, it is just a PART of the game. In order for the game to grow and evolve the way Brood War has, people need to have that creative, outside the box mind set. So there's my two cents, but then again something like this is probably inevitable so maybe it should just be released. Just make it confusing to use or something so newbies don't bother trying it lol. | ||
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Railxp
Hong Kong1313 Posts
for the people who understand how the game works, it will speed up the evolution of the metagame. In the hands of a pro, it will be awe inspiring. in the hands of a noob, it wont affect that much because all you have to do is throw them off their build order with some harass. either way it only benefits progress. | ||
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Bair
United States698 Posts
Release it for the android. I would pay $1 for it. Then use it in the bathroom...at my desk...during lunch... | ||
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NeSS1
United States101 Posts
On October 13 2010 14:40 ApBuLLet wrote: The one problem I see with this is not the program itself, but abuse of the program. By this I don't mean pros going and optimizing their builds or whatever, but more of the average players RELYING on a program like this to come up with build orders for them. This would significantly damper the creative, strategic aspect from the game and make it revolve more around mechanics and efficiency. Now I am not saying that mechanics are not important part of the game but at the same time, that's what it is, it is just a PART of the game. In order for the game to grow and evolve the way Brood War has, people need to have that creative, outside the box mind set. So there's my two cents, but then again something like this is probably inevitable so maybe it should just be released. Just make it confusing to use or something so newbies don't bother trying it lol. I disagree. Strategy will always be a part of any RTS game, but pro gaming should be, for the most part, about mechanics. As for creativity, a build order optimizer would create more possible openings. Also, on the pro scene, games would still reach the mid-late stage, where this program would not be applicable. In this stage of the game, strategy comes into play most, because more tech options are open to players. | ||
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Playguuu
United States926 Posts
I'd say release it, maybe you can get some feedback and help for others. Is this built in C? | ||
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Lomilar
United States130 Posts
On October 13 2010 15:00 Playguuu wrote: This looks good, though it's a bit minimalistic. This program isn't going to magically make anyone better, but give you a good starting framework for builds. It's still up to the player to perform them and figure out what they need to build in the meantime so they don't die, add that to the desired 'outcome', whatever that may be, such as X amount of lings or roaches, and hopefully the algorithms will develop enough to integrate what the other player could possibly have. It's certainly no substitute for actually playing and figuring those out on your own. I'd say release it, maybe you can get some feedback and help for others. Is this built in C? Java. Makes it flexible in how I want to distribute and run it. I could run it on a hadoop cluster. :-x | ||
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ApBuLLet
United States604 Posts
On October 13 2010 14:50 Chipotle wrote: I disagree. Strategy will always be a part of any RTS game, but pro gaming should be, for the most part, about mechanics. As for creativity, a build order optimizer would create more possible openings. Also, on the pro scene, games would still reach the mid-late stage, where this program would not be applicable. In this stage of the game, strategy comes into play most, because more tech options are open to players. I just think it would put the average player (anyone from bronze to mid diamond) in the wrong mindset for an RTS game to really develop the way it should be. People already tend to rely on their set build orders and what not and they're more focused on finding the right build order to win rather than learning how to read their opponent and how to react appropriately etc., which are equally as important as good mechanics are. However I do agree that it really wouldn't effect the pro scene at all, and if it does then it would probably be in a good way. But at the same time, someday there won't be a pro scene if new players aren't learning how to play the game the right way. | ||
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Cheerio
Ukraine3178 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
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Deleted_143
Australia256 Posts
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darmousseh
United States3437 Posts
On October 13 2010 15:29 Klesky wrote: If it takes several hours to go through all the combinations and do random trials and take averages. All to determine with a high -probability- that it is 'optomized.' Why would you write it in Java? It sounds like a very intensive operation. C/ASM. Should bring that over-night down to a reasonable amount of time. lol, java runs just as fast 99% of the time. | ||
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Thrasher5
4 Posts
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