EPTOn August 28 2010 08:03 Droodjerky wrote:
Infestors takes 3 shots from a tank now and not two?
Infestors takes 3 shots from a tank now and not two?
Eh no? Infestors are armored.
Situation report 1 posted! - Page 55
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Izzachar
Sweden285 Posts
Eh no? Infestors are armored. | ||
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Antisocialmunky
United States5913 Posts
On August 28 2010 08:42 Alexstrasas wrote: One thing that i dont get is: What the fuck is this? Who the fuck creates "stalemate situations" to bring battlecruisers? The translation is terran turtled up and made mass battlecruisers and this is less "interesting gameplay" what fucked up reason to nerf something is this? Im not even saying that i agree or disagree, i mean its just one thing to come and say "Hey we looked into it and it seems this unit does too much damage" another thing is "Hey it seems that someone turtled to get battlecruisers (who the fuck does that ? i never saw anyone doing this in my games, i never saw anyone do this on pro level, seriously who the fuck does that? Were did they took this info from?) and it was boring so we are going to nerf this unit. Why arent carriers or broodlords nerfed too then? A toss for example could easly mass canon and create a "stalemate situation" (wich btw i actualy did saw alot in SC1) I will just pretend they are saying that its too strong vs land units (because obviously now i will make it mainly to counter air units...meh) and whatever. But yeah... i think overall its a good patch, i see were they were coming from with all those changes (excluding BC obviously), I get that they decided to nerf tanks because the mass QQ zergs were doing, but tbh zerglings/banelings were already a decent way to counter the tanks, not sure if this change isnt just overdoing it. Also it tips the scales abit on the zealots + HT toss combo. But yeah, i guess it is still alot better than those pro-lists with nerfs/buffs that are usualy posted in here by the QQers. I still dont get were Blizz gets their figures from but hey, atleast they arent listening to what all the whiners say. TLO did that in one or two casted games and just slaughtered hydras using cliffs and yamatos on Infestors. But that was more of an issue with cliffs on Kulas Ravine being broken with a critical mass of stacked air. I wonder about the tank nerf though. That is 3 shots to kill Hydras instead of 2. That's kinda a big deal. Likewise they also don't always insta-kill marines anymore. This also opens a +1 carapace timing window with zerglings where they take 2 shots from tanks. That just... doesn't feel right... However this makes Tanks less less likely to totally rape your own marines when broodlings are in play. ^_^ | ||
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st3roids
Greece538 Posts
In this patch is the same thing 5 less dmg for tanks and reaper build time nerf to help early zerg game and thats all. but now they nerfing zealots for some reason and ultras so terran will get benefit in the long run plain and simple fyi the problems lie in ghosts , marauders , pf , viking 9 range , thor 10 range , steam and tanks 13 range and the splash dmg with the smart ai thing not the 50 or 45 dmg . | ||
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
I then used three tanks against a group of 9 not upgraded hydralisks and another force of 15 speed and carpace upgraded zerglings. Before I changed the Tanks they slaughtered both forces, 3 of the zerglings managed to come close enough to one of the tanks so it at least got hit by friendly fire. The hydralisks managed at best to kill 1 tank and almost bring down the other tank to near death. After the change the Zerglings at best killed all three tanks and 8 zerglings survived. The hydralisks took down all three tanks with 4 hydralisks still alive. My conclusion is that Tanks now are very viable to actually kill and that zerlings are worth making and flank Terrans Tanks with. | ||
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checo
Mexico1364 Posts
Tanks... well now you get a unit that cost 150-125 and 3 suply that does 35 damage vs hydras, cracklings, banelings anyone???? and chargelots.... 5 more seconds to bunker build time... well now i'll get destroy by early pushes, usually my bunkers finish just in time for me to defend... will need to rework the timings... I usually play bio vs Zerg never was a fan of mech... now it won't be a choice... you will play bio or die XD | ||
Harem
United States11393 Posts
On August 28 2010 08:42 branflakes14 wrote: The same IdrA who whined about Terran mech and then stomped all over it at IEM? Err, Top Korean zergs like Check have said the same thing about 2gate being a huge problem early game too. | ||
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seiferoth10
3362 Posts
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st3roids
Greece538 Posts
The same IdrA who whined about Terran mech and then stomped all over it at IEM? A terran won that now didnt he ? | ||
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checo
Mexico1364 Posts
He Bio didn't he??? | ||
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
The same Terran who admitted after the game that Terran was OP | ||
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BeMannerDuPenner
Germany5638 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:00 st3roids wrote: Well see about that , its the same reaction like in beta when they lowered tank dmg from 60 to 50 and every terran said is a good patch - did it make any difference , heck no. In this patch is the same thing 5 less dmg for tanks and reaper build time nerf to help early zerg game and thats all. but now they nerfing zealots for some reason and ultras so terran will get benefit in the long run plain and simple fyi the problems lie in ghosts , marauders , pf , viking 9 range , thor 10 range , steam and tanks 13 range and the splash dmg with the smart ai thing not the 50 or 45 dmg . are you crazy? -15 dmg vs light is like 30% dmg reduction vs nonarmored. thats huge. the zeal nerf wont do anything in pvt and the 10% vs armored ultra nerf doesnt matter at all. its just nonsense what you cry about not to mention your numbers are plain wrong. | ||
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VorcePA
United States1102 Posts
Maps: So the destructible rocks provide a temporary defense, as opposed to just changing the map outright for Z/P players? You couldn't just narrow the entrances? I like the two paths to an opponents base, so perhaps 2 layers of rocks one side of each player's base (coupled with the narrowed entrances) would be in order. Protoss: It's sooooo time to proxy barracks rush them. Proxy rax and 6 pool rush is going to dominate them :\ Terran: Reapers are pretty much useless outside of Zerg, and now they're being made more useless. Fantastic. The build time increase is warranted, but something needs to be buffed to offset that changed, otherwise they're just never going to be used outside of cheese strats. Increasing their damage by +1 or +2 or adding 10 more HP, or giving them +10 hp with the shield upgrades that marines get (while still increasing their build time) would possibly see them mixed in with a Terran's main army in all 3 match ups. Zerg: Yeah, ok. Ultralisks don't already have pathing problems, now they're going to also reduce the damage they do? I could see this change justifiable if they added +1 range to ultralisks so they could hit over smaller units such as lings/blings. I have no comment on ram, except that I think buildings are destroyed a little too quickly in general by all things that do bonus damage vs. armored. I hope I'm wrong, but this shit looks ridiculous. | ||
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:12 BeMannerDuPenner wrote: are you crazy? -15 dmg vs light is like 30% dmg reduction vs nonarmored. thats huge. the zeal nerf wont do anything in pvt and the 10% vs armored ultra nerf doesnt matter at all. its just nonsense what you cry about not to mention your numbers are plain wrong. ya, I just did a bunch of tests about it in the editor, Zerglings and Hydralisks are now incredibly useful against Tank play, specially Zerglings since they no longer "evaporate" under siege tank fire. | ||
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Subversion
South Africa3627 Posts
Don't get me wrong I really like the Protoss and Terran nerfs but: 1. Marauders were completely unaddressed. A lot of Terran's imbaness against P is due to MMM being too strong. 2. Zerg was completely unchanged. I'm sure the last thing anyone expected was a NERF. I was expecting to see either a buff, but more hopefully, some kind of CHANGE. This is really disappointing. | ||
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OnEMoReTrY
United States99 Posts
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Toads
Canada1795 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:13 VorcePA wrote: Wow. I disagree with all these changes. Maps: So the destructible rocks provide a temporary defense, as opposed to just changing the map outright for Z/P players? You couldn't just narrow the entrances? I like the two paths to an opponents base, so perhaps 2 layers of rocks one side of each player's base (coupled with the narrowed entrances) would be in order. Protoss: It's sooooo time to proxy barracks rush them. Proxy rax and 6 pool rush is going to dominate them :\ Terran: Reapers are pretty much useless outside of Zerg, and now they're being made more useless. Fantastic. The build time increase is warranted, but something needs to be buffed to offset that changed, otherwise they're just never going to be used outside of cheese strats. Increasing their damage by +1 or +2 or adding 10 more HP, or giving them +10 hp with the shield upgrades that marines get (while still increasing their build time) would possibly see them mixed in with a Terran's main army in all 3 match ups. Zerg: Yeah, ok. Ultralisks don't already have pathing problems, now they're going to also reduce the damage they do? I could see this change justifiable if they added +1 range to ultralisks so they could hit over smaller units such as lings/blings. I have no comment on ram, except that I think buildings are destroyed a little too quickly in general by all things that do bonus damage vs. armored. I hope I'm wrong, but this shit looks ridiculous. I think you over react, reaper is not useless anymore, I think you're wrong about his role in the game. He is not a unit to do additonnal dps to your base army reeaper is here to harrass the mineral line and attack undefended base. I see a lot of match where delay reaper were more effective when they were delai. | ||
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Kyouya
Mexico318 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:03 checo wrote: Man i almost never ever get BCs... now i will never get them... even for late game TvT i usually OP my oponent with more vikings and micro... when someone gets BCs and were on the same bases i lol because its a easy win. Tanks... well now you get a unit that cost 150-125 and 3 suply that does 35 damage vs hydras, cracklings, banelings anyone???? and chargelots.... 5 more seconds to bunker build time... well now i'll get destroy by early pushes, usually my bunkers finish just in time for me to defend... will need to rework the timings... I usually play bio vs Zerg never was a fan of mech... now it won't be a choice... you will play bio or die XD Banelings are 30hp, so tanks still one shot them. I'm fine with the changes, but it will better to reduce lair and hive time, turret hp/dmg and thor AA range. | ||
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Yaotzin
South Africa4280 Posts
MMM isn't imba against P... | ||
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delayed reflex
Canada358 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:00 Integra wrote: I went to the map editor and changed the stats of the tanks according to the new patch notes to see the differences. I then used three tanks against a group of 9 not upgraded hydralisks and another force of 15 speed and carpace upgraded zerglings. Before I changed the Tanks they slaughtered both forces, 3 of the zerglings managed to come close enough to one of the tanks so it at least got hit by friendly fire. The hydralisks managed at best to kill 1 tank and almost bring down the other tank to near death. After the change the Zerglings at best killed all three tanks and 8 zerglings survived. The hydralisks took down all three tanks with 4 hydralisks still alive. My conclusion is that Tanks now are very viable to actually kill and that zerlings are worth making and flank Terrans Tanks with. Assuming this is accurate (I am not at a computer where I can check), this is a MASSIVE shift, definitely more than the 60->50 damage change. I would be interested to see how this affects the "critical mass" of tanks where it was essentially impossible for any ground army to ever get through if you had enough tanks - it may not even be possible anymore as with the reduced damage to light you need even more tanks, and due to spacing they will not necessarily have as much overlapping fire anymore. Curious to see how the BC nerf will turn out, it might make things like TLO's fast BCs non-viable now... too bad, hopefully it doesn't go the way of the carrier  | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On August 28 2010 09:13 VorcePA wrote: Protoss: It's sooooo time to proxy barracks rush them. Proxy rax and 6 pool rush is going to dominate them :\ I'm so sad that I'm a protoss player :/ this combined with the warp gate build time nerf is going to make early game protoss SOOOO much weaker. | ||
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