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Promotions Take Too Long? - Page 11
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Santi
Colombia466 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Chen
United States6344 Posts
I'm not really complaining since neither of us give a shit about team games one way or another, but how is a system in which you arnt promoted after going 30-0 perfectly OK? Is LLLW the only legit way to get yourself promoted? | ||
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kasuya
Spain95 Posts
so, my advise is.. if u wanna test how bad promotions are.. win lose 8 games in a row, and win everything else | ||
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kasuya
Spain95 Posts
14. win against Doomer protoss +11 (1 bonus even match) platinum 867pts 269-251 lllww 15. loss against ulikeit terran -13 (even match) diamond 743pts 121-111 llllw 16. win against theoryx protoss +11 (even match) platinum 906pts 55-55 lllll 17. win against rflbill protoss +13 (even match) diamond 791pts 172-156 lwlwl 18. loss against dacelt rprotoss -10 (even match) diamond 827pts 115-108 lllll 19. win against zultor rzerg +11 (even match) platinum 676pts 50-48 llwwl 20. win against chaz zerg +11 (even match) platinum 243pts 11-9 wwwll 21. loss against fillmel terran -10 (even match) gold 160pts 8-1 lwwww 22. win against Shaun terran +20 (14 even plus 6 bonus) Diamond 811pts 72-61 wwlll 23. win against Edowyth protoss +13 (even match) Diamond 252pts 13-10 lllww 24. loss against Fins protoss -13 (even match) platinum 785pts 73-65 wwlwl 25. loss against taintedkhan terran -10 (even match) diamond 839pts 70-55 wwwlw 26. loss against The rprotoss -11 (even match) platinum 952pts 62-52 llwww 27. win against ironman zerg +11 (even match) platinum 896pts 142-136 llwww 28. win against normster terran +11 (1 bonus even match) platinum 738pts 57-39 wwlww 29. win against Fuzed terran +14 (even match) diamond 545pts 37-33 wllll 30. win against genrou terran +11 (even match) platinum 869pts 299-285 wwwww 31. win against decrepit terran +13 (2 bonus even match) platinum 373pts 21-15 wllwl 32. win against tofu protoss +15 (opp slightly favored) diamond 826pts 79-70 wlwww 33. win against swanzy protoss +12 (even match) platinum 924pts 75-62 wwwll 34. loss against johndfool zerg -12 (even match) platinum 441pts 19-13 llwwl 35. loss against Fung protoss -13 (even match) diamond 882pts 119-113 lllll *****36. win against Meforyou terran +11 (even match) platinum 962pts 209-195 wwlww i would appreciate if more people does this with their last 22 games that got them into diamond. Edit: cause my theory still stands... he made 14 wins and 8 losses | ||
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optical630
United Kingdom768 Posts
you've lost a certain amount of games (yes, really) and you get consistant wins, i went from placements to gold to diamond, went like 7 wins vs diamond players, lost 2 or 3 games, won like 4 more, was ridiculous, then i lost like 4 games straight, won 1 and got promoted. so from my experience, you need a consistant win rate and for some reason, you have to lose X amount of times (like demuslim did) | ||
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Shurayuki
Germany2665 Posts
On September 20 2010 08:49 Santi wrote: They are fine. Learn to play. The thing is, why do I stay in gold eternally (just cheesed my last placement because i wasn't in the mood) when i only play platinum and diamonds? i actually have an easier time beating diamonds then anyone else! I see how constant shuffling of leagues could cause people to shy away from playing, but i don't feel like i'm getting anywhere because the game doesn't reeward me for beating diamond players constantly (now if we go with the current theory, my uncertainty factor even increases, c'mon). Instant gratification is where it's at nowadays. I for one feel more motivated if i see that diamond there, some might feel motivated to climb up, dunno (i just think: stupid game, you know you pit me against D and i beat them) ;P tl:dr it's stupid that winning against top opponents will actually make you stay in a lower leage longer. | ||
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Dommk
Australia4865 Posts
That is why even after a string of losses you can get promoted, because the system becomes more accurate with it's guesses, if it predicts you will lose a game and you do lose a game then it becomes more confident. I see how constant shuffling of leagues could cause people to shy away from playing, but i don't feel like i'm getting anywhere because the game doesn't reeward me for beating diamond players constantly (now if we go with the current theory, my uncertainty factor even increases, c'mon). In that same respect, should losing to awful players demote you faster? And more so, if your wins are also correlated with stings of losses against awful players, why should you move up? How does it know that those wins aren't just flukes, I mean, you are losing to people worse than them, at least in a statistical sense. The system is pretty fair, people really need to just let Blizzard handle this, iirc, at least for WoW, they brought in a few Ph.D's to work on the system. They could create fifty different systems that all handled how the ladder worked different, but I would bet that everyone here would be at the same place they are right now under those systems if they used them instead (relatively anyway) | ||
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ghermination
United States2851 Posts
On August 06 2010 12:08 Superiorwolf wrote: Ah yes I found the image here: http://i34.tinypic.com/1xz3bk.jpg haha that is ridiculous  Totally know how that feels. i was something like 45-15 at 1.2k Plat before i got promoted. Lost 400 points at the switch too. I think the transitions between everything else is fine, but with the number of terrible players in diamond you would think it would be easier to get into. | ||
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Shurayuki
Germany2665 Posts
On September 20 2010 22:32 Dommk wrote: + Show Spoiler + Of course you need to lose games in order to proceed. In a statistical sense, if you keep on winning, a single loss tells it (the system) more about you than any of your wins do. When you lose a few games it can home in on where you should be, otherwise it is never certain where you fit in. That is why even after a string of losses you can get promoted, because the system becomes more accurate with it's guesses, if it predicts you will lose a game and you do lose a game then it becomes more confident. I see how constant shuffling of leagues could cause people to shy away from playing, but i don't feel like i'm getting anywhere because the game doesn't reeward me for beating diamond players constantly (now if we go with the current theory, my uncertainty factor even increases, c'mon). In that same respect, should losing to awful players demote you faster? And more so, if your wins are also correlated with stings of losses against awful players, why should you move up? How does it know that those wins aren't just flukes, I mean, you are losing to people worse than them, at least in a statistical sense. The system is pretty fair, people really need to just let Blizzard handle this, iirc, at least for WoW, they brought in a few Ph.D's to work on the system. They could create fifty different systems that all handled how the ladder worked different, but I would bet that everyone here would be at the same place they are right now under those systems if they used them instead (relatively anyway) Okay I'll have to go with football/soccer examples here. The thing is, if this system applied to football you would not be able to promote to a higher league if you did a clean sweep! Does that make sense? Sure a loss is more important for the system but to make it an integral part to the point where it doesn't work unless you lose is a bit much no? As for the losing to awful players, doesn't it already work that way if you think about it? You will lose a lot more MMR and your Uncertainty will increase more than against equal opponents. Yes you should and it's right, but the winning against better players is a bit strange is all i'm trying to say, not bad, strange. You have a point if somebody is beating Diamonds and losing to Gold or lower, but if your only losses are from Diamond players and you still have a winning percentage of like 80% over them, why have that player remain in whatever lower league for 30+ games? I've met Bronze players who had better understanding of the game than Diamonds, that's besides the point. Leagues are totally arbitrary anyways as the only that ever matters is you MMR, and that's the thing Blizzard hides from us, no wonder people get hung up on insignificant other stuff ^^. I'm not really complaining anyways, just saying it doesn't do what it's supposed to do, motivate me to play. Impatient person on this end of the internet here. I've been in Platinum (aka Diamond after) since beta 1, no biggie. Also saying "it's xx company, let them do their thing they'll do it right" is never a good thing to say, same for politics ;P | ||
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ToastieNL
Netherlands845 Posts
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Redunzl
862 Posts
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Firebolt145
Lalalaland34486 Posts
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peachsncream
United States289 Posts
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kasuya
Spain95 Posts
Toastie, u mind saying ur ingame id and code? or at least ur score from the last 22 games. Should be somewhere around 7-10 losses | ||
Excalibur_Z
United States12235 Posts
On September 21 2010 00:35 kasuya wrote: ya, but that's simply because there was no diamond population, so the game needed some to calibrate player skills Toastie, u mind saying ur ingame id and code? or at least ur score from the last 22 games. Should be somewhere around 7-10 lossesIt's extremely unlikely that there are any special rules for Diamond. It's even more unlikely that the entry conditions change based on player league distribution. There are plenty of examples of people who get promoted with less than 7 losses. | ||
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ranshaked
United States870 Posts
I'm stuck there, I wanna play higher leveled players, but it keeps placing me against bronze | ||
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CheeseGrater
United States290 Posts
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Shurayuki
Germany2665 Posts
i guess it's okay but somehow i'm more inclined to play altitude lately (curse you team liquid, you got me to buy that ;P). p.s.: blizzard should totally take things like 'first game of the day' into account, it's always the worst! haha | ||
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kasuya
Spain95 Posts
There are plenty of examples of people who get promoted with less than 7 losses. Name one , that didn't get promoted the week of the release  | ||
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Excalibur_Z
United States12235 Posts
On September 21 2010 05:15 kasuya wrote: Name one , that didn't get promoted the week of the release Here was the snapshot we were working with, courtesy of SC2ranks: Players and their Number of Losses before Promotion: 0 - 5 1 - 30 2 - 149 3 - 291 4 - 537 5 - 596 6 - 646 7 - 660 Plus I just gave you an anecdotal example of Vanick who went 5-5 and got promoted. | ||
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