EPTTvZ Balance Suggestions - Page 19
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:23 Ainsworth wrote: Make terran pay for range upgrades on the viking and Thor. Marauders should have either same or less range than marines. Zerg needs long range ground unit. But I disagree, zerg macro is really easy. All queens in one group, all hatches in another, you dont have to go to any specific hatchery to larva, just do it on mini map. Takes 5 seconds to larva 5 bases. I agree, except for the marauder thing. The only thing I can imagine that effecting is Marauder vs Roach, which is a losing battle either way. | ||
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Ainsworth
49 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:27 MythicalMage wrote: I agree, except for the marauder thing. The only thing I can imagine that effecting is Marauder vs Roach, which is a losing battle either way. Marauders own stalkers early, especially with concussive shells which is the noobiest upgrade not to get (50/50? Needs to be at least 100/100). This evens out TvP early game IMO. Its also a quasi-buff, because if marauder range is shorter it means your tanks(marauders) are actually in the front of, instead of behind, your marines. | ||
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
so maybe we should just make the terran early game less optional and make zerg defense early on to allow zerg to fast expand before speedling, i think that would change alot siege tanks... i mean when i play tvz i wanna make siege tanks vs anything. no siege tanks and u get run over by banelings, so thats why i have siege tanks - to kill banelings before they reach me and to kill infestors before the fungual me. in theory vs a non-baneling infestor army i dont need siege tanks, but i would still want siege tanks. so that feels like they serve their purpose, kill banes and infestor but they kind of own the other shit as well. i get my rines marauder hellion should be enough to deal with roach hydra ling but still tank end up owning that shit better than the other terran units as well. if they nerfed siege tanks so they would overkill then it would be harder to micro, more important to split up ur army. so thats great. it would still allow me to kill banes and infestor but at the same time it would be less effective vs masses of lings and hydra because of overkill. but this is hellions job, right now siege tanks are doing hellions job and they almost kill roach and ultra just as good as marauders. protoss units are so tough along with marauders that overkill wouldnt really affect that much in tvp and tvt so ye maybe these are the ways to go. zerg more options early game and terrans less effective options early game leading to more interesting early game and terran might need to be defender once in a while instead of always choosing which way the game should go. and then also the tank overkill which makes micro and tank positioning and manual control alot more important. makes zerg better, terran worse and terran harder to play, great stuff imo. but i seriously just hate when ppl come ranting random shit about why the mu is imbalanced, according many ppl in this thread the spell Lower is the bad guy here... 99.9% of zerg users play incorrectly and overall awful. idra plays all day and safe to say hes best zerg or at least within the top3 and he wins alot, but he still tends to lose against non-top terrans and i think the reason behind that is because of the early game zerg end up crippled or die almost all of the times^^ | ||
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trevf
United States237 Posts
To sum it up: TvZ is not IMBA. You just need to play better. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:35 Ainsworth wrote: Marauders own stalkers early, especially with concussive shells which is the noobiest upgrade not to get (50/50? Needs to be at least 100/100). This evens out TvP early game IMO. Its also a quasi-buff, because if marauder range is shorter it means your tanks(marauders) are actually in the front of, instead of behind, your marines. I suppose. Then they need a range upgrade. =]. | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12022 Posts
right now siege tanks are doing hellions job and they almost kill roach and ultra just as good as marauders. Well no they're not. Hellions are for taking out light units like Hydras. Where as a T1 unit, the roach which is armoured should be countered by the tank. It would be ridiculous if it wasn't. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:44 Qikz wrote: Well no they're not. Hellions are for taking out light units like Hydras. Where as a T1 unit, the roach which is armoured should be countered by the tank. It would be ridiculous if it wasn't. u dont understand t.t u have an army of terran vs army of zerg, tank is twice as good beating ling and hydra than hellion is and sieged or unsieged tank almost kill roach ultralisk better than marauders On August 03 2010 21:46 MythicalMage wrote: It also bears noting that the new Tank AI is something Blizzard is proud of, and worked hard for. There's probably an advertisement talking about it. It's not like they're going to take out MBS, or anything like that, so they'll likely not take out Tank AI. overkill is simply possible by adding a time between the attack and the hit. like stalker or marauder, they overkill ^^ u can just add invissible projectile that takes 0.1 second to reach and then ull end up with 5 siege tanks blowing up 1 siege tank if u unburrow a roach next to a tank | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:41 trevf wrote: 19 pages of zerg players whining. i lose lots TvP but you don't see me making up ridiculous nerfs and calling them 'balance changes'. I just realize I need to play better. To sum it up: TvZ is not IMBA. You just need to play better. As has been said, it's EXTREMELY presumptuous for you to say that to some of the best players in the world. | ||
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ZCfos~DangerBoy
57 Posts
Takes only a half second at most to inject larvae to 3 or 4 bases. Isnt this even more overpowered than mules? | ||
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bokeevboke
Singapore1674 Posts
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:57 bokeevboke wrote: Blizzard please fix TvZ. It's not coinsidence that all zergs are whining I wish there was some record of Starcraft forums when BW was launched, to see what they were whining about back then. EDIT: Not that I'm saying that this is balanced or not, but just for fun. | ||
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Jarvs
Australia639 Posts
In terms of making roach more massable. Would a tier 2 (3?) upgrade in the roach warren to make roaches 1 sup instead of 2 be a bad idea? | ||
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LF9
United States537 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:41 trevf wrote: 19 pages of zerg players whining. i lose lots TvP but you don't see me making up ridiculous nerfs and calling them 'balance changes'. I just realize I need to play better. To sum it up: TvZ is not IMBA. You just need to play better. Read Morrow's post. Idra, Artosis, Morrow, and pretty much every top player on the PLANET, Zerg or Terran, disagree with you. Use your fucking brain before you post. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On August 03 2010 22:08 LF9 wrote: I expected the OP to be stupid and unrealistic. However, these changes are actually really sensible. TvZ is fucking RIDICULOUS at the moment, and is clearly the most imbalanced matchup in the game. Something has to be done about this balance-wise, but whatever it is, it has to be something that won't throw off the TvP matchup and give P a large advantage over T. Luckily, T is way too strong vs both other races, so I think a general T nerf is in order. There's absolutely nothing to show that TvP is imbalanced in any way. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 03 2010 22:06 Jarvs wrote: I play T and am totally for tank overkill being implemented. Also makes [insert unit] bombing much more viable, even in the mirror match. In terms of making roach more massable. Would a tier 2 (3?) upgrade in the roach warren to make roaches 1 sup instead of 2 be a bad idea? Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but can't, due to the projectile speed, Overkill be dialed in so that it can be balanced a bit more? Like some overkill, but not super overkill? If so, then I'm all for it, with balancing of course. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On August 03 2010 21:35 Ainsworth wrote: Marauders own stalkers early, especially with concussive shells which is the noobiest upgrade not to get (50/50? Needs to be at least 100/100). This evens out TvP early game IMO. Its also a quasi-buff, because if marauder range is shorter it means your tanks(marauders) are actually in the front of, instead of behind, your marines. This would be necessary if there were reputable opinion supporting the idea that Protoss needs the help in TvP. As it stands, I'm not convinced that TvP is Terran favored to a significant degree, at least not to the extent that Idra's TvZ nerfs wouldn't already fix the issues. | ||
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MythicalMage
1360 Posts
On August 03 2010 22:09 Stratos_speAr wrote: There's absolutely nothing to show that TvP is imbalanced in any way. Yeah, I always thought TvP slightly favored P. And imbalances are what Starcraft was build on. Dark Swarm? OP. Irradiate? OP. Hell, Medics were pretty OP, as were lurkers, reavers, and countless other things. | ||
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