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On July 08 2010 06:09 boblzer0 wrote:
the rally point should be a toggle. depending on what's spawning where you might want it to attack move and you might not. the "you should pay more attention" is just stupid. that's like saying they should only let you select 12 units because it's too easy to play if you can select more. it's why sc2 is so much better than sc1. much less painful to play.
This isn't that arbitrary though. There are reasons why you would want to have your units move as opposed to attack-move. Though there are also reasons why you may want them to attack-move as opposed to move. It's pretty much a 50/50 splitish decision. I personally like it more because it gives you the chance to micro into attack move. It is very very challenging to micro out of attack move (Your units will rush in and start getting slammed, if you're getting attacked is the common example).
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On July 08 2010 05:41 Integra wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2010 05:39 theqat wrote:On July 08 2010 05:39 MaD.pYrO wrote:
500mb for this?! :S There are tons of unlisted changes--new maps, new interface for starters This. the interface alone is totally different, they have like 72 maps or some crazy shit, improved graphics, better connectivity serverwise, engine optimization etc.
i think i saw this too but what is soo funny is that no 1 is 1v1 map 
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On July 08 2010 06:09 kNyTTyM wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2010 06:03 seedfreedom wrote:
Am i the only one that like the "rally is attack move" setting? It's probably because you are used to it. Units are supposed to do what you tell them not just go off randomly chasing other units. Biggest example I can think of in Sc2 is ZvP where zealots are attacking your natural hatchery while you attempt to build up enough zerglings to engage. Every single time a zergling pair pops out of its egg, it attacks the zealots. This will often cause you to lose one or at least take damage because they won't move to the desired destination.
I guess thats part of it, but also if im getting Zealot rushed or Zergling rushed and i really need that Zealot to pop and start fighting immediately, it doesn't and just walks to its death by getting surrounded as soon as it pops, and i spend 10 mins trying to set a really close rally so they don't insta die. With the attack setting, they didnt bother moving and fought right away.
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Even before 250mm was moved to an upgrade, it wasn't being used that often. It probably doesn't make the biggest deal in terms of balance since thors have so much utility without it, but it's such a cool ability that I'd like it if it was more useful.
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On July 08 2010 05:59 ghermination wrote:I see two units that appear to be either Xel'naga or infested protoss... both of which would be fucking amazing. Also the thing that looks like a human with red skin, predator jaws, and big teeth... Is that a changeling? Or is it some other unit i don't recognize?
lmao Dustin Browder is there! Wearing some sort of green suit with facial scars wrought upon him from the lashes of his master, Bobby Kotick.
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seriously how do you have 3+ weeks for the next patch and only come up with "you know that crappy spell that replaced that even worse spell? lets just change that back." worst beta ever
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really good to see the rally point change... now units will actually go where i want them. Infested terrans still kinda useless and ultras are now pretty good. overall good patch
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They didn't talk about the changes in the editor... you have to log-in to use the editor now so I cant use the hard AI yet !! lol
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On July 08 2010 06:07 ghosthunter wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2010 06:02 Orange Goblin wrote:On July 08 2010 05:59 ghosthunter wrote:On July 08 2010 05:57 Orange Goblin wrote:I'm more worried about having Taurens in space suits. Keep WoW out of my SC, Blizzard, I'm serious, that shit is completely inexcusable You should boycott. I feel dirty like a troll now... I don't think there's really any zerg nerfs in this, only zerg changes for better or worse. Will be interesting to see how it plays out. Are you saying you're fine with races that have nothing to do with the SC universe randomly popping up on avatars? I'm fine with easter eggs. They're funny and entertaining. Everything doesn't have to be serious business. For gosh sake, it's a game afterall, it's meant to have fun, also for the developers. And no, this is not a launching point for you to say "WELL MAYBE THEY SHOULD TAKE DEVELOPING XYZ FEATURES MORE SERIOUSLY!" This is just something fun and easy they like to implement for lols. Do you also hate all the easter eggs in the achievement names? GET YOUR BIOSHOCK OUT OF MY SC2!
I don't care about achievements at all, and they have nothing to do with the universe. They're a meta-aspect, part of the MP experience. Avatars, on the other hand, are representations of the actual SC universe in addition to being a meta-aspect. So no, I don't hate all easter eggs, not that it matters (as that's a fallacious argument and borderline a strawman). However, I do dislike having an impure universe and things that meddle with the lore, and are just plain silly. Taurens have no business existing in the SC universe, as it's ludicrous, and not in any way cute or funny.
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On July 08 2010 06:12 KhAlleB wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2010 05:41 Integra wrote:On July 08 2010 05:39 theqat wrote:On July 08 2010 05:39 MaD.pYrO wrote:
500mb for this?! :S There are tons of unlisted changes--new maps, new interface for starters This. the interface alone is totally different, they have like 72 maps or some crazy shit, improved graphics, better connectivity serverwise, engine optimization etc. i think i saw this too but what is soo funny is that no 1 is 1v1 map
there is no new map Sixen is wrong.
Coalition is now named Tarsonis Assault.
Decena is now named Monlyth Ridge.
they only renamed 2 maps. i found this.
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Well any argument for the rally change can be made against the change also, so it's really just changing it so panic situations don't screw you over too much i guess, which makes it alot more new-player friendly.
Argument for the change: "If you can't pay attention to your units to keep them from getting killed without attacking back it's your own fault"
Argument against the change: "if you can't pay attention to your units to keep them from running off and getting killed it's your own fault"
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Oh man, rally > move is so great. I always thought the most irritating thing was when a toss was pushing early and I needed to save up my speedlings, but the moment they popped, they would sprint towards the oncoming force.
Rally > attack move has really only caused more problems for me than it solved.
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Browder's portrait has been around for a while now, I know I saw it floating around during late phase 1 at least, but now there are 2 of him that I saw, which is sad.
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On July 08 2010 06:12 seedfreedom wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2010 06:09 kNyTTyM wrote:On July 08 2010 06:03 seedfreedom wrote:
Am i the only one that like the "rally is attack move" setting? It's probably because you are used to it. Units are supposed to do what you tell them not just go off randomly chasing other units. Biggest example I can think of in Sc2 is ZvP where zealots are attacking your natural hatchery while you attempt to build up enough zerglings to engage. Every single time a zergling pair pops out of its egg, it attacks the zealots. This will often cause you to lose one or at least take damage because they won't move to the desired destination. I guess thats part of it, but also if im getting Zealot rushed or Zergling rushed and i really need that Zealot to pop and start fighting immediately, it doesn't and just walks to its death by getting surrounded as soon as it pops, and i spend 10 mins trying to set a really close rally so they don't insta die. With the attack setting, they didnt bother moving and fought right away.
In that situation, you'd just right click your rally point on your production building, and your units would attack as they popped out. That's how you would resolve that issue. If you wanted to rally your units instead, which is also a choice, you can click off.
My general argument in favor is that you can micro in favor of attacking while spawning, while you can't micro in favor of moving easily without getting hit, which is something I think you got.
I think the one thing that we all can agree is good in SC2 for base defense is that your unit will pop out of the rally point side, so you can micro like that to put your ranged units opposite the opponents melee units when they show up.
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On July 08 2010 05:37 Fire44 wrote:Where is the lurker ? lol where indeed
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Just out of curiosity, no one probally knows yet, but a question nonetheless. If ultras are immune to stun now which is of coursed caused by 3 units to my knowledge: fungal growth, 250mm cannons, and concusive shells. Just taking into account the cannons the if the cannons are fired but the ultra moves out the thors attack range does the cannon stop or is it more like yamato (at least in sc1 it worked this way) where there are only 4 ways to prevent yamato from reaching you. Load into a transport, recall the unit, cloak/burrow, or go into a nydus canal.
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On July 08 2010 06:12 koppik wrote:
Even before 250mm was moved to an upgrade, it wasn't being used that often. It probably doesn't make the biggest deal in terms of balance since thors have so much utility without it, but it's such a cool ability that I'd like it if it was more useful.
True it probally wasn't used as much as probally should have been. After it got moved to an upgrade it was more used on the things imho that it was meant to be used on. To clarify on this the cannons weren't meant for you to spawn 2 thors and then rush the zergs fast expand and kill it instantly than have dropships arrive to carry your thors back. Moving it to an upgrade means that terran players imo don't upgrade unless they are planning to build enough thors to make the upgrade worth it and their opponent is building stuff that the cannons would allow you to use effectively and could not be killed as effectively by other means. (ie banshees 4-5 can kill a building pretty fast, tanks on cliff 2 can kill a building pretty fast, yamato can kill units or buildings pretty fast, ect.)
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I think next patch might be a relatively large patch. They had that big meeting about balance with the big names on the Korean SC2 scene.
We didn't learn much about what they had to say, except that they thought PvP needed some serious change. But there are no Protoss changes this patch.
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On July 08 2010 06:13 Ideas wrote:
seriously how do you have 3+ weeks for the next patch and only come up with "you know that crappy spell that replaced that even worse spell? lets just change that back." worst beta ever
We knew all along the changes would be extremely minor so no idea why you expected more.
The rally point alone makes me happy about this patch.
Removal of Frenzy was also nice, throw that spell back to Warcraft.
Infested Terran change also ok even if the ability still kinda sucks, at least on the infestor it was sometimes used, although rarely.
Don't think I ever saw an infested terran coming from an overseer in 1v1.
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On July 08 2010 06:12 koppik wrote:
Even before 250mm was moved to an upgrade, it wasn't being used that often. It probably doesn't make the biggest deal in terms of balance since thors have so much utility without it, but it's such a cool ability that I'd like it if it was more useful.
frankly there was only about a week or so where ultras were being used against terran mech. I don't think patch 14/15 were played enough to see thors & 250 mm cannon get used to their fullest extent.
I'm pretty sure that once zerg gets 3+ ultras, 250 mm strike cannon will always be worth getting.
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On July 08 2010 06:15 terranghost wrote:
Just out of curiosity, no one probally knows yet, but a question nonetheless. If ultras are immune to stun now which is of coursed caused by 3 units to my knowledge: fungal growth, 250mm cannons, and concusive shells. Just taking into account the cannons the if the cannons are fired but the ultra moves out the thors attack range does the cannon stop or is it more like yamato (at least in sc1 it worked this way) where there are only 4 ways to prevent yamato from reaching you. Load into a transport, recall the unit, cloak/burrow, or go into a nydus canal.
Concussive shells is a SLOW not a stun (they were immune to slow before), fungal growth may or may not be considered a snare instead of a stun, i don't know. And yeah if you leave the range the thor stops attacking, it worked this way w/ frenzies ultras.
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EPT
