EPTI'm really only an above average T player at best, but from what I've seen some sort of grenade ability that does +light or even +armor would fit in well with the reaper and make it more useful later on, especially for flanking and such.
Mid-Late Reaper Plays - Page 5
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VoidBorn
United States1 Post
I'm really only an above average T player at best, but from what I've seen some sort of grenade ability that does +light or even +armor would fit in well with the reaper and make it more useful later on, especially for flanking and such. | ||
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moosh
United States118 Posts
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Akipics
United States45 Posts
reaper is kind of gas heavy. so in mid game i wouldnt waste gas on such unit. maybe 1-2 for scouting. But in late game is great for deny expansion or map control. have 3 reaper jump to their base during the battle, and when they have their attention back to base, all their worker are gone. | ||
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Zombo Joe
Canada850 Posts
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Jimmeh
United Kingdom908 Posts
1) They are too gas intensive. This makes it so that they're hard to rush in early game, which is good, but it also means they're unviable mid->late game because you need to spend the gas on other, more effective units. 2) They're too weak late game. Reapers rely on your enemy having little defence, a lot of cliffs and, most importantly, a lot of luck. They die way too easily to be effective past early game harassment. Again, with the high gas cost you're better off producing almost any other unit. Suggested Solution: 1) Change cost to 75/25. Lower gas enables them to be used in decent numbers in the later parts of the game without cutting too heavily into the Terran's army. The higher mineral cost is to both to help prevent even cheesier rushes and to compensate for the mid/late game buffs. 2) This lower cost would make them too overpowered early game, as they would be a lot easier to spam. Adding the Engineering Bay as an additional requirement for reapers delays them for an extra 10 seconds (it takes 35 seconds to build, compared to a techlab which takes 25 seconds) at least. This allows more time for the opponent to get a stalker, queen or marauder out to help defend against the initial harass. 3) Make the Combat Shield upgrade affect reapers as well. Since most Terrans, who are going bio, would get this upgrade anyway (as it is a huge buff for marines) it helps the reapers be slightly stronger mid game without being stronger at the start. 4) Increase the speed the reaper-specific upgrade (sorry, I forget the name) gives by a very slight amount. An amount that enables them to be more effective on flat ground so they're not completely reliant on cliffs later game. The upgrade itself may need a cost change. 5) Bring back their old D-8 Charge Ability as an upgrade researched on a Barracks TechLab but requires an armoury. This allows reapers to do a lot more damage mid game but prevents early abuse of it. I imagine it would have to cost 100/100 (or possibly even 150/150 or something similiar) as it is already easy to rush to get a Thor so I can imagine it would be fairly easy to rush to this upgrade otherwise. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9376 Posts
On June 09 2010 20:16 Jimmeh wrote: Problems with reapers: 1) They are too gas intensive. This makes it so that they're hard to rush in early game, which is good, but it also means they're unviable mid->late game because you need to spend the gas on other, more effective units. 2) They're too weak late game. Reapers rely on your enemy having little defence, a lot of cliffs and, most importantly, a lot of luck. They die way too easily to be effective past early game harassment. Again, with the high gas cost you're better off producing almost any other unit. Suggested Solution: 1) Change cost to 75/25. Lower gas enables them to be used in decent numbers in the later parts of the game without cutting too heavily into the Terran's army. The higher mineral cost is to both to help prevent even cheesier rushes and to compensate for the mid/late game buffs. 2) This lower cost would make them too overpowered early game, as they would be a lot easier to spam. Adding the Engineering Bay as an additional requirement for reapers delays them for an extra 10 seconds (it takes 35 seconds to build, compared to a techlab which takes 25 seconds) at least. This allows more time for the opponent to get a stalker, queen or marauder out to help defend against the initial harass. 3) Make the Combat Shield upgrade affect reapers as well. Since most Terrans, who are going bio, would get this upgrade anyway (as it is a huge buff for marines) it helps the reapers be slightly stronger mid game without being stronger at the start. 4) Increase the speed the reaper-specific upgrade (sorry, I forget the name) gives by a very slight amount. An amount that enables them to be more effective on flat ground so they're not completely reliant on cliffs later game. The upgrade itself may need a cost change. 5) Bring back their old D-8 Charge Ability as an upgrade researched on a Barracks TechLab but requires an armoury. This allows reapers to do a lot more damage mid game but prevents early abuse of it. I imagine it would have to cost 100/100 (or possibly even 150/150 or something similiar) as it is already easy to rush to get a Thor so I can imagine it would be fairly easy to rush to this upgrade otherwise. The reaper would still be useless. Even with combat shield upgrade it is so easy to counter the reaper in midgame right now. Just have 2-3 stalkers/maurders in the base /hydras /yeah even speedlings and roaches on creep and the reaper cant harass before it dies. And I dont think its overpowered early game. I think its a decent unit early game, but kind of a bad investment, as it has no use of midgame. Even with the 75/25 change I rather have 5/6 of a mauruder. AS I said priviously the reaper needs a range upgrade to be used in midgame for harass. This will make it decent in combat as well, as it can shoot behind the MM. Right now with range 5 it is always gonna be useless. | ||
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LaustinSpayce
United Kingdom58 Posts
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Salty
United States90 Posts
Another strategy that comes to mind is playing defensively, leaving your reapers hidden somewhere in the middle of the map (where they won't be scouted). and then hitting your opponents base fast and heavy. These are both just theories. I'll definitely give them a try when the beta comes back up. | ||
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slappyosis
Canada9 Posts
This would be something like and upgrade that gave them an ability to enter a cloaked state for 2 seconds after receiving damage. this means as long as your reapers aren't getting 1-shot they'll still be able to be effective at slipping by a few stalkers or getting some damage out while not being focus fired down. | ||
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Chillsen
Germany98 Posts
Just give them an ability to place 2-3 mines as an upgrade option. Amen. Edit: I just noticed this was already mentioned, so i agree with that person | ||
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isuckalot
France27 Posts
On June 11 2010 02:58 Chillsen wrote: Reapers would make a great Vulture. Just give them an ability to place 2-3 mines as an upgrade option. Amen. Edit: I just noticed this was already mentioned, so i agree with that person I like this idea. But I'd rather see that in an expansion since it would drastically affect the balance. | ||
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ForKvatch
United States54 Posts
On June 11 2010 02:58 Chillsen wrote: Reapers would make a great Vulture. Just give them an ability to place 2-3 mines as an upgrade option. Amen. Edit: I Just noticed this was already mentioned, so i agree with that person I like this idea. But I'd rather see that in an expansion since it would drastically affect the balance. I don't think an exact replica of spider mines would make sense. A mine being carried and burrowed by a reaper doesn't seem to work for me. But maybe something similar like a timed charged that can be destroyed would work. Maybe the charges blow after a few seconds dealing a ton of damage, but they can be destroyed or you can move away from them (they don't chase like spider mines). EDIT: This was already mentioned, and I totally agree =) | ||
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cryostasis
United States38 Posts
I gave up on reaper rushes as I approached higher levels of play. Any decent Protoss player will be going 1 gate/core/stalker to shut it the fuck down , so if you do try to reaper rush, you risk being in a huge vespene deficit unless you could hit his probes hard. Zerg players are slightly more vulnerable, but once they get the queen out, shouldn't have trouble protecting their mineral line. An early hellion harass is probably preferable and doesn't screw with your barracks production or vespene count at all. Reapers are still really fun units and I have a blast using them, but I think their current design is probably fine for what they are. I don't think any unit should have zero utility in large battles mid/late game but I fear that is what we are going to see with the reaper for the reasons previously mentioned. It gives the opponent something to think about early game, but is just way too expensive to justify later on. | ||
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dogabutila
United States1437 Posts
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Zeke50100
United States2220 Posts
But that probably won't happen ^_^ | ||
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peckham33
United States267 Posts
send scouting scv build bunker where they are not looking (like in a corner of main) put reapers in bunker use a scv or reaper to spot/draw units or just put them on a cliff above nat and wait for your enemy to realize he is blocked off by long living reapers the basic though behind this method: reapers do alot of damage and take very little damage before they die make them not take damage | ||
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AcrossFiveJulys
United States3612 Posts
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avilo
United States4100 Posts
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Obsidian
United States350 Posts
The major issue is they are too slow to build, they need to be more in line with Maruader, even if we need to slow something else down to prevent early rush. | ||
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peckham33
United States267 Posts
edit: here's the page: http://us.starcraft2.com/features/terran/reaper.xml | ||
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