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Poll: Are you buying Starcraft 2?Waiting to see if Blizz will address the issues first (178) 48% Going to go thorugh with the order despite bnet 2.0 (78) 21% Due to the lack of bnet features I have/will cancel my pre-order (65) 18% I won't purchase any of the expansions unless they get their act together (50) 13% 371 total votes Your vote: Are you buying Starcraft 2? (Vote): Due to the lack of bnet features I have/will cancel my pre-order
(Vote): Waiting to see if Blizz will address the issues first
(Vote): Going to go thorugh with the order despite bnet 2.0
(Vote): I won't purchase any of the expansions unless they get their act together
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On June 01 2010 01:57 Takkara wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 01:51 Lollersauce wrote:On June 01 2010 01:46 Takkara wrote:
Cross-region Limiting. It's not like this came out of nowhere. They're integrating SC2 into the same Battle.net system that ALL games will use. So, it's should be fair to understand that they'll use the same infrastructure they have already built. This is the same infrastructure that WoW is integrated into. WoW is region-limited. There is an EU client, a RU client, an asian client, a US client. You can't play different regions with a single WoW account. This has existed for a long time. Battle.net 2 does not exist in a vaccumn. It uses the same systems. Therefore they make the decisions that make the best outcomes for all interfaces. It's not necessarily right, but it's not hard to understand the origin of this outcome. It makes sense for a MMO. It doesn't make sense at all for a RTS. It's completely idiotic to try and grow oranges on a pear tree. Now if you would kindly shut the .... up and stop wasting space trying to justify retarded decisions. Such intense white knighting for Blizzard is pretty strange, unless of course you're paid to do so. Besides, people can already play on different zones in beta, and there is absolutely no harm in implementing a gateway selector. They are just saying fuck you to the SC community, and asking them to buy more copies of the game. It's not a justification. It's an EXPLANATION. People are constantly saying "I have no idea why Blizz would do this?!" "What sense does any of this makes?!" "This must be Activision doing this as a money grab forcing this on Blizzard!". All of that is so laughably stupid that it's just outrageous. There's a legitimate reason why Blizzard chose to do things this way. Now that they and we know this platform is not suitable for the needs of SC2 its up to them to respond properly to their mistake. But for people to be so flabberagsted at a completely obvious decision given what BNet2.0 is and how it's integrated across all products is just stupid. It's clear why they did this. It's not right, but it's clear. So people can kindly "shut the .... up" about why Blizzard is evil, say their piece about why chat channels should be in and stop there.
Couldn't agree more. You make excellent points sir. Blizzard made design mistakes, they are now realizing that, and honestly, nobody is perfect. All the haters should be ashamed, and quite honestly Blizz is trying their best, but people just continually shove shit in their faces to make it worse.
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There is one part that I think Xordiah is missing. The community has been talking about this for months if not years. Raging...not raging. Ever possible responce under the sun to alert Blizzard to this problem.
And they did nothing.
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Im going to repost this so more people can see it
Blues respond. Possibly the biggest Blue response I have every seen on any topic...ever. And I would know :p
From german forum (google translate)
To my knowledge, our thoughts are behind all that we do not want any unguided chat rooms, the sink quickly into chaos.
There should be chat features for focused discussions, but advanced functionality to it will most likely not until the start creating the game.
...
We currently can not go into more detail and give definitive answers to specific questions such as these.
Everything else would degenerate into more speculation on my side, what really helps you not continue.
I can assure you, however, that it is not our intention to take you to the fun on Battle.net by limiting social interaction. We want you can always be with the community and your friends in contact. This should, however, be regulated through lanes and putting all the players together in a chat room is not my opinion, this vision needs.
From english (EU) forum
I have been watching these threads quite a bit over the week-end and I have to agree more with some of the replies than with the OP of this thread. Rage is not good. Rage makes the forums look like a spam-fest and rage makes us want to ignore players or even ban them, because their tone just gets out of hand. Rage makes players create 50 different threads on the same subject, whereas we prefer to have feedback bundled in one place.
What we do want to see and keep seeing from you is your feedback. We want to know if you do not agree with something, this never changes. What we do not want is players raging and just making unfounded accusations and crying doomsday because at the moment there is something missing that they feel is vital. Please do take a step back before raging - is this something that can be fixed? Do you still enjoy the game itself? Please give your feedback and give us the benefit of the doubt that we do want your game experience to be fun. Please always continue to give us your feedback, when you feel that there is something that you just can not live without. Please always continue to do so without rage and in a civil manner. 
...
Not on topic though. 
If there is a hot topic on something, we definitely want players to post and to discuss it. For sure, if there is a thread about a topic that reaches thousands of views and posts it catches our attention faster. This is in fact a signal, that a lot of players are concerned about this topic - it catches the attention and it is very likely to be passed on in our feedback reports.
What I wanted to bring up though was, that while having a lot of players have a very strong opinion about something is a good thing, it is a very bad thing if they are not able to communicate this in a constructive manner. Yes, post about things you don't like but help us change them and tell us why you don't like it or how you would like it. This does not mean that everything can be implemented exactly the way you wish for and it does not mean that we will definitely be able to implement it for launch or even shortly after launch - but a lot of players giving us their point of view on a subject gives us the possibility of bringing this up in an informed manner and also giving us the possibility of taking some good quotes out of these threads.
If we have 50 threads on the same topic, 80% of these are just one-liners saying that this is so terrible and we are a bad company (btw.. 77,2% of statistics are made up on the spot - thanks for the laugh Carighan), then it is hard to find the constructive ones that actually give us the information that we need and just makes us waste a lot of our time for moderation of forums that we could have used a lot better in compiling the feedback.
Just one thing I want to keep pointing out, it has been said before and I always keep saying it - we are on your side.  We want to make a game we enjoy and you enjoy. There are timelines that need to be kept, there might be priorities that you don't understand, but in the end, if there is something that is important to you be sure that we will be passing it on. If you rage - you will lose your voice on these forums and you will be one less person fighting for what you want, if you post in a mannered way, we get a lot more out of you as a beta tester.
/end wall of text!
....
Remember, Battle.net 2.0 is work in progress. What a lot of players don't read in the rage is the part where Frank Pearce is talking about Clan chat and Groups chat. That is definitely being worked on. If you check back to our last Twitter dev chat, there was the same question (http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23767157319&sid=3000):
"We do have plans for chat channels. Specifically, we want to organize chat channels around users' interests so you know what types of conversations you are going to get into when you join a channel. This feature is not something that will be in for beta. Currently we plan to do this feature in a patch after the game launches. "
...
Hehe.. we do ask for your opinion. That is what this forum is for, that is what the beta test if for and we have pulled quite a few things out of these forums. Sometimes getting involved in discussions does change the course of the discussion though. Just now we just wanted to jump in, because it just turned too emotional and this usually leads to a lot of flaming and insulting which is something we don't want to see on the forums.
...
You mean the thread where you were just talking about how you won't use it but it doesn't hurt you either and you're just mad because of the priorities? That feedback was passed on, but just please note that the Facebook integration in its current form, is a lot simpler to implement than most of you would believe.
....
By the way, something that might have come off wrong when explaining this. We don't want/need a wall of text from every single player. If you just want to show your support, than posting just a small confirmation that this is what you feel as well is totally valid. But please make sure that this is not posted in an insulting manner.
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To be honest, the kittens distracted me tons while watching that video. ^^
Source
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=25170778216&pageNo=1&sid=5010#4
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Cancelled pre-order. Quit playing beta. TY GG
I really really wanted to have a starcraft II nld-1 reunion 
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+ Show Spoiler +On June 01 2010 01:51 Archerofaiur wrote:Blues respond From german forum (google translate) Show nested quote +
To my knowledge, our thoughts are behind all that we do not want any unguided chat rooms, the sink quickly into chaos.
There should be chat features for focused discussions, but advanced functionality to it will most likely not until the start creating the game.
...
We currently can not go into more detail and give definitive answers to specific questions such as these.
Everything else would degenerate into more speculation on my side, what really helps you not continue.
I can assure you, however, that it is not our intention to take you to the fun on Battle.net by limiting social interaction. We want you can always be with the community and your friends in contact. This should, however, be regulated through lanes and putting all the players together in a chat room is not my opinion, this vision needs.
From english (EU) forum Show nested quote +
I have been watching these threads quite a bit over the week-end and I have to agree more with some of the replies than with the OP of this thread. Rage is not good. Rage makes the forums look like a spam-fest and rage makes us want to ignore players or even ban them, because their tone just gets out of hand. Rage makes players create 50 different threads on the same subject, whereas we prefer to have feedback bundled in one place.
What we do want to see and keep seeing from you is your feedback. We want to know if you do not agree with something, this never changes. What we do not want is players raging and just making unfounded accusations and crying doomsday because at the moment there is something missing that they feel is vital. Please do take a step back before raging - is this something that can be fixed? Do you still enjoy the game itself? Please give your feedback and give us the benefit of the doubt that we do want your game experience to be fun. Please always continue to give us your feedback, when you feel that there is something that you just can not live without. Please always continue to do so without rage and in a civil manner.
...
Not on topic though.
If there is a hot topic on something, we definitely want players to post and to discuss it. For sure, if there is a thread about a topic that reaches thousands of views and posts it catches our attention faster. This is in fact a signal, that a lot of players are concerned about this topic - it catches the attention and it is very likely to be passed on in our feedback reports.
What I wanted to bring up though was, that while having a lot of players have a very strong opinion about something is a good thing, it is a very bad thing if they are not able to communicate this in a constructive manner. Yes, post about things you don't like but help us change them and tell us why you don't like it or how you would like it. This does not mean that everything can be implemented exactly the way you wish for and it does not mean that we will definitely be able to implement it for launch or even shortly after launch - but a lot of players giving us their point of view on a subject gives us the possibility of bringing this up in an informed manner and also giving us the possibility of taking some good quotes out of these threads.
If we have 50 threads on the same topic, 80% of these are just one-liners saying that this is so terrible and we are a bad company (btw.. 77,2% of statistics are made up on the spot - thanks for the laugh Carighan), then it is hard to find the constructive ones that actually give us the information that we need and just makes us waste a lot of our time for moderation of forums that we could have used a lot better in compiling the feedback.
Just one thing I want to keep pointing out, it has been said before and I always keep saying it - we are on your side. We want to make a game we enjoy and you enjoy. There are timelines that need to be kept, there might be priorities that you don't understand, but in the end, if there is something that is important to you be sure that we will be passing it on. If you rage - you will lose your voice on these forums and you will be one less person fighting for what you want, if you post in a mannered way, we get a lot more out of you as a beta tester.
/end wall of text!
....
Remember, Battle.net 2.0 is work in progress. What a lot of players don't read in the rage is the part where Frank Pearce is talking about Clan chat and Groups chat. That is definitely being worked on. If you check back to our last Twitter dev chat, there was the same question (http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23767157319&sid=3000):
"We do have plans for chat channels. Specifically, we want to organize chat channels around users' interests so you know what types of conversations you are going to get into when you join a channel. This feature is not something that will be in for beta. Currently we plan to do this feature in a patch after the game launches. "
...
Hehe.. we do ask for your opinion. That is what this forum is for, that is what the beta test if for and we have pulled quite a few things out of these forums. Sometimes getting involved in discussions does change the course of the discussion though. Just now we just wanted to jump in, because it just turned too emotional and this usually leads to a lot of flaming and insulting which is something we don't want to see on the forums.
...
You mean the thread where you were just talking about how you won't use it but it doesn't hurt you either and you're just mad because of the priorities? That feedback was passed on, but just please note that the Facebook integration in its current form, is a lot simpler to implement than most of you would believe.
....
By the way, something that might have come off wrong when explaining this. We don't want/need a wall of text from every single player. If you just want to show your support, than posting just a small confirmation that this is what you feel as well is totally valid. But please make sure that this is not posted in an insulting manner.
...
To be honest, the kittens distracted me tons while watching that video. ^^
Source http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=25170778216&pageNo=1&sid=5010#4
So it seems there has been miscommunication. It happens. At this point. All we can really do as they ask in regards to giving constructive feedback.
Also, the comment about facebook made me laugh. I was saying the exact same thing up to this point in response to people accusing Blizzard having their "priorities" incorrect when they added facebook integration. The Facebook integration in it's present state takes zero time. Classic case of people being upset over issues they have absolutely no understanding of. Whether you think it is a useful feature or not, criticism in regards allocation of resources to it is just stupid.
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Tldr: The blues can't say anything. Wait for official response.
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On June 01 2010 02:00 Archerofaiur wrote:
There is one part that I think Xordiah is missing. The community has been talking about this for months if not years. Raging...not raging. Ever possible responce under the sun to alert Blizzard to this problem.
And they did nothing.
They aren't doing anything about it, YET!
Do you know why? Because, it's not a priority currently in the BETA. The BETA is not designed for socializing, and besides, I'm quite sure they said that there would be chat rooms etc, MONTHS AGO, like you say. Just because they don't respond to it immediately, doesn't mean they are not listening, but realize that there are other pressing issues before implementing something trivial as chat rooms. Just be thankful that they choose to implement it, despite all this retarded flaming going on for the past weeks now. Blizzard is not going to be entirely controlled by the users, they make up their minds, because, gasp!, it's their game, however, they will listen to fans, and has always done so.
This doesn't mean that ALL TL issues will be addressed immediately, or at your convinience.
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On June 01 2010 01:57 Takkara wrote:
There's a legitimate reason why Blizzard chose to do things this way. Now that they and we know this platform is not suitable for the needs of SC2 its up to them to respond properly to their mistake. But for people to be so flabberagsted at a completely obvious decision given what BNet2.0 is and how it's integrated across all products is just stupid. It's clear why they did this. It's not right, but it's clear. So people can kindly "shut the .... up" about why Blizzard is evil, say their piece about why chat channels should be in and stop there.
Lolol. You defend them AS IF they started working on SC2 and made those "bad decisions" while not knowing at all what infrastructure would be needed for a RTS game, or completely ignoring the international communities that support them.
Unlike you, I'm not treating Blizzard like babies, they are a big company with a lot of talent and competent people. I'm not buying for a second that these bad design choices were simply an "accident", or that they didn't realize they were generally a downgrade for a RTS game. They are not that retarded. Sorry. So yes, it is/was a moneygrab, they hoped they could get away with it, and it looks like it's not going to happen. Good!
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On June 01 2010 02:05 MasterFischer wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 02:00 Archerofaiur wrote:
There is one part that I think Xordiah is missing. The community has been talking about this for months if not years. Raging...not raging. Ever possible responce under the sun to alert Blizzard to this problem.
And they did nothing. They aren't doing anything about it, YET! Do you know why? Because, it's not a priority currently in the BETA. The BETA is not designed for socializing, and besides, I'm quite sure they said that there would be chat rooms etc, MONTHS AGO, like you say. Just because they don't respond to it immediately, doesn't mean they are not listening, but realize that there are other pressing issues before implementing something trivial as chat rooms. Just be thankful that they choose to implement it, despite all this retarded flaming going on for the past weeks now. Blizzard is not going to be entirely controlled by the users, they make up their minds, because, gasp!, it's their game, however, they will listen to fans, and has always done so. This doesn't mean that ALL TL issues will be addressed immediately, or at your convinience.
Do me a favor. Go on the BNET website and read everything it says about connecting gamers yada yada yada esports yada....
Then come back here and tell us the community not being able to communicate or play with each other isnt a pressing issue.
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On June 01 2010 02:09 Archerofaiur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 02:05 MasterFischer wrote:On June 01 2010 02:00 Archerofaiur wrote:
There is one part that I think Xordiah is missing. The community has been talking about this for months if not years. Raging...not raging. Ever possible responce under the sun to alert Blizzard to this problem.
And they did nothing. They aren't doing anything about it, YET! Do you know why? Because, it's not a priority currently in the BETA. The BETA is not designed for socializing, and besides, I'm quite sure they said that there would be chat rooms etc, MONTHS AGO, like you say. Just because they don't respond to it immediately, doesn't mean they are not listening, but realize that there are other pressing issues before implementing something trivial as chat rooms. Just be thankful that they choose to implement it, despite all this retarded flaming going on for the past weeks now. Blizzard is not going to be entirely controlled by the users, they make up their minds, because, gasp!, it's their game, however, they will listen to fans, and has always done so. This doesn't mean that ALL TL issues will be addressed immediately, or at your convinience. Do me a favor. Go on the BNET website and read everything it says about connecting gamers yada yada yada esports yada.... Then come back here and tell us the community not being able to communicate or play with each other isnt a pressing issue.
Yeah I know everyones so thrilled knowing they'll have to buy 2-3 copy's to play with their friends or competitively an because it was a Blizzard decision we know it can't be wrong! /Facepalm
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On June 01 2010 02:09 Archerofaiur wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 02:05 MasterFischer wrote:On June 01 2010 02:00 Archerofaiur wrote:
There is one part that I think Xordiah is missing. The community has been talking about this for months if not years. Raging...not raging. Ever possible responce under the sun to alert Blizzard to this problem.
And they did nothing. They aren't doing anything about it, YET! Do you know why? Because, it's not a priority currently in the BETA. The BETA is not designed for socializing, and besides, I'm quite sure they said that there would be chat rooms etc, MONTHS AGO, like you say. Just because they don't respond to it immediately, doesn't mean they are not listening, but realize that there are other pressing issues before implementing something trivial as chat rooms. Just be thankful that they choose to implement it, despite all this retarded flaming going on for the past weeks now. Blizzard is not going to be entirely controlled by the users, they make up their minds, because, gasp!, it's their game, however, they will listen to fans, and has always done so. This doesn't mean that ALL TL issues will be addressed immediately, or at your convinience. Do me a favor. Go on the BNET website and read everything it says about connecting gamers yada yada yada esports yada.... Then come back here and tell us the community not being able to communicate or play with each other isnt a pressing issue.
I'll gladly do just that, if you show me WHERE! it says at their website, that their BETAS also need to be responsible for you to run your ESPORTS gaming. Ever heard of ESports gaming in a Beta? I sure haven't. Starcraft 2 is just a special case out of few. I'm not denying the importance of ESPORTS at all, but what about waiting for the time of the release and aftermath before actually complaining about Blizzard ruining ESPORTS? It hasn't even taken off yet.
Do you really think ESPORTS of Starcraft 2 will be dead unless it launches like a GIANT GIANT Ball the very second of the day it's released? It won't. It took time before SC1 became popular, we're just lucky SC2 is popular by default now, but that still doesn't take away the need to get some things done FIRST, before implementing features that mainly cater to the competetive audience that is Esports. Like I said numerous times, Blizzard has had a fair bit of trouble with b.net 2.0 in the makings, and so what.. it's to be expected.
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Hell, its about start THAT THEY DO SMTH.
The community is raging for months now, and all we hear is some stupid excuses,
getting irritated by fucking interviews like that with Frank Pearce etc.
It's about time they get seriously concrete about WHAT they are doing right now and, WHAT they are planing to do in order to satisfy the huge base that is raging right now.
These Blueposts SAY ABSOLUTLEY NOTHING, it's just
"please support us further, we hear you. but please refrain from insulting posts.
we appreciate your concern, and we take it serious."
We're at the same spot like before.
If anyone of you is satisfied by this, and thinks now "blizzard cares, we're really important, everything is fine", they got what they wanted, doing nothing just spill out some cute words.
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On June 01 2010 02:15 MasterFischer wrote:
Like I said numerous times, Blizzard has had a fair bit of trouble with b.net 2.0 in the makings, and so what.. it's to be expected.
Yeah it sure was hard getting all those awesome features in like uhhh.... wait... facebook integration?
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On June 01 2010 02:17 Lollersauce wrote:Show nested quote +On June 01 2010 02:15 MasterFischer wrote:
Like I said numerous times, Blizzard has had a fair bit of trouble with b.net 2.0 in the makings, and so what.. it's to be expected.
Yeah it sure was hard getting all those awesome features in like uhhh.... wait... facebook integration?
Yeah we may have lost of the best features of the original Bnet but by GOD we'll have our Facebook! lol
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We do have plans for chat channels. Currently we plan to do this feature in a patch after the game launches
They are killing me. Blizzard explained to us that they delayed the launch of the beta because they were finishing bnet 2.0 blablabla..
Specifically, we want to organize chat channels around users' interests so you know what types of conversations you are going to get into when you join a channel
I guess creating a channel to talk with your buddies on bnet is so 2002
Blizzard being shoked by the flames of internet is so fun.. They make the worst bnet 2.0 possible and then they troll the fans on their ITW "it's so 2002", "do you really want channels??!"
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If this happened with ANY OTHER game Blizzard was working on in the past they would have delayed it.
"When its ready" HA
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Happy birthday Archer ...I think the blue response can warrant its own thread though.
If this happened with ANY OTHER game Blizzard was working on in the past they would have delayed it.
Yeah? Does the community even want that? SC2 has already been delayed a year.
Also sales estimates state that blizzard would make 6 million copies in a summer release...and 2 million copies in a fall release.
Honestly as a gamer, I don't think I could stomach that loss in sales if it were happening to me.
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On June 01 2010 02:26 Half wrote:Happy birthday Archer ...I think the blue response can warrant its own thread though. Yeah? Does the community even want that? SC2 has already been delayed a year.
Should Blizzard continue to follow the strategy that has always made their games great?
Yes. Yes it should.
And thanks for the birthday wishes everyone. Its actually not till tomro but I guess in korea im 57.
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On June 01 2010 02:30 Archerofaiur wrote:
Should Blizzard continue to follow the strategy that has always made their games great?
Yes. Yes it should.
Oh? They're still releasing the game when it was ready. In fact, every game is released when its ready. Its semantically impossible for a game not to release when it was ready unless it was released by accident. Idfk how that happens lol.
The thing is that matters the judgment used to determine if it's "ready". Looking back, we can see tons of features that were entirely omitted from the games launch due to deadlines. Diablo 2 is the most visible of examples. Note the Chat gem? It was in lieu of a fully fledged auction house. Blizzard takes their deadlines very seriously. Blizzard North was closed in part by its inability for its management to meet deadlines. Starcraft 1 was sleighted to release with replays.
Now ask yourself. Is it good judgement to hold back a fully developed game to intergrate chat channels?
edit:
Wait what your 57? O.o. I thought you were a med school student.
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EPT
