How cheated is a Gaming Mouse with Macro ? - Page 13

“What about using the map hack in StarCraft, or a packet interceptor, or a macro to cast your spells faster, or just a swift kick to the shins of your opponent?”

One of the great things about playing to win is that it’s a path of self-improvement that can be measured. In playing to win, we have the cold, hard results of winning and losing to guide us along that path. I think it’s only useful to consider winning and losing in the context of formal competition such as tournaments. Kicking your opponents in the shins is outside the scope of the game, and is not legal in any reasonable tournament.

Likewise, any third party program obtained from an illegal warez site and installed as a hack into your game is also not going to be legal in any reasonable tournament. These things, though technically useful to those trying to win, are outside the path of continuous self-improvement that I’m talking about since they are outside of the rules of tournaments. You should use any tournament legal means to win. If you participate in some strange tournament where all players are allowed to use a map hack, then go for it. You’re playing a rather weird, nonstandard version of the game, though, which defeats the whole purpose of shedding extra rules so as to play the same game as everyone else. Any reasonable person would consider “no cheating from outside the game” to be part of the default rule set of any game.

On May 22 2010 21:23 MasterOfChaos wrote:
IMO any 1 to 1 remapping of keys is ok, any 1 to n (n>1) remapping is cheating.

On July 15 2010 02:53 Waphlez wrote:
I think people really don't understand how limited macros really are. I have both a keyboard and mouse capable of creating macros however I only create 1:1 macros (macro keys that simply emulate another key on the keyboard) because complex macros really don't give you an advantage, and I'll explain why.

Macros are not scripts. They emulate a set of keystrokes in an iterative checklist when the button is pressed. There is no logic behind them. The can't build supply depots to prevent being supply blocked, they can't automatically macro an army when you lose units because the user still has to know when to pump up his army. They also aren't nearly as flexible as simply learning to press the buttons yourself. You might be able to set up a macro for a certain build your doing, but what if the situation changes? You're stuck with that same macro.

The big reason why macros aren't a problem is that the biggest part of good macro is simply remembering when to do stuff, and to not get distracted or to lose focus. Players with bad macro are so because they forget to build up production, they forget to put workers in gas, they forget to keep training units during a fight, etc. Do any of you honestly believe that a bronze player will have silver or gold level macro because he's combining keystrokes into one key? Or that because a player doesn't have to press a button down for 300 extra ms he suddenly will take on idrA or TLO?

Or what about the player who's playing at 60+ frames per second at 1920x1200 resoultion fighting against someone playing at 20 frames per second at 1024x748 resolution because he doesn't have the money for a better computer? Is that person with the good computer a cheater because he spent the time and money to put together a fast computer? No. That's because we know having a good computer does not equate to being a good player, and that advantage isn't consider cheating.

This is so much like the Widescreen vs Standard 4:3 aspect ratio debate back when widescreen aspect ratios started to make their way into gaming. Just the same with that debate, that a player with a widescreen doesn't make them a good shot, a player who uses macros does not make them pros. The slight advantage doesn't even come close to being cheating (though I do get a good chuckle when people here compare using a programmable mouse the same as map hacking).

On July 15 2010 02:53 Waphlez wrote:
I think people really don't understand how limited macros really are. I have both a keyboard and mouse capable of creating macros however I only create 1:1 macros (macro keys that simply emulate another key on the keyboard) because complex macros really don't give you an advantage, and I'll explain why.

Macros are not scripts. They emulate a set of keystrokes in an iterative checklist when the button is pressed. There is no logic behind them. The can't build supply depots to prevent being supply blocked, they can't automatically macro an army when you lose units because the user still has to know when to pump up his army. They also aren't nearly as flexible as simply learning to press the buttons yourself. You might be able to set up a macro for a certain build your doing, but what if the situation changes? You're stuck with that same macro.

The big reason why macros aren't a problem is that the biggest part of good macro is simply remembering when to do stuff, and to not get distracted or to lose focus. Players with bad macro are so because they forget to build up production, they forget to put workers in gas, they forget to keep training units during a fight, etc. Do any of you honestly believe that a bronze player will have silver or gold level macro because he's combining keystrokes into one key? Or that because a player doesn't have to press a button down for 300 extra ms he suddenly will take on idrA or TLO?

Or what about the player who's playing at 60+ frames per second at 1920x1200 resoultion fighting against someone playing at 20 frames per second at 1024x748 resolution because he doesn't have the money for a better computer? Is that person with the good computer a cheater because he spent the time and money to put together a fast computer? No. That's because we know having a good computer does not equate to being a good player, and that advantage isn't consider cheating.

This is so much like the Widescreen vs Standard 4:3 aspect ratio debate back when widescreen aspect ratios started to make their way into gaming. Just the same with that debate, that a player with a widescreen doesn't make them a good shot, a player who uses macros does not make them pros. The slight advantage doesn't even come close to being cheating (though I do get a good chuckle when people here compare using a programmable mouse the same as map hacking).

On July 15 2010 19:27 Unentschieden wrote:
I´d actually like these kinds of scripts to be a big presence. Blizzard would have to reevaluate their UI and Gamedesign if predetermined macros are a significant factor in competitive games.
I mean if the above example is valid Blizzard would have to consider making Inject larvae autocast.

On July 15 2010 20:35 themeDusk wrote:
I've always wanted more macro options from blizzard. Like the ability to auto build at a production facility. For example, when activated will always produce a certain unit if Ive got the supply and money. Come to think of it, I've never tried to left click a unit in the buildings, but I doubt it exists. All the cool stuff is in the micro and strategies. I'm always thinking, there's so much more I can do with my units, but I have to spend time and apm building/teching/upgrading/expanding(part of the game of course). Out of the game macro options might bring the game to a higher level.

On July 15 2010 20:44 nyshak wrote:


If you take out the need to properly devote time and actions to macro everyone will micro better. The game will be worse because it will take less skill.