EPTThe Roach is whats wrong with SC2. - Page 15
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ColorsOfRainbow
Germany354 Posts
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Severedevil
United States4830 Posts
On April 05 2010 19:10 Badjas wrote: At the cost of health and minerals (and gas I guess). Building roaches from larva should not be too much different. But it allows for roaches to be built somewhat more nearby the battlefield, and it is a way to salvage badly damaged roaches a bit more quickly, if the regeneration rate is somewhat dropped. I mean this idea mostly as a buff to counter nerf, making the role of the roach go in a bit of a different direction. Don't violate the larva basis for zerg unit production, please. I think cutting the marauder is the best option. Everything about it just seems wrong. (125 hit points on an infantry man? "The C&C Rocket Guy" in starcraft? Rockets with a slow effect?) Marines should have plenty of DPS versus heavy targets until tier 3. (If they don't, you gave the heavy targets too damn much HP/armor... try fixing that first.) Also, now that I think about it, I'm surprised Reapers aren't Firebats With Jetpacks. And I'd bet that mech wouldn't be in such a mess if Hellions still had spider mines. (Or perhaps they could trade in concussion grenades or flamethrowers for an anti-vehicle rocket, as some folks suggested... now, vultures raid your base and kill your buildings! Leave the workers to the reapers.) | ||
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vrok
Sweden2541 Posts
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Marradron
Netherlands1586 Posts
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7mk
Germany10157 Posts
When they were first revealed it seemed like an interesting little early game harass unit cause of its regeneration, that is gonna suck against a real army, but I guess thats not what they were going for after all. I dont think its gonna happen but please, either remove the roach or nerf it hard/change its role and give us Zerg an interesting unit  | ||
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Angra
United States2652 Posts
As a side note, this thread also gives me a lot more hope that SC2 can turn into a really amazing game by release because of the fact that people are being able to start to pinpoint the problems with what is making SC2 not the game they want it to be, rather than not really being sure exactly what the problems are. Being able to pick out three units (roach, marauder, immortal) and one mechanic (high ground) as to what the biggest problems are will solve SO much if Blizzard can identify this also and rework it to something more dynamic and interesting by the time it's released. It makes me very hopeful for the future of SC2. | ||
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HTX
Germany265 Posts
To make it more interesting the updates for Roach 2.0 could be upgraded at tier 1 level and then zerg can go for surprising timing attacks. | ||
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Don Pedro
Switzerland14 Posts
i hate those marauder-ball vs roach-ball battles, where there is like a 30 marauders-ball focusing one unit, then retreating, firing again, retreating.. while the incoming roach-ball ist just a-moving into them and still has a chance to win. both units suck.. and anyway, what kind of zerg creature is the roach supposed to be? yeah, zerglings, hydras, mutas, ultras, lurkers.. they all kind of looked like zerg! but the roach? is just an ugly looking bug. ok that pretty sums it up: the roach is a bug. | ||
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Ronald_McD
Canada807 Posts
The Marauder, Roach and Immortal are all equally imbalanced. I actually find the Immortal to be the least overpowered out of all of these (and I'm not even a Protoss player). It at least holds a defined role as a hard counter to high damage units. I think it does a little too much damage considering it's also a tank for absorbing damage and relatively mobile. At least its supposed hard counters such as zerglings are actually a counter to it, much unlike the Marauder | ||
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Marradron
Netherlands1586 Posts
On April 05 2010 20:09 Ronald_McD wrote: I don't think this is true. Not specifically the roach anyways. The Marauder, Roach and Immortal are all equally imbalanced. I actually find the Immortal to be the least overpowered out of all of these (and I'm not even a Protoss player). It at least holds a defined role as a hard counter to high damage units. I think it does a little too much damage considering it's also a tank for absorbing damage and relatively mobile. At least its supposed hard counters such as zerglings are actually a counter to it, much unlike the Marauder The OP is actually claiming that. But the problem itselfs lies in the roach. The roach created the need for too strong marauders in T that then again created the immortal need. | ||
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Elite00fm
United States548 Posts
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NiGoL
1868 Posts
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violett
Germany143 Posts
with a nerf by like 20% of the roach, marauder and immortal, more different openings would be viable. but blizzards goal is to release the game in 2 month, the time would be to short to rebalance all the mu. | ||
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DeCoup
Australia1933 Posts
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ExoCorsair
United States48 Posts
but blizzards goal is to release the game in 2 month, the time would be to short to rebalance all the mu. I don't see the problem with this. SC2 doesn't have to be perfectly balanced at release. That's what patches are for, no? | ||
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SirNeb
United States243 Posts
On April 05 2010 20:55 violett wrote:but blizzards goal is to release the game in 2 month, the time would be to short to rebalance all the mu. that's kind of the problem with blizzard betas, they are putting out a beta that would have been a final product from another company. It's a good and bad thing. Good is that you don't have to deal with lots of bugs. Bad is that when there's something really wrong with balance/gameplay, they are not necessarily willing to change. At this stage of the game, they are really just trying to fine tune everything. They aren't looking to make drastic changes unless the "data" shows it being overpowered or whatever. I guess we'll see, getting a lot of attention is good if Blizzard does look at this site and maybe Dustin is willing to listen to the gamers. | ||
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Klockan3
Sweden2866 Posts
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iounas
409 Posts
On April 05 2010 21:00 SirNeb wrote: that's kind of the problem with blizzard betas, they are putting out a beta that would have been a final product from another company. It's a good and bad thing. Good is that you don't have to deal with lots of bugs. Bad is that when there's something really wrong with balance/gameplay, they are not necessarily willing to change. At this stage of the game, they are really just trying to fine tune everything. They aren't looking to make drastic changes unless the "data" shows it being overpowered or whatever. I guess we'll see, getting a lot of attention is good if Blizzard does look at this site and maybe Dustin is willing to listen to the gamers. Nobody is expecting for sc2 to be perfectly balanced when it comes out.. It takes years to fine tune stuff.. Op post is big deal.. I like his idea of roaches -50hp but have constant +4 regen.. And then balance marauders to that.. It would make roaches more interesting to micro in smaller numbers.. Marauders have slow so they are also interesting to micro.. Stalkers could use some weaker form of blink with current blink researchable so they have some interesting micro early game.. | ||
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IaniAniaN
Canada555 Posts
On April 05 2010 21:00 SirNeb wrote: that's kind of the problem with blizzard betas, they are putting out a beta that would have been a final product from another company. It's a good and bad thing. Good is that you don't have to deal with lots of bugs. Bad is that when there's something really wrong with balance/gameplay, they are not necessarily willing to change. At this stage of the game, they are really just trying to fine tune everything. They aren't looking to make drastic changes unless the "data" shows it being overpowered or whatever. I guess we'll see, getting a lot of attention is good if Blizzard does look at this site and maybe Dustin is willing to listen to the gamers. The problem is their data can't show disappointment and boredom in mus. =p | ||
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Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
I think Blizzard should decrease the Roaches' hp, like maybe from 145 to 115, 120... Also, it should definitely take 2 food. You just have to watch DIMAGA's game to see it. The guy doesn't even bother with anything else, he goes fe, prod two Queens and then masses up Roaches and crushes most of his P opponents. | ||
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